CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar

[dahj]

That's only guesswork at this point, though. There has been nothing official from CBS/Paramount indicating this is about anything else than copyright infringement. Or has there?

I doubt they'll make any kind of official comment the lawsuit.

So yes, it is guesswork, but it's very much obvious those are the reasons from the fact that no other fan production has been sued and all those infringe the same copyright, some to a much greater extent.

The only alternative theory presented is that Axanar is "so great" and "much better than any crap CBS and Paramount are making" and that they are "scared shittless by True Star Trek".

I'll let you decide which one of those is more likely...

 

[carlosp]

The lawsuit isn't about raising money for Ares Studios. If you read the lawsuit it's really just about using copyrighted elements that CBS and Paramount own.
--Neil

You may want to re-read the lawsuit because it is most definitely about money, at least in part. The key parts of a legal complaint are the Causes of Action – literally the reasons for the suit – and the Prayer for Relief, what the plaintiff is seeking. I've summarized and bolded each part of the complaint that deals with money.

1. Alec Peters knowingly infringed on the studios' copyrights.
2. He and the other defendants created and were about to produce the infringing films (Prelude... and Axanar), and then distribute them.
3. He and the other defendants show no signs of stopping creating infringing products unless the court issues an injunction preventing them from doing so.
4. Alec Peters supervised the other defendants in their direct infringements of the studios' copyrights.
5. The defendants enjoyed "a direct financial benefit" from infringing on the studios' intellectual property. [emphasis mine] Note the complaint does not mention "profit." This word is a red herring that Axanar and its supporters have been employing to give the impression that the production has done nothing wrong. The production's fundraising activities have translated into financial benefits (e.g., salaries, a studio infrastructure for publicly declared future for-profit activities) for both individuals associated with the production, and for Axanar Productions Inc., a registered for-profit corporation in California.
6. Alec Peters and the other defendants are in the middle of producing their infringing works.
7. Alec Peters and the other defendants believe they are entitled to "create, distribute, market, advertise, promote, sell or offer for sale derivative [Star Trek] works." [emphasis mine]

So, yes, the infringement is at the center of the lawsuit, but because there is money associated with the infringing activities; that's why the suit seeks financial compensation (damages) for the harm ensuing from the infringement. Note the relief being sought by lawsuit:

1. A judgment declaring Alec and the other defendants definitely infringed on the studios' copyright.
2. Statutory damages, $150,000 per infringement. This is the punishment you think CBS is asking for simply because Axanar infringed on their copyrights. But what's important is the fact that the studios are also seeking --
3. Actual damages. This is key, because it shows that the studios believe Axanar's infringing activities have caused actual fiscal harm to their exclusive right to make money from Star Trek. So, yes, this lawsuit is most definitely about money because Axanar created multiple and ongoing revenue streams that generated more than a million dollars (and aims to raise hundreds of thousands more), which contributes to the studios' urgency for an injunction. Wonder why the studios haven't gone after the other fan films? They haven't banked money on that scale; unlike Axanar, there's no money in the other fan films for CBS to go after.
4. Attorneys' fees. If Axanar loses this case, it – and all the other defendants, which include the 20 to-be-named other people who also engaged in infringing activities under Alec Peters' supervision — are all liable for the legal fees the studios pile up in defending their copyrights. This, and all the defendants' liability for statutory and actual damages, provides a lot of leverage the studios are likely to bring to bear against each defendant, making more than a few likely to be willing to testify against Axanar. Remember, while Alec Peters has secured pro bono representation in this case, the other defendants will have to pay for their own lawyers.

One final note: While most people have been focusing on what the suit calls "the Axanar Works" (i.e., Prelude and Axanar itself), it's quite likely CBS also has issues with all the ancillary products Axanar has created (e.g., model ships, artwork, patches, coffee), which the suit calls "any works derived or copied from the Star Trek copyrighted works." Contributors to Axanar's various crowdfunding campaigns may be disappointed – contrary to Alec Peters' assurance the other day – to discover that the perks they paid for may be covered by the injunction or the judgment against Axanar in this case.

 

[jespah]

You may want to re-read the lawsuit because it is most definitely about money, at least in part. The key parts of a legal complaint are the Causes of Action – literally the reasons for the suit – and the Prayer for Relief, what the plaintiff is seeking. I've summarized and bolded each part of the complaint that deals with money.
... 5. The defendants enjoyed "a direct financial benefit" from infringing on the studios' intellectual property. [emphasis mine] Note the complaint does not mention "profit." This word is a red herring that Axanar and its supporters have been employing to give the impression that the production has done nothing wrong. The production's fundraising activities have translated into financial benefits (e.g., salaries, a studio infrastructure for publicly declared future for-profit activities) for both individuals associated with the production, and for Axanar Productions Inc., a registered for-profit corporation in California.

....
...4. Attorneys' fees. If Axanar loses this case, it – and all the other defendants, which include the 20 to-be-named other people who also engaged in infringing activities under Alec Peters' supervision — are all liable for the legal fees the studios pile up in defending their copyrights. This, and all the defendants' liability for statutory and actual damages, provides a lot of leverage the studios are likely to bring to bear against each defendant, making more than a few likely to be willing to testify against Axanar. Remember, while Alec Peters has secured pro bono representation in this case, the other defendants will have to pay for their own lawyers.
One final note: While most people have been focusing on what the suit calls "the Axanar Works" (i.e., Prelude and Axanar itself), it's quite likely CBS also has issues with all the ancillary products Axanar has created (e.g., model ships, artwork, patches, coffee), which the suit calls "any works derived or copied from the Star Trek copyrighted works." Contributors to Axanar's various crowdfunding campaigns may be disappointed – contrary to Alec Peters' assurance the other day – to discover that the perks they paid for may be covered by the injunction or the judgment against Axanar in this case.

I hope I formatted that coherently.

These are some of the bigger points, I feel.

Once again - profit is NOT an element of this cause of action or of this complaint and prayer for relief. It's 'direct financial benefit'. Yes, that means salaries, no matter what their size, and even if they were deferred. It may or may not also mean convention attendance and travel, and all the extras that accompany conventions (e. g. paying for better seats and the like). Of course these are questions for the trier of fact.

Attorneys' fees on the Loeb & Loeb side have got to already be pretty high.

The attendant derivative works are the ways some of the Doe defendants will be identified. And yes, they should get their own attorneys.

Truly, anyone who feels they might be named should be consulting with legal counsel, even if they just grab a lawyer who doesn't practice in this area so they can get started. The lawyer can always transfer the matter to another firm with the client's permission, but this move would give the potential client a means of connecting to the right kind of counsel. I say this not as 'legal advice' (I am not the lawyer of anyone involved in this matter; representation should not be inferred in the slightest) but as friendly advice. There are differing interests here.

I urge the potential Doe defendants to seek representation and I hope many of them end up not needing it.

 

[stampersand]

I would say: don't take a salary, don't raise a million bucks, don't say you are making a professional feature length movie, don't sell merchandise that has CBS IP on it. Do it as cheaply as you can. It's about making something you love, not about competing with CBS and Paramount.

Also, don't make a lot of haughty-sounding public statements that could be interpreted as being superior to official productions or attacks on the IP holder or creators of the official productions.

 

[Albinator]

We can speculate all day about what this lawsuit is really about (and we have for 300+ pages) but it's all just speculation until CBS/Paramount talk further about it, which they probably won't.

If I were to put a wager on it, i'd say it's about ALL OF THE ABOVE. Had they only done one of these many infractions, maybe they'd have been given a pass. As many have pointed out other fan productions have crossed a line here or there, but it was always ONE line, and they only slightly crossed it.

When Axanar crossed all of these different lines and went a mile past each one of them, CBS/Paramount had little choice but to say "too far."

 

[Smoked Salmon]

So it seems Peters has threatened to sue this site's very on Squiggy....

 

[Squiggy]

Sometimes the bullies win.

 

[HMS Ark Royal]

So it seems Peters has threatened to sue this site's very on Squiggy....

Where now? Have I missed something?

 

[F. King Daniel]

They might bring down a tiny Facebook group, but something tells me they won't be as successful against CBS and Paramount, whose pockets are infinitely deeper.

 

[Jedi_Master]

Hello I am the guy who design the Titan for Simon & Schuster.

Sean I love the Titan design. It was extremely well done. Kudos to you! @Titan Designer

@Squiggy - Thanks for the most fun I have had on the Internet since I was a teenager and discovered... well... things.

 

[Smoked Salmon]

Where now? Have I missed something?

He received a threat from Peters' lawyers to shut down I Stand with CBS

 

[HMS Ark Royal]

He received a threat from Peters' lawyers to shut down I Stand with CBS

I see - has Peters had the Stand with Axanar group shut down also?

 

[Tom]

So it seems Peters has threatened to sue this site's very on Squiggy....

Please tell me you guys are not giving in to threats

As for the profit argument, CBS's lawyers will use that as part of there case to show intent. They will use what ever ammo they can to win the case. The for profit studio will most definitely be part of that.

As for the possible 'Doe Defendants', get the fuck out now! Staying attached to Axanar post-lawsuit is only going to hurt your case going forward. Think of your families and your financial well being. friendship is important, but use some common sense. This is not you helping Kirk stealing the Enterprise to save Spock, this is the real world.

 

[steam235]

I knew when I went to bed last night that the group would be ending. The posts last night were over the line of decency. But they were still the kind of thing that happens online. If I had a tinfoil hat on I would marvel at how perfectly they crossed the line so that Alec would have some leverage to have it shut down.

 

[SuperSpaceMan]

If someone posted my god kids address, on a group of people that admittedly didn't like me, I would probably exert every effort at my disposal to shut the group down, too.

I am not going to say, that was the point of that particular post (To expose people Peters' personally cared about) but unnecessarily people who have very little to do with the issue at hand were brought into the mix.

 

[Jedi_Master]

If someone posted my god kids address, on a group of people that admittedly didn't like me, I would probably exert every effort at my disposal to shut the group down, too.

I am not going to say, that was the point of that particular post (To expose people Peters' personally cared about) but unnecessarily people who have very little to do with the issue at hand were brought into the mix.

Amen. That was a ridiculous post. I think that @Squiggy made the right choice, as for whatever reason the fan film community seems to draw in craziest people at the fringes and the amount of old grudges, anger, perceived slights, and misremembered arguments leads to really inappropriate behavior.

 

[SuperSpaceMan]

Amen. That was a ridiculous post. I think that @Squiggy made the right choice, as for whatever reason the fan film community seems to draw in craziest people at the fringes and the amount of old grudges, anger, perceived slights, and misremembered arguments leads to really inappropriate behavior.

I don't think that it was necessarily a ridiculous post, per say... it asked a couple relevant questions, but it also exposed something that couldn't be unexposed, and that is unfortunate.

 

[Jedi_Master]

I don't think that it was necessarily a ridiculous post, per say... it asked a couple relevant questions, but it also exposed something that couldn't be unexposed, and that is unfortunate.

Here's the thing with research. If you find something relevant to the discussion (which I would argue it wasn't) be sure to present the information in a way that doesn't make you or anyone else look like a crazy stalker. Publicly posting the address or even general location of a private home (even if it was owned by a corporation) just hours after the nastiness has begun to ramp up was a poor choice at best.

 

[Tom]

Oh I did not know his god kids were pulled into this. Yes, those types of posts are unacceptable. The group should be about discussing the merits of the situation at hand, not personal attacks on innocents.

 

[Jam3s1701]

I don't think that it was necessarily a ridiculous post, per say... it asked a couple relevant questions, but it also exposed something that couldn't be unexposed, and that is unfortunate.

ok what happened when I went to bed last post was the admin asking for a review to be removed what happened after that?