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CBS/Paramount sues to stop Axanar

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Even his Marines didn't donate? That probably created some panic somewhere.
I know! This is something I'm still puzzling over: Where were the supporter/advocates of this production? Why were there no donations at all?

Even I knew about this crowdfund. And I'm 'always' 30 to 40 steps behind everyone everywhere regarding anything that happens in 'this whole thing'.
 
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They live in a walled garden. They have been trained to consider anything speaking Axanar's name which is not approved is the enemy. The posting apparently was kept a secret from Alec, which probably meant it wasn't publicized on the Axanar site. Were they ever told?
 
In the event we are not able to reach a negotiated accommodation with the plaintiffs, we are prepared to pursue our fair use argument through the courts in an attempt to clearly identify what we can and cannot do when we resume production of Axanar.



"when"?
 
AP is playing the long game here. If the lawyers abandon him for the appeal, he hopes to sucker libertarian and copyright reform groups into taking up his cause.

The longer he can drag this out, the longer he is "obliged" to caretake the arguably fan-or-c/p-owned studio. For profit and career building, of course.
 
They live in a walled garden. They have been trained to consider anything speaking Axanar's name which is not approved is the enemy. The posting apparently was kept a secret from Alec, which probably meant it wasn't publicized on the Axanar site. Were they ever told?
Your argument is well reasoned because word of mouth would play some part in this. But the Walled Garden has not shown itself to be interested in filtering out things like this that are unabashedly supportive of the production/defendant. So I keep returning to even I knew about it. That how could not even one friend of the defendant or not even one supporter/advocate of the production & defendant have not known about this crowdfund campaign lonnng before me? Then not passed on the information to even one of all the supporter/advocate places on the Internet? Which would have started the movement for donating. The fund site was up for five or six days. Which correctly or erroneously leads my thoughts to consider there is a major shift in numbers of supporter/advocates.

These are rhetorical questions of course, which will find no answer that can be substantiated.
 
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Your argument is well reasoned and word of mouth could play some part in this. But the Walled Garden has not shown itself to be strong enough to filter out things like this that are unabashedly supportive of the production/defendant. So I keep returning to even I knew about it. So how could no friend of the defendant or supporter/advocate of the production & defendant not known about it lonnng before me, Passing on the information in all the supporter/advocate places and started the movement for donating? Which correctly or erroneously leads my thoughts to consider there is a major shift in numbers of supporter/advocates.

That's a rhetorical question of course, which will find no substantiated answer.

There is an answer. Most of the donors have moved on. Most of the fanboys want something for free.
 
A reasonable speculation. So taking this a step further there can (& I suspect 'will') still be significant numbers of supporter/advocates who will continue to be vocally supportive, even Loudly supportive. But the numbers of supporter/advocates who follow through with financial support may be diminishing.

Mr. Lane might address the zero donations from his own POV in one of his upcoming writings. That would be interesting.
 
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Did someone say, "Cash"?

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Neil

@Indysolo, you are a national treasure.
 
I know! This is something I'm still puzzling over: Where were the supporter/advocates of this production? Why were there no donations at all?
Hasn't Peters been insisting over the past couple of days that he's not out of money? Maybe the "marines" thought that Lane had acted without authority based on that.
 
^^^That is certainly not inconceivable.


Wait. The defendant has been insisting over the last couple of days that he's not out of money? I hadn't heard about that.
 
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Alec Peters hasn't said anything definitive about the money, and he prefers to keep it that way. The closes he's gotten is saying that an accountant's review of Axanar's expenses absolves him of inappropriate spending.

Of course, that directly contradicts what his lawyer told the court, that the financial information turned over in discovery had NOT been reviewed by an accountant and that it needed to be held confidential because Evil People would use the information to "bring down Alec."
 
Let's return to LFIM's statement that "we are prepared to pursue our fair use argument through the courts in an attempt to clearly identify what we can and cannot do when we resume production of Axanar." It's still not entirely clear to me exactly what his fair use argument entails beyond, "Anything a fan does should be considered 'fair use.'" He basically wants the judge to rewrite copyright law to accommodate his project.

Let's go back to Paramount Pictures Corp. v. Carol Publishing, which also involved a fan who decided to publish his own unauthorized derivative "Star Trek" work, in that case a book. Here's how the judge disposed of the defendant's attempted fair use defense:

1. The Carol Publishing court noted the author "was motivated, to a large extent, by a genuine desire to help others to understand the idiosyncracies of the typical Trekker," specifically his wife. The judge said this motive provided a "couterbalance" to the commercial interests in producing a book. That said, the real problem, according to the judge, was not the book's commercial or noncommercial nature, but rather the fact it was not a "transformative" work. Fair use applies to works that criticize, mock, or parody. But the court noted "it would be nonsensical to think that a Trekker would author a book in which the main point is to mock Star Trek."

2. The defendants argued their copying--which consisted primarily of reproducing summaries of "Star Trek" episodes--was "necessary to accomplish the book's purpose of explaining the appeal of Star Trek to its fans." The court said that was "factually and legally inaccurate." The book "explains, not simply the appeal of Star Trek, but the story of Star Trek."

3. The defendants argued their book differed "from any own presently licensed by Paramount." The judge said that made "no difference." The book was a "potential substitute" for any similar product that Paramount might offer in the future.

4. The defendants argued that the "lack of legal action against other infringing" works demonstrates their book "will not damage a potential market." The court said that was "simply irrelevant."

All of these arguments mirror those advances by AP and his associates. And I see no reason the judge here will take them any more seriously than the court in Carol Publishing did.
 
Let's return to LFIM's statement that "we are prepared to pursue our fair use argument through the courts in an attempt to clearly identify what we can and cannot do when we resume production of Axanar." It's still not entirely clear to me exactly what his fair use argument entails beyond, "Anything a fan does should be considered 'fair use.'" He basically wants the judge to rewrite copyright law to accommodate his project.
It's odd, but from his comments yesterday it seems apparent that for some reason Peters seems to believe that if CBS has no plans to tell the story of Garth/Axanar, then it is freely available under "fair use".
 
It's odd, but from his comments yesterday it seems apparent that for some reason Peters seems to believe that if CBS has no plans to tell the story of Garth/Axanar, then it is freely available under "fair use".
First, the Axanar story has been told before in numerous licensed works, most notably the 2003 novel Garth of Izar. An account of the battle also appears in David A. Goodman's books, Federation: The First 150 Years and The Autobiography of James T. Kirk. There's also the FASA role playing games that Peters admits was the basis for his story.

Second, as the Carol Publishing court explained, even if AP's proposed Axanar film "differs from any work presently licensed by" CBS and Paramount that "makes no difference" with respect to fair use. "A person interested in learning about the fictional history of Star Trek now must purchase a product licensed by" CBS and Paramount. Accordingly, any "self-avowed substitute for other [CBS/Paramount] licensed products adversely impacts the market for derivative works."
 
Finally. Not speaking 'for' Trekdom, not speaking 'for' Fans in toto, not speaking 'for' Donors in toto. But instead and accurately speaking for "the expectations of thousands of fans and donors". Which I do not dispute or doubt. The thousands of fans and donors who do still share his visional point of view on 'this whole thing'.

Thank you, Mr. Peters [Bawden]. Thank you. One of whom I am not but that's beside my point. NA anymore as this was addressed to Mr. Peters (see below) This is the first time you did not presume to speak for all of us.... not me, not All Star Trek Fans, not All fans who liked Prelude, not all of us who have been your Donors at one time or another (me). That means a lot to me.
:beer:



EDIT: November 19, 2016
Well..... fudge. It is NOT Mr. Peters who said that. It was Mike Bawden.

Emily Litella: "Never mind"
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