Well, all that suggests is that Vulcans might have been seeded, or uplifted, or somehow altered by Sargon's people half a million years ago. That really doesn't suggest that they had warp drive technology for all that time.
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Well, all that suggests is that Vulcans might have been seeded, or uplifted, or somehow altered by Sargon's people half a million years ago. That really doesn't suggest that they had warp drive technology for all that time.
I didn't think so either. A few thousand years is what seems the most likely.
What I thought Sargon meant with all that pompous flowery talk is that his people made a colony on Vulcan, and that eventually went native and became the Vulcans. Of course it only takes 20 thousand years for all evidence of a civilization to vanish, so the Vulcans could have been space faring, devolved to barbarism, got back civilization again and then lost it again and again and again, which is why embracing logic was such a special idea, because in theory it put an end to that cycle of destruction, amnesia and rebirth they were so good at.
Spock called 1/2 a million years "prehistory" not dinosaur times, which suggests that Vulcans then looked a lot like Vulcans now and must be from somewhere entirely else, which hints that Sargon's lot had not poured barrels of space jizz into the oceans hoping that billions of years later that those building blocks... Well it was only 500 millennia wasn't it, which is the tenth of the time necessary for a single celled life form would need to transform into a tool using humanoid.
Do we count our history starting from Greece and Rome, or from Italy and the Renaissance? The Dark Ages should really be a border between two sets of histories of man, since on either side of that border the dominant cultures were very different. If the dark ages had lasted another 500 years, maybe we would have no idea about the Roman Empire at it's Height?
(Yes, the Eastern Roman Empire was around till the 14th century when the Turk sacked Constantinople, it was only the Western Roman Empire that fell to the Goth in the 4th century. Hush.)
Spock called 1/2 a million years "prehistory" not dinosaur times, which suggests that Vulcans then looked a lot like Vulcans now and must be from somewhere entirely else, which hints that Sargon's lot had not poured barrels of space jizz into the oceans hoping that billions of years later that those building blocks... Well it was only 500 millennia wasn't it, which is the tenth of the time necessary for a single celled life form would need to transform into a tool using humanoid.
Do we count our history starting from Greece and Rome, or from Italy and the Renaissance? The Dark Ages should really be a border between two sets of histories of man, since on either side of that border the dominant cultures were very different. If the dark ages had lasted another 500 years, maybe we would have no idea about the Roman Empire at it's Height?
(Yes, the Eastern Roman Empire was around till the 14th century when the Turk sacked Constantinople, it was only the Western Roman Empire that fell to the Goth in the 4th century. Hush.)
Well, it only makes sense that the newfangled federation would use the best technologies at its disposal.
What I would like to know is how much of the technological progress between 2161 and, say, 2380, is 'indigenous', i.e. thanks to new research done by existing federation members, and how much of it is thanks to new members being admitted to the federation, bringing new 'alien' technology along with them.
What I thought Sargon meant with all that pompous flowery talk is that his people made a colony on Vulcan, and that eventually went native and became the Vulcans. Of course it only takes 20 thousand years for all evidence of a civilization to vanish, so the Vulcans could have been space faring, devolved to barbarism, got back civilization again and then lost it again and again and again, which is why embracing logic was such a special idea, because in theory it put an end to that cycle of destruction, amnesia and rebirth they were so good at.
Spock called 1/2 a million years "prehistory" not dinosaur times, which suggests that Vulcans then looked a lot like Vulcans now and must be from somewhere entirely else, which hints that Sargon's lot had not poured barrels of space jizz into the oceans hoping that billions of years later that those building blocks... Well it was only 500 millennia wasn't it, which is the tenth of the time necessary for a single celled life form would need to transform into a tool using humanoid.
Do we count our history starting from Greece and Rome, or from Italy and the Renaissance? The Dark Ages should really be a border between two sets of histories of man, since on either side of that border the dominant cultures were very different. If the dark ages had lasted another 500 years, maybe we would have no idea about the Roman Empire at it's Height?
(Yes, the Eastern Roman Empire was around till the 14th century when the Turk sacked Constantinople, it was only the Western Roman Empire that fell to the Goth in the 4th century. Hush.)
Five thousand years isn't much, yet it was enough to turn Spock into a brute that couldn't stand McCoy's cracks anymore. It seems that half a million years is pushing it.
Logic is not a given. All Vulcans are born murderous brutes that want to burn cities down if they can't get their way.
Logic is something that is done to their kids, like circumcision.
It doesn't matter how many times you circumcise every consecutive male in a lineage, evolution is not going to take a hint and do it for you. Babies are not going to eject from their womb precircumised.
Besides evolution can't exert pressure on a civil society that takes care of it's weak, or/and allows the weak to breed with the strong.
Any Vulcan child not raised with logic will be a seething, scheming wrath driven Romulan.
It's not a question of 5000 years, it's question of parents brain washing children.
Logic is something that is done to their kids, like circumcision.
It doesn't matter how many times you circumcise every consecutive male in a lineage, evolution is not going to take a hint and do it for you. Babies are not going to eject from their womb precircumised.
Besides evolution can't exert pressure on a civil society that takes care of it's weak, or/and allows the weak to breed with the strong.
Any Vulcan child not raised with logic will be a seething, scheming wrath driven Romulan.
It's not a question of 5000 years, it's question of parents brain washing children.
I am sorry but in the episode there are two things that make Spock the way he is: First he's not been atavachroned specifically to that time period and therefore was physically affected by his moving there.
Second, the time period was 5000 years which was enough to make him regress significantly in the evolution of his species.
The lack of use of the atavachron was deadly in the long run.
All our Yesterdays and Return to Tomorrow were different episodes.
Of course you know that, but a little punctuation will let me know what episode we are up to.
In All our Yesterdays Mariette Hartley is a dream, but if living in the past really did turn him into a thug, it's not his sex drive that should be proof of that, it should have been Spock smacking her with the back of his fist for lying to him.
In Stargate, they have what is called Correlative updates for the massive network of Stargates. The network receives/sends periodical software patches and updates in navigational oddities when necessary to make sure that health and saftey criteria are met.
Spock was able to sense/emotionally recognize V'Ger, and was drawn by his Fiancée from light years away to deal to their 7 year itch.
Vulcan Telepthy although not as talky as other species' extra sensoty perception has intragalactic range and endurance.
If Spock is always on some subconscious level connected to every other Vulcan and the gestlat of Vulcan souls alive and katrfied on the home world, and that massive hive mind dictates the zenith of Vulcan behaviour, then that Collecive is sending out correlative updates to every other other Vulcan in the Galaxy making sure that they are all the best that they can be.
Which is one explanation for the ridiculousness that we saw in All our Yesterdays.
"Suddenly I like meat! Before meat would have killed me but now I love it! Mmmm!"
Weird huh?
Of course you know that, but a little punctuation will let me know what episode we are up to.
In All our Yesterdays Mariette Hartley is a dream, but if living in the past really did turn him into a thug, it's not his sex drive that should be proof of that, it should have been Spock smacking her with the back of his fist for lying to him.
In Stargate, they have what is called Correlative updates for the massive network of Stargates. The network receives/sends periodical software patches and updates in navigational oddities when necessary to make sure that health and saftey criteria are met.
Spock was able to sense/emotionally recognize V'Ger, and was drawn by his Fiancée from light years away to deal to their 7 year itch.
Vulcan Telepthy although not as talky as other species' extra sensoty perception has intragalactic range and endurance.
If Spock is always on some subconscious level connected to every other Vulcan and the gestlat of Vulcan souls alive and katrfied on the home world, and that massive hive mind dictates the zenith of Vulcan behaviour, then that Collecive is sending out correlative updates to every other other Vulcan in the Galaxy making sure that they are all the best that they can be.
Which is one explanation for the ridiculousness that we saw in All our Yesterdays.
"Suddenly I like meat! Before meat would have killed me but now I love it! Mmmm!"
Weird huh?
I am sorry but Vulcans have been known to eat meat on occasion without any side effects. (cf. Fusion)
We realize that Spock has gone off the deep end when he threatens McCoy for one of his sarcasms. He's definitely no longer himself but a devolved (and not that annoying neologism data made up in Genesis) version of himself.
But he's nowhere as bad as Romulan Tuvok who tries to push his way through a forcefield in Meld.
...
That meat will kill me, is from Harlan Ellison's original script of City of the Edge of Tomorrow that was adapted into a comic book recently, so of course no one vetted it for continuity before letting it go to print.
...
That meat will kill me, is from Harlan Ellison's original script of City of the Edge of Tomorrow that was adapted into a comic book recently, so of course no one vetted it for continuity before letting it go to print.
Tuvok got that way by melding with a psychopath, he's lucky he was able to put humpty-dumpty back together again after that. Usually, damage to the higher brain functions is nearly impossible to reverse.
Not for the Voyager Doc and 24th century medical technology!
Well, he was able to separate Tuvix into Tuvok and Neelix, when you can do that, you can do anything, especially the worst.Not for the Voyager Doc and 24th century medical technology!
Yes, Tuvok got that way when the Doctor zapped Tuvok's brain during a medical procedure.
1. If you could weaponize that?
2. Was the tech based on Trellium D?
1. If you could weaponize that?
2. Was the tech based on Trellium D?
You forgot that one of the side effects of Trellium D is that it makes Vulcans walk like claymation.
Oh, for an overdose sure, but that junkie T'Pol was shooting up for months and no one noticed.
Medicinal Trellium is probably Trellium E anyway.
Medicinal Trellium is probably Trellium E anyway.
She wasn't so much homicidal though as she was crying all the time... "I don't want you to die!! Boo-hoo!!!"
She was obviously cutting her Trellium with baby laxatives.
The real question is why was Voyager lugging around the galaxy a kings ransom in baby laxatives?
The real question is why was Voyager lugging around the galaxy a kings ransom in baby laxatives?
Which brings up an interesting question in itself. Suppose you have no information at all about a technology, except the knowledge that it (transporters, warp 5) is possible because someone else has done it.
Let's say you have been witnessing a beamout of a vulcan from your location and that is all. You've never been able to see the transporters, or obtain any other information about it.
Still, you manage to invent the technology. How much lesser is your achievement as 'second inventor' than the achievement of the 'absolute inventor'?
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