Captain America... Spoilers

[Thrall]

^Scotty the Adulterer is about the first interesting thing ever to happen to the character.

I think a few people forget how Jean was behaving when it started, too.

Go read Dark Phoenix Saga, The Simonson's X-Factor run, or X-Cutioners Song and get back to me on that, fanboy.

Well, at least they'll bring back Classic Cap..... I'm tired of the "new" Captain America... You know, the one who uses a gun, totally defeating the entire purpose of a Superhero in the first place?

Bucky is awful, awful, awful and is a perfect representation of what is wrong with the creative mentality over at Marvel. Or should I say lack there of. If I wanted a second-rate Cable clone, I would have read X-Man.

 

[CaptainCanada]

Bucky is awful, awful, awful and is a perfect representation of what is wrong with the creative mentality over at Marvel. Or should I say lack there of. If I wanted a second-rate Cable clone, I would have read X-Man.

Have you actually read any of his stories? He's nothing like Cable.

Anyway, not surprised. Brubaker's run has been one big series of successes, so I expect his Reborn miniseries will be no different (and I'll be interested to see Hitch working with someone other than Millar for the first time since, er, I guess The Authority).

Well, at least they'll bring back Classic Cap..... I'm tired of the "new" Captain America... You know, the one who uses a gun, totally defeating the entire purpose of a Superhero in the first place?

Plenty of superheroes use firearms; heck, Cap himself has in the past (particularly the Golden Age).

And Bucky hardly ever uses the gun, in any event; and when he has, he's shot to wound.

 

[Thrall]

Have you actually read any of his stories? He's nothing like Cable.

He's a gritty anti-hero with a robot arm and a gun. The only difference I saw was that his gun isn't as big and he's more angry-emo then Hayden Christenson.

 

[CaptainCanada]

Have you actually read any of his stories? He's nothing like Cable.

He's a gritty anti-hero with a robot arm and a gun. The only difference I saw was that his gun isn't as big and he's more angry-emo then Hayden Christenson.

He's not an anti-hero. After recovering from his experiences as the Winter Soldier, New Cap has been determinedly trying to be a Steve-style superhero.

 

[Thrall]

Have you actually read any of his stories? He's nothing like Cable.

He's a gritty anti-hero with a robot arm and a gun. The only difference I saw was that his gun isn't as big and he's more angry-emo then Hayden Christenson.

He's not an anti-hero. After recovering from his experiences as the Winter Soldier, New Cap has been determinedly trying to be a Steve-style superhero.

Don't kid yourself. He was supposed to be the hip, edgy Captain America. Armed with a dark and tortured past - not mention emo-hair - he'd make the world safe for Twilight fans everywhere. Oh, and something about freedom and justice in there somewhere too.

Kind of reminds me of when they killed off Optimus Prime and tried to replace him with a hip, cool counterpart. Bucky's probably going to be just as well remembered as Ronemus Prime(I think that's what his name is? was?). You can't improve on a classic and Bucky proved that. I'm looking forward to when he's killed off again.

 

[CaptainCanada]

Don't kid yourself. He was supposed to be the hip, edgy Captain America. Armed with a dark and tortured past - not mention emo-hair - he'd make the world safe for Twilight fans everywhere.

Er, no.

Also, he got a hair cut like three years ago.

I'm looking forward to when he's killed off again.

Doubtful, given how popular he is; fans like him and creators like using him now that he's been brought back. Unless Brubaker has it as an endgame of his story (possible, but he's a big Bucky fan, so I tend to doubt it), I expect him to be a fixture of Cap's supporting cast (and Steve really needs as much supporting cast as he can get).

 

[Thrall]

.

Also, he got a hair cut like three years ago.

Fair enough. That would be when I gave up on the series. All I've heard since has made me nothing but glad I did.

Doubtful, given how popular he is; fans like him and creators like using him now that he's been brought back. Unless Brubaker has it as an endgame of his story (possible, but he's a big Bucky fan, so I tend to doubt it), I expect him to be a fixture of Cap's supporting cast (and Steve really needs as much supporting cast as he can get).

Well, yeah, they would keep him around. He brought in a lot of the glitter vamps who would never read a Captain America book normally.

 

[the Dagman]

I remember when they killed him off in Cap #25 most fans, myself included, were predicting Steve Rogers would return at or around issue #50. That issue hit the stands last month. We all predicted it and were right, within a small margin of error. We win! Consider yourselves to all to be no-prized.

 

[Newski]

Well, at least they'll bring back Classic Cap..... I'm tired of the "new" Captain America... You know, the one who uses a gun, totally defeating the entire purpose of a Superhero in the first place?

Plenty of superheroes use firearms; heck, Cap himself has in the past (particularly the Golden Age).

And Bucky hardly ever uses the gun, in any event; and when he has, he's shot to wound.

That was then. When they brought back Steve Rogers, they brought him back as the character we know and love today.

Other heroes use guns. But that's besides the point. This is Captain America. The reason he doesn't use a gun is because he is a man at his peak, using his wits against the enemies of Freedom, Liberty, and Democracy (He's loyal to his country's ideals more than the country, which is why I like him). Using a gun has brought him down to the level of the common soldier.

Don't kid yourself. He was supposed to be the hip, edgy Captain America. Armed with a dark and tortured past - not mention emo-hair - he'd make the world safe for Twilight fans everywhere. Oh, and something about freedom and justice in there somewhere too.

Thrall, I like you..... This is exactly what they were going for... Trying to make a new edgy anti hero.... Because hey, that sells.... How about they create a character not based on the archetypes, and let the character develop? Anyway, while we are talking about the anti heroes....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9yEgwqlyX20

 

[Bishbot]

Kind of reminds me of when they killed off Optimus Prime and tried to replace him with a hip, cool counterpart. Bucky's probably going to be just as well remembered as Ronemus Prime(I think that's what his name is? was?). You can't improve on a classic and Bucky proved that. I'm looking forward to when he's killed off again.

From a grown-up perspectve, RODimus Prime is actually a surprisingly awesome character, even if he does turn into a futuristic winnebago for some reason.

 

[RJDiogenes]

I wonder if there will ever be a day when I'll have an interest in reading Marvel again.

There should be a website that keeps a scorecard of who's dead and who's alive this week. Are Janet van Dyne and Sue Richards still dead? Bill Foster? What about Batman? And Sue Dibny?

 

[CaptainCanada]

Are Janet van Dyne and Sue Richards still dead? Bill Foster? What about Batman? And Sue Dibny?

Jan's dead (she recently showed up in iHerc in casino-Hell gambling for a resurrection.). Sue was never dead. The ultra-minor Bill Foster remains dead.

Those latter two are DC; the former was never dead either, he's in a cycle of death and rebirth (though nobody else knows that at the moment).

 

[The Evil Dead]

So now Bruce Wayne is the only superhero who is dead that we are waiting to return?

 

[DarthPipes]

I always liked Steve Rogers and his Captain America is important. But I like Captain America under Bucky better.

 

[Mr Light]

I just bought the first two trades of "Death of Cap", do I need to read the four trades that proceeded it? That would be #1-24. I also got "Fallen Son", should I read that before the first Death trade or concurrently with it?

 

[Dream]

Does the new Cap still look like this?

 

[Mike Farley]

*sigh* Everytime the talk turns to Cap, someone has to dredge up that old picture. Can we please leave in in the 90's where it belongs?

So now Bruce Wayne is the only superhero who is dead that we are waiting to return?

Bruce Wayne is not dead. He didn't die in RIP and he didn't die in FINAL CRISIS.

 

[Guy Gardener]

I'm kinda peeved that Bucky hasn't really done anything super extreme in the last two years?

What is his legacy?

 

[Broccoli]

Does the new Cap still look like this?

That's not Captain America.

It's Major Boobage!

 

[Thestral]

^Scotty the Adulterer is about the first interesting thing ever to happen to the character.

I think a few people forget how Jean was behaving when it started, too.

You do realize that "Scotty the Adulterer" is an (unfortunate) history of his, right? I mean, I love Cyclops, but it's kinda hard to ignore the fact that he has an unhappy history with telepaths. It sucks, because otherwise Slim is pretty much a paragon of virtue, but not an annoying paladin-type.

"I LOOVE you Madeline, let's get married and have a baby."
"No wait, Jean's back, I LOOOVE her, I'm leaving you."

Wiki says it best:
"When he married Madelyne Pryor, Scott had thought he had found a replacement for Jean. Over time however, he realized that while Maddie looked like Jean, it was not her emotionally. Scott then began to emotionally distance himself, while fixating unhealthily on Jean. Scott would later leave Maddie and their child, upon hearing of Jean's return." (emphasis mine)

And blaming Jean for Scott's infidelity is weak sauce and classic blame-the-woman thinking. What makes it worse is he tried to excuse it because it's telepathic and therefore not real. The hell? Buddy, your wife is a telepath!

Leaving aside that though, the Scott/Jean romance is in the Top Five Ever of superhero stories, so how can you say breaking that up is the first interesting thing to happen to the character? Did you enjoy breaking up Peter/MJ also?

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Well, yeah, they would keep him around. He brought in a lot of the glitter vamps who would never read a Captain America book normally.

You mock, but Marvel could use some of those so-called "glitter vamps" if you want any sort of readership even approaching pop-culture levels instead of the tiny, sad shell of what it once was. Just look at what "Star Trek" has done for the cultural awareness (let alone perception) of this very board's subject matter!

How about they create a character not based on the archetypes, and let the character develop?

You mean like working with your archetypical brainwashed assassin, letting him grow and develop into the man he could have been? Letting him struggle internally, trying hard to live up to the ideals of his once-mentor - and pretty much succeeding? You mean that sort of development, where a pitiless killer pulls himself up by his bootstraps into an actual hero?