Burnham's Mutiny... Not Canon?

[WarpFactorZ]

Chekov was fucking with Spock.

And Spock fucked back.

Can I translate for you?

Checov "Your sister is hot."

Spock "Not as hot as your momma."

Chekov actually tried to mutiny once. It was in Space Seed. Remember? Khan does...

And to get back to the question, maybe Spock was being coy, as usual, when it comes to something shameful his family did. Remember this:

KIRK: You did too. Sybok couldn't possibly be your brother because I happen to know for a fact that you don't have a brother.
SPOCK: Technically, you are correct. I do not have a brother.
KIRK: You see?
SPOCK: I have a half-brother.

So, Spock either meant "Technically, there has never been a successful mutiny on a starship,"... or alternatively he meant "NO, THERE HAS NEVER BEEN A MUTINY IN THE HISTORY OF STARFLEET, AND IT SURE AS SHIT HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH MY FAMILY IF THERE WAS ONE -- WHICH THERE WASN'T! SO SHUT YOUR FUCKING MOUTH, CHEKOV, AND STOP ASKING STUPID QUESTIONS!"

Lastly, I get the impression that ultimately the Discovery, its mission, and its crew, are going to be wiped from the collective records of Starfleet because of... security issues.

 

[Noname Given]

Chekov: "Has there ever been a mutiny on a starship before?"

Spock: "Absolutely no record of such an occurrence."

Spock is pretty damn specific. Burnham was definitely a mutiny on a starship.

Chekov never says by the whole crew.

Um yeah, except when Captain Garth's crew mutinied (it's what got him sent to the Elba II asylum.) from TOS - "Whom Gods Destroy".

 

[Kane_Steel]

Nope, just have to remove it from official records. and the line stands, there are NO records. Sure, people recall it, but officially, it never happened.

So you're saying the charges of her being a mutineer will be magically dropped, after she was already charged, tried and found guilty?

And the entire alpha quadrant would be cool with that? lol.

 

[Kane_Steel]

Um yeah, except when Captain Garth's crew mutinied (it's what got him sent to the Elba II asylum.) from TOS - "Whom Gods Destroy".

There was no record of a mutiny of his crew. Just Garth's exaggerated ramblings from his story at the insane asylum to Kirk.

 

[Nerys Myk]

No one was ever charged with Mutiny there. So there's no record of it.

Burnham, however, was charged with Mutiny. She has the destination of being Starfleet's first official mutineer.

Maybe the quantum spores will fix the timeline.

They are recorded in Kirk's logs. Spock was even put on trial for it.
Hell he even pleaded guilty to every charge!!!!!

Captain's log, stardate 3012.6. General Court-Martial convened. Mister Spock has again waived counsel and has entered a plea of guilty.

MENDEZ: How do you plead to the charge of unlawfully taking command?
SPOCK: Guilty.
MENDEZ: Of sabotaging the computers of this vessel and locking it on a course for planet Talos Four?
SPOCK: Guilty.
MENDEZ: And of forcibly attempting to transport Captain Pike to that planet?
SPOCK: Guilty.

 

[Mirror Mirror]

So you're saying the charges of her being a mutineer will be magically dropped, after she was already charged, tried and found guilty?

And the entire alpha quadrant would be cool with that? lol.

They are letting Loca (sp?) and section 31( it seems) do what they want. He wanted her and he got her. If they want to wipe he from the system and sweep it under the rug, well we have seen Starfleet hand wave off and lie about whole ships and such before. What is one criminal


This is a none issue, all they need do is seal or expunge her records and your line stays intact with zero issue. Sorry man, this is not the great "Ah ha!" you thought it was.

 

[Kane_Steel]

They are recorded in Kirk's logs. Spock was even put on trial for it.
Hell he even pleaded guilty to every charge!!!!!

Spock was never found guilty.

Mendez wasn't even there, so the trial didn't even count as anything.

It was just a diversion by the Talosians.

 

[Mirror Mirror]

Spock was never found guilty.

Mendez wasn't even there, so the trial didn't even count as anything.

It was just a diversion by the Talosians.

You are loop holing here. Guilty or not it was a record of a mutiny

 

[Mudd]

They are letting Loca (sp?) and section 31( it seems) do what they want. He wanted her and he got her. If they want to wipe he from the system and sweep it under the rug, well we have seen Starfleet hand wave off and lie about whole ships and such before. What is one criminal


This is a none issue, all they need do is seal or expunge her records and your line stays intact with zero issue. Sorry man, this is not the great "Ah ha!" you thought it was.

You're mistaken.

 

[Campe]

Um yeah, except when Captain Garth's crew mutinied (it's what got him sent to the Elba II asylum.) from TOS - "Whom Gods Destroy".

Not to mention Spock himself commiting an act of mutiny in “The Menagerie” and being a part of one in “This Side of Paradise.”

Hard to take TOS seriously in this regard when they can’t keep their own continuity straight. (Its forgivable because they didn’t pay that close attention. But obviously Spock was wrong and omitted his own actions.)

 

[Noname Given]

Spock was never found guilty.

Mendez wasn't even there, so the trial didn't even count as anything.

It was just a diversion by the Talosians.

Spock didn't NEED to be found Guilty - like Burnham - he PLEADED guilty in TOS - "The Menagerie".

 

[Kane_Steel]

They are letting Loca (sp?) and section 31( it seems) do what they want. He wanted her and he got her. If they want to wipe he from the system and sweep it under the rug, well we have seen Starfleet hand wave off and lie about whole ships and such before. What is one criminal


This is a none issue, all they need do is seal or expunge her records and your line stays intact with zero issue. Sorry man, this is not the great "Ah ha!" you thought it was.

That wouldn't be the prime timeline if Section 31 had full control to destroy public records that Everyone knows about, and there is no fallout for that.

That's straight up as corrupt as the Empire in Star Wars.

Section 31 is a lot more covert than that.

Deleting Burnham's mutiny charge off the record like it never happened, when the entire fleet and more knows the story of Burnham the infamous mutineer, is a special kind of ridiculous.

What logic is there in them deleting that record when the everyone out there seems to know about the incident and Burnham being an infamous mutineer criminal?

 

[Mirror Mirror]

You're mistaken.

Please point to which part.

 

[Campe]

Spock didn't NEED to be found Guilty - like Burnham - he PLEADED guilty in TOS - "The Menagerie".

That’s really all that matters here.

That and that it’s an error in continuity, started not with Discovery but with TOS itself.

 

[WarpFactorZ]

What logic is there in them deleting that record when the everyone out there seems to know about the incident and Burnham being an infamous mutineer criminal?

What's the equivalent of a Presidential Pardon in the Federation?

 

[Kane_Steel]

Spock didn't NEED to be found Guilty - like Burnham - he PLEADED guilty in TOS - "The Menagerie".

He pleaded guilty in a trial that didn't exist, and he wasn't even found guilty in that.

Burnham pleaded guilty in an actual Starfleet trial, was found guilty, incarcerated, and her crime is known to basically everyone. She has a criminal record. And there is a record of mutiny on a starship.

See the difference.

 

[Nerys Myk]

There was no record of a mutiny of his crew. Just Garth's exaggerated ramblings from his story at the insane asylum to Kirk.

Kirk and Spock seem to think it's accurate

GARTH: My crew mutinied. The first use I will make of the Enterprise is to hunt them down and punish them for that.
KIRK: The crew of the Enterprise will also mutiny.

SPOCK: How could you, a Starship fleet Captain, believe that a Federation crew would blindly obey your order to destroy the entire Antos race, a people famous for their benevolence and peaceful pursuits?

Shall we excise Whom Gods Destroy, too?

 

[Mirror Mirror]

That wouldn't be the prime timeline if Section 31 had full control to destroy public records that Everyone knows about, and there is no fallout for that.

That's straight up as corrupt as the Empire in Star Wars.

Section 31 is a lot more covert than that.

Deleting Burnham's mutiny charge off the record like it never happened, when the entire fleet and more knows the story of Burnham the infamous mutineer, is a special kind of ridiculous.

What logic is there in them deleting that record when the everyone out there seems to know about the incident and Burnham being an infamous mutineer criminal?

1: Section 31 in DS9 could do stuff like hijack personal and had labs to make bio-weapons. Yeah Having records removed is just within the realm of power they have. With black mail if needed.

2: We have seen star fleet do things that have been corrupt. Did you somehow ship the USS freaking Pegasus?

3: Section 31 can be many things. Sloan operated in the open under Starfleet Intelligence. We do not know how they work in this era

4: See Spock. His is on the recoard..yet its not. Funny how that works eh?

5: Once the records go, the crime goes. It does not matter if everyone knows, legally you did nothing wrong and the crimes have been expunged.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Spock was never found guilty.

Mendez wasn't even there, so the trial didn't even count as anything.

It was just a diversion by the Talosians.

It's right there in the record.

 

[Campe]

He pleaded guilty in a trial that didn't exist, and he wasn't even found guilty in that.

You are really reaching here.

UHURA: Message from Starbase Eleven, sir. Received images from Talos Four. In view of historic importance of Captain Pike in space exploration, General Order Seven prohibiting contact Talos Four is suspended this occasion. No action contemplated against Spock. Proceed as you think best. Signed, Mendez, J.I., Commodore, Starbase Eleven.

Obviously the trial was more real than that. Spock still PLED guilty. Mendez still saw the events unfurl. It’s just that Spock was not found guilty because of a suspension in the rules FOR VISITING TALOS IV. He still committed mutiny.