Spoilers Batman v Superman: Dawn of Justice - Grading & Discussion
- Thread starter Commander Richard
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What transitions?
Not just that, but why did so many scenes have to be so short? Every time the movie hit a scene I was into, it was over in about 47 seconds.
From interviews it seems Synder's vision of Batman is very DKR-Batman. That may well be his model for who Batman is.
To me, that Batman was molded by the situation he was in - from trailers that does not seem to be similar to the one in the movie. I could be wrong.
To me, that Batman was molded by the situation he was in - from trailers that does not seem to be similar to the one in the movie. I could be wrong.
I'd say it was just ok. Similar to Dark Knight Rises, the last hour of the film is action packed and fun. Unfortunately, it takes quite a while (and a crazy amount of dream sequences) to get there. The 2.5 hour film run went quickly, but the first 90 minutes could have used substantial editing. Regarding the guns, it did strike me that Batman seemed to use firearms with reckless abandon in this film (of course, half of the gun use was in his dreams, so maybe it doesn't count 
Which is why I'm still curious.
Let's hope "the house style" doesn't infect them too much. After BvS I'm finding it very hard to care about the DCCU. Amazingly, I now care even less about the Aquaman, Flash and Cyborg movies than I did before. And because of Snyder, I don't care about Justice League at all.
I don't just blame Snyder though. I've said this before and I'll say it again...Goyer has got to go.
There apparently isn't a "house style" for the DC films, at least according to Zack and Deborah Snyder in this interview:
Source: http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/batman-v-superman-married-creative-874799
Affleck's Daredevil has a higher Rotten Tomatoes score than Batman V Superman. Lol
That's clear, although I'd call his interpretation of TDKR's Batman rather flawed. As I pointed out before, TDKR's Batman was not "killing all the time" as Snyder claims.
But then, judging from what I've seen of his work (Watchmen and Man of Steel), I feel that Snyder has a tendency to latch onto the surface forms of a thing without really giving thought to its substance. There were so many things in MoS that were just tossed in because they were obligatory in a Superman story rather than being justified or earned within the story itself, like the use of Metropolis as the climactic setting. Some reviews have said the same about this movie. (Watchmen wasn't so bad, but I do feel his adaptation focused more on the surface imagery and details than on the deeper tone of the story; something less CGI-slick and more verite would've been a better fit stylistically for the material.)
I saw BvS after work this evening at a work function. I enjoyed the heck out of it. I felt happy coming out of the theater; by way of comparison, I didn't feel happy at all coming out of Spider-Man 3 or The Force Awakens.
There's a good Batman movie in this. People are going to point to the scene and dialogue lifts from Miller's Dark Knight Returns, but I was more impressed with the scenes where Affleck is playing Batman (and Bruce Wayne) as a detective. There's Denny O'Neill-esque Dark Knight Detective stuff in here. I would really like to see a solo Batman film with Affleck and Jeremy Irons.
Gal Gadot's Wonder Woman is fantastic. In the fight with Doomsday, she totally looks like she's having fun.
I was surprised at some of the risks the film took. As the movie that's essentially launching the DC Movie Universe, it does some things I didn't expect at all and dropped some subtle hints about where they're going that I think most of the audience will miss entirely.
The two weak links, imho, are Lex Luthor's motivations and Henry Cavill's Superman. Cavill is kinda leaden in this. And what Luthor wants makes sense; it's just not clear -why- he's the one doing it. (Though, I should say, pay close attention to Luthor's final lines of dialogue -- they drop a very big clue about the plot behind the plot.)
You can see Geoff Johns' fingerprints on certain things. I won't say what, but when they appear, they're very big and very visible.
It was, for a Zack Snyder film, rather restrained. I was expecting more stylization (like 300, Watchmen, Sucker Punch), but he eschewed most of his visual signatures here.
It works. The denouement and aftermath genuinely surprised me, and the ending hit the the appropriate emotional notes.
I liked this. Solid B.
There's a good Batman movie in this. People are going to point to the scene and dialogue lifts from Miller's Dark Knight Returns, but I was more impressed with the scenes where Affleck is playing Batman (and Bruce Wayne) as a detective. There's Denny O'Neill-esque Dark Knight Detective stuff in here. I would really like to see a solo Batman film with Affleck and Jeremy Irons.
Gal Gadot's Wonder Woman is fantastic. In the fight with Doomsday, she totally looks like she's having fun.
I was surprised at some of the risks the film took. As the movie that's essentially launching the DC Movie Universe, it does some things I didn't expect at all and dropped some subtle hints about where they're going that I think most of the audience will miss entirely.
I was not expecting a scene straight from Crisis on Infinite Earths #1. I think most of the audience will go, "What the fuck?" I was like, "Holy shit!"
The two weak links, imho, are Lex Luthor's motivations and Henry Cavill's Superman. Cavill is kinda leaden in this. And what Luthor wants makes sense; it's just not clear -why- he's the one doing it. (Though, I should say, pay close attention to Luthor's final lines of dialogue -- they drop a very big clue about the plot behind the plot.)
You can see Geoff Johns' fingerprints on certain things. I won't say what, but when they appear, they're very big and very visible.
It was, for a Zack Snyder film, rather restrained. I was expecting more stylization (like 300, Watchmen, Sucker Punch), but he eschewed most of his visual signatures here.
It works. The denouement and aftermath genuinely surprised me, and the ending hit the the appropriate emotional notes.
I liked this. Solid B.
I sure hope that's true. I have no reason to think it isn't, just my bitterness over the DC printed universe having a house style for a good long while that I did not care for.
Mmm. But is it the loose one that ends up dumping you in the river?
I just saw it. Here's my non-spoiler assessment:
The Bad
I really liked Man of Steel, I really like this new DCU and I'm fully onboard but this installment could have been better. I'm not eager to see it again anytime soon but when I do, it'll be because of Batman, Superman and the visual spectacle, not the story.
The Bad
- The movie is either poorly written or poorly edited. The story jumps around and doesn't flow very nicely. It's like a lot of scenes just stitched together. Maybe the longer cut will help but who knows.
- A few plot developments seem to have happened off-screen and others are glossed over.
- The world has a pretty negative view of Superman. He has a worse reputation than Donald Trump. It's a fascinating angle but it can be a real downer.
- Affleck's Batman is everything you've been hoping for but at the same time, you'll get to see a very angry character who can be pretty off-putting at times. For those of you who've seen season 2 of Daredevil, he's like an angrier version of Jon Bernthal's Punisher with a bigger budget. If you want to introduce your kids to Batman, this isn't the movie for them.
- Ben Affleck as Batman and Bruce Wayne. A flawed character as stated above but well played.
- I like the batcave.
- Thanks to the fact that this is a big budget motion picture, you'll get to see Superman as a real force of nature and a Batman with some real skill. Both are formidable to watch. The story and pacing may be weak but this aspect of the film most certainly isn't. It's a visual spectacle indeed.
- Good use of CGI. It's abundant but not over done.
- It has a big all-star cast and everyone seems to have something meaningful to do.
- Wonder Woman. It would have been nice if they could have kept her inclusion in the film a secret until her big reveal though.
- For those of you who haven't seen it yet, you'll probably be in for a few surprises. I was. Some things happened that I haven't seen discussed and there's another development that people know about but seem to have gotten wrong.
I really liked Man of Steel, I really like this new DCU and I'm fully onboard but this installment could have been better. I'm not eager to see it again anytime soon but when I do, it'll be because of Batman, Superman and the visual spectacle, not the story.
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^ I totally forgot about that.
I like it because both Diane Lane and Annette O'Toole have technically played both Superman's mother and lover.Ok, so when Batman rescues Martha Kent, all I could think about is this image from Hollywoodland.
You know, the film where Ben Affleck plays George Reeve/Superman and Diana Lane plays his mistress?
My mind goes to weird places but this made me chuckle all the same.
I like it because both Diane Lane and Annette O'Toole have technically played both Superman's mother and lover.
LMAO I just remembered something else. Ayelet Zurer, who played Superman's birth mother in MOS, also plays Vanessa on Daredevil.
Everybody wants to court one of Superman's two moms and I don't blame them!
^ As I was watching Man of Steel last night, I was thinking that Ayelet Zurer would have made a great Wonder Woman.
I had Superman III on Syfy as background noise today which I haven't watched in years and it was odd seeing Annette O'Toole.
I know Superman 3 has a lot of problems and was basically a vehicle to prop up Richard Pryor after a string of unsuccessful movies, but the Clark and Lana parts of Superman 3 are some of the best there is. Lana has taken a big back seat in the comics due to the Lois and Clark marriage, and currently with the SM/WW pairing.
I wonder if the DCU Lana will also be a redhead.
Agreed 100%
We've seen her already in MOS, she isn't. She and Lois switched hair in this universe.