Bad Guy in the New Film??

[SheliakBob]

Oooh! Now THERE'S an idear! An angry Sheliak, out to sterilize the galaxy of nasty carbon-based lifeforms! Grim, but sexy, in a t-shaped space blob kind of way, and...
...
HEY!
That was sarcasm, wasn't it?
oh. buggerall.

y'know what they say, "You either die young, or live long enough to see yourself become the villain."
durn whippersnappers!

 

[Captrek]

Nobody. 9 of 11 films so far have featured a villain, but there’s no reason they have to. I don’t think we had villains in 82% of the TV episodes.

In this particular case, they pretty much have to do something new. The villain of the last film destroyed Vulcan and 6 billion inhabitants, not to mention all other forms of life on the planet. Coming directly on the heels of that any other villain is going to be anticlimactic unless it’s so over-the-top that it’s absurd.

 

[Captrek]

9 of 11 films so far have featured a villain, but there’s no reason they have to. I don’t think we had villains in 82% of the TV episodes.

Top 10 episodes, as ranked by GEOS.tv:


The City on the Edge of Forever: No villain.

Mirror, Mirror: In a way, the heros are surrounded by villains, but they’re just people doing what people do in this world gone mad. The story isn’t about a particular Bad Guy who must be defeated, it’s just about finding a way home from this disturbing environment.

The Trouble With Tribbles: There is a villain who poisons the grain, but that’s only revealed late in the episode. The other Klingons were jerks, not villains. The episode is not about a Bad Guy whom the heroes have to defeat.

Amok Time: No villain. T’Pring is a Class A bitch, but not a villain to be defeated.

Balance of Terror: OK, this one is straightforward hero-vs-villain. However, the villain in this case is more sympathetic than most of the movie villains.

The Doomsday Machine: I guess you could call the planetkiller a villain to be defeated, but as it’s not sentient, I think it’s a stretch to call it a villain.

Space Seed: Definitely a villain.

The Devil in the Dark: There is presumed to be a villain who must be found and destroyed, but when it’s finally found she turns out not to be such a villain after all.

Journey to Babel: Like Devil in the Dark, it’s clear that somebody is up to no good, but no villain is identified until late in the episode.

The Enterprise Incident: No real villain here, unless you count the guys who are violating treaties and deceptively seducing women in furtherance of theft of sensitive technology.


All in all, TOS did not rely heavily on the formula that has been used in 9 of the 11 films, so maybe the film series shouldn’t continue to rely so heavily on it.

 

[SheliakBob]

Now that I can agree with! I'm tired of villains, to tell the truth. Most of them haven't been very good. I'd like to see a movie about exploration and discovery, with a hostile environment perhaps, but more about finding something than blowing something up.

That is almost certainly not what we will get, though.

 

[C.E. Evans]

I'd like the bad guy in the next movie to be a woman. Don't care what race or species she is. It'd also be nice if she wasn't depicted as a delusional psychobitch, but as someone smart, cool, and sophisticated who is more than a match for Kirk as a strategist...and actually kicks the Enterprise's ass really good at one point.

sounds a lot like No. One

Actually, it does. Sounds like the Romulan Commander from The Enterprise Incident.

She wasn't so much a villain as she was a pawn in the elaborate plan Kirk and Spock were carrying out, IMO. She was pretty much being used and played for a fool right from the start in that story and went from a professional soldier to a woman seduced and betrayed by Spock...

 

[Shazam!]

This talkback discusses Khan and Klingons:

http://www.aintitcool.com/talkback_display/46494

Amusingly, a 'Boborci' turns up about two thirds of the way down.

 

[Sabataage]

Khan could be a woman.

Played by Katie Sackhoff.

Seriously, though, I could go for a female villain, I wouldn't even mind the inevitable sexual tension. But great care would have to be taken not to have her fall into the stereotypical "Evil Psycho Woman" or "Evil Cold Hearted Woman" stereotypes. What I'd hope for is a sympathetic villain who you could see Kirk actually falling in love (not just lust) with, if circumstances were different. Or, to put it in a nutshell:

"In another universe, I might have called you 'Snookums.'"

When I pictured a sympathetic female villain, I saw something other than just another love interest for Kirk. One of my favorite scenes in Spielberg's Munich was when the Prime Minister, Golda Meir sits down with Eric Bana. The idea of this sweet grand motherly old woman commanding the obediance and loyalty of warriors twice her size is kind of awesome and (if done well) quite intimidating. I'm picturing Linda Hunt or Fionnola Flanagan (aka Eloise Hawking from Lost) as a complete badass Klingon commander. That would pretty much cancel out any conventional method of ending their confrontation (fisticuffs or fu- ...n-having.)

 

[Kelso]

Yeah, the safe bet would be with Khan and/or Klingons.

 

[kkozoriz1]

For that we need a new universe?

How about we see something that we haven't seen before? Toss in some Klingons for color if you like but let's do something totally new.

 

[M'Sharak]

How about we see something that we haven't seen before? Toss in some Klingons for color if you like but let's do something totally new.

I'd watch that movie.

 

[Devon]

This talkback discusses Khan and Klingons:

http://www.aintitcool.com/talkback_display/46494

Amusingly, a 'Boborci' turns up about two thirds of the way down.

'Boborci' has been on the talkback for a long time now.

 

[M'Sharak]

This talkback discusses Khan and Klingons:

http://www.aintitcool.com/talkback_display/46494

Amusingly, a 'Boborci' turns up about two thirds of the way down.

'Boborci' has been on the talkback for a long time now.

Bob Orci has been "boborci" on TrekMovie for quite a while now. I'm not sure I'd give the character on AICN quite so much credit.

 

[Devon]

I'm not sure I'd give the character on AICN quite so much credit.

As in you don't think it's him?

 

[Jeyl]

he wanted to destroy all Federations planets, starting with Earth, so that the Romulus of this new past would have no enemies and fare better than his Romulus did.

That's still vague and weak. How would destroying all inhabitable federation planets be a benefit? Not only would the Romulan Star Empire not have any foes to fight (Nero would certainly go after the Klingons next), but they wouldn't have any worlds to conquer. Heck, even in Nemesis, the Romulans thought that destroying Earth was a bit too much and backed out. Nero has about as much interest in the well being of his people as Jason from Friday the 13th series does for the happy campers.

 

[F. King Daniel]

The Federation has hampered numerous nefarious Romulan schemes over the years, like the the attempt to control the Klingon civil war in "Redemption", the attempted invasion of Vulcan in "Unification". There was also vague allusions to things like "The Tomed Incident". Without Earth and Vulcan the Federation would be extremely weakened (and may even collapse), and the Romulus of the future would be free to expand into all that TNG-era Federation space, and life would be more prosperous for his other self and his wife next time.

Of course, Nero was too stupid to fly to the Hobus star and Red Matter bomb it out of existence first.

Other than that massive oversight, I thought Nero knew he was gonna be stopped eventually. He knew he'd never see his wife or people again (it might just be me, but I thought he was lying through his teeth at his simple underling Ayel when he spoke of going home as heroes), and I think anything he accomplished after making Spock suffer was just icing on the cake.

 

[Jeyl]

He knew he'd never see his wife or people again (it might just be me, but I thought he was lying through his teeth at his simple underling Ayel when he spoke of going home as heroes)

Yeah, I know. Too bad we didn't get a scene like that in the movie itself.

 

[F. King Daniel]

He knew he'd never see his wife or people again (it might just be me, but I thought he was lying through his teeth at his simple underling Ayel when he spoke of going home as heroes)

Yeah, I know. Too bad we didn't get a scene like that in the movie itself.

I'm getting mixed up. It's from the Nero comic, it was "saviours" not "heroes" and yes, it should have been in the film, along with a reason why he didn't destroy the Hobus star.

 

[Devon]

I'm getting mixed up. It's from the Nero comic, it was "saviours" not "heroes" and yes, it should have been in the film, along with a reason why he didn't destroy the Hobus star.

He was going to save Romulus (destroy the hobus star) but first wanted to make Romulus free of the federation. He kinda died before he had a chance to really do anything other than destroy Vulcan. Of course, there's also the little issue of their being inhabitants of the Hobus star system. If they are members of the federation, then he'll be more than sure to destroy it!

 

[Jeyl]

He was going to save Romulus (destroy the hobus star) but first wanted to make Romulus free of the federation. He kinda died before he had a chance to really do anything other than destroy Vulcan. Of course, there's also the little issue of their being inhabitants of the Hobus star system. If they are members of the federation, then he'll be more than sure to destroy it!

Which makes me wonder why he doesn't just destroy the suns that correspond to the planets. After all, that red matter was able to consume a galaxy threatening super nova from the inside, why should a big flaming ball of gas be any different? Even in Star Trek IV, Admiral Cartwright says "Even with planetary reserves, we cannot survive without the sun." And that was a "Earth needs to be saved" storyline. Another benefit to destroying the sun? NO DRILLING.

 

[thumbtack]

I'm not sure I'd give the character on AICN quite so much credit.

He announced at Comic-Con that it really is him. Although, he is "in character" given the nature of the venue he is posting in.