Aviation Geeks unite?! Anybody else care about planes here?

[publiusr]

MAKE culture rulz!

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I used to drive through Arkansas a lot on business. In summer it was fun watching the Ag-Cats and PA36's doing aerobatics for fun while spraying farms. sometimes looping right over I-40. I guess that's pretty common.

I think there are some Soviet designs with walking speed stalls— in the video above, it looks windy, so some planes might seem to “hover” in one spot.

O/T

I think some jets used water injection in the engines.

Now, in the Jan. 7, 2021 issue of the journal SCIENCE (p 123; 160) is an article by Bogdan Dereka called “Crossover from hydrogen to chemical bonding” where the hybrid covalent-hydrogen bonded state is very strong—with new hydrogen bonds at 45.8 kilocalories per mol, instead of 1-3 or so.

If true...I wonder what this could point towards...

 

[Santaman]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antonov_An-2
The AN-2 has no stall speed..

The An-2 has no stall speed, a fact which is quoted in the operating handbook. A note from the pilot's handbook reads: "If the engine quits in instrument conditions or at night, the pilot should pull the control column full aft and keep the wings level. The leading-edge slats will snap out at about 64 km/h (40 mph) and when the airplane slows to a forward speed of about 40 km/h (25 mph), the airplane will sink at about a parachute descent rate until the aircraft hits the ground

 

[Marc]

it was announced last July the the end of the road was nigh for 747 production and now Boeing has confirmed it's last taken the last orders.

Atlas Air ordered 4 747-8f freighters scheduled for delivery in October next year. At that point production will cease.

Boeing just announced the definitive end of the legendary 747 as cargo giant Atlas Air places an order for the final 4 planes (msn.com)

 

[publiusr]

Ugh....

The Future of aviation?
https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=52741.0
https://www.janes.com/defence-news/...demonstrate-large-scale-scramjet-technologies
https://www.popularmechanics.com/science/a34840801/sodramjet-engine-hypersonic-flight-test/
https://www.nasaspaceflight.com/2020/12/earth-to-earth-supersonic-airliners/

The lovely MiG 31...and....
https://forum.nasaspaceflight.com/index.php?topic=45734.msg2149553#msg2149553
https://www.popsci.com/story/technology/lost-cia-spyplane-area51/
https://www.unexplained-mysteries.com/news/342591/new-aerial-photograph-of-area-51-emerges

A lovely bird

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[Marc]

documentary on the demise the TSR-2 in the 1960. Like the Avro Arrow it was the victim of politics from lord mountbatten who was barracking for the Buccaneer and poisoned the Australian govt against the TSR2 to the Americans who feared it would challenge their domination of the market to a new labor govt concerned about the rising cost but no definitve reason was ever given.

It also suffered because of decision to use the Olympus engines which were a brand new designs and had issues (a Vulcan being used as test bed for the Olympus was destroyed by fire caused by the test engine).

And like the Arrow, there was a hurried destruction of all materials and the airframe though two survived, 1 one was used as target for weapons testing, the rest were burnt.

But from the get she was a brilliant aircraft to fly (the pilot for the first flight was interviewed in the documentary)

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Second videos is a presentation by an author who wrote a history on the TSR-2.

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[publiusr]

On behalf of all us Yanks--I apologize for the F-111. (I did like the cockpit capsule...)

We should have given them--the B-1s and our F-14s to the Aussies, so they could have an all swing-wing air force what with the Panavia Tornadoes.

 

[Santaman]

The TSR2 was a really good aircraft, very fast, could have done Mach 3 if it had been built uit of more heat resistant materials, the engines were easily coping with that, it also could supercruise.
And yeah, pity they pulled an "arrow" on it..

As for the F-111, mwah, I don't dislike the Aardvark..

 

[Marc]

On behalf of all us Yanks--I apologize for the F-111. (I did like the cockpit capsule...)

We should have given them--the B-1s and our F-14s to the Aussies, so they could have an all swing-wing air force what with the Panavia Tornadoes.

Australia never flew Tornadoes.

Went Sabres, Mirage, F-18, F-35 plus the F-111s.

 

[John Clark]

It's a shame about the TSR2, but I actually like the Buccaneer too.

 

[Gingerbread Demon]

Why was the F-111 disliked?

 

[StarCruiser]

To start with - it was envisioned by McNamara as both an Air Force fighter and a Navy fighter. Trying to create a 'Jack of all Trades" aircraft that wasn't particularly good at anything (sound vaguely familiar...F-35 anyone?).

It wasn't a terrible attack aircraft but, wasn't anything to write home about. Made a fairly good EW (Raven) aircraft though...

 

[Marc]

To start with - it was envisioned by McNamara as both an Air Force fighter and a Navy fighter. Trying to create a 'Jack of all Trades" aircraft that wasn't particularly good at anything (sound vaguely familiar...F-35 anyone?).

even before I got the last part of the sentence, the line about jack of all trades made me think of the joint strike turkey.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

jack of all trades made me think of the joint strike turkey.

Trying to create a 'Jack of all Trades" aircraft that wasn't particularly good at anything (sound vaguely familiar...F-35 anyone?).

https://www.f35.com/news/detail/lockheed-martin-celebrates-a-year-of-f-35-successes
With more than 600 aircraft operating from 26 bases and ships around the globe, the F-35 plays a critical role in today's global security environment. More than 1,200 pilots and 10,000 maintainers are trained, and the F-35 fleet has surpassed more than 350,000 cumulative flight hours. Nine nations have F-35s operating from a base on their home soil, nine services have declared Initial Operational Capability and six services have employed F-35s in combat operations. The United States Air Force deployed the F-35 for 18 consecutive months from April 2019 until October 2020 in the CENTCOM Area of Responsibility with hundreds of weapons employments in support of U.S. servicemembers and their allies.

The year also included initial fielding of the Operational Data Integrated Network (ODIN), the follow-on to the Autonomic Logistics Information System (ALIS), with excellent initial results. The system will be fully operational in 2022. Mission capable rates for the aircraft continued to improve in 2020 with rates greater than 70% across the fleet, and even higher for deployed units. The F-35 also proved its value in Joint All-Domain Operations with multiple exercises that highlighted the aircraft’s ability to gather, interpret and share information with various platforms.

The world disagrees with your personal assessment and 600 aircraft and more coming proves you wrong.

 

[Marc]

https://www.f35.com/news/detail/lockheed-martin-celebrates-a-year-of-f-35-successes
With more than 600 aircraft operating from 26 bases and ships around the globe, the F-35 plays a critical role in today's global security environment. More than 1,200 pilots and 10,000 maintainers are trained, and the F-35 fleet has surpassed more than 350,000 cumulative flight hours. Nine nations have F-35s operating from a base on their home soil, nine services have declared Initial Operational Capability and six services have employed F-35s in combat operations. The United States Air Force deployed the F-35 for 18 consecutive months from April 2019 until October 2020 in the CENTCOM Area of Responsibility with hundreds of weapons employments in support of U.S. servicemembers and their allies.

The year also included initial fielding of the Operational Data Integrated Network (ODIN), the follow-on to the Autonomic Logistics Information System (ALIS), with excellent initial results. The system will be fully operational in 2022. Mission capable rates for the aircraft continued to improve in 2020 with rates greater than 70% across the fleet, and even higher for deployed units. The F-35 also proved its value in Joint All-Domain Operations with multiple exercises that highlighted the aircraft’s ability to gather, interpret and share information with various platforms.

The world disagrees with your personal assessment and 600 aircraft and more coming proves you wrong.

no just means a lot of countries fell for good marketing and bought in on the program.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

no just means a lot of countries fell for good marketing and bought in on the program.

So you really believe that many people, countries, & governments are gullible and incompetent? That the possibility that your point of view on the F-35 was wrong from the beginning and that you don't have all the facts on the plane never occured to you?

Maybe that you were misinformed, misled, or deceived about the capabilities of the plane by the main stream media?

All the people that have flown the aircraft or fought simulated battles against it, work in the F-35 program on both sides of the government and LockHeed Martin are lying to the public and only the Main Stream Media is correct about it's point of view is how you're going to interpret any news about the F-35? You're already dead set on your views on the F-35 because the Main Stream Media told you what you wanted to hear, and everybody in the Main Stream Media couldn't possibly be wrong?

 

[Santaman]

I also have no love for the F-35 air Bradley either..

And yes, governments and the military are frigging incompitent and gullible, we bought that stupid aircraft out of the traditional slavish behaviour of our military forces yuck..
Also, for foreign users like us Dutch, all the goodies and nice tech have been cut out because of it being "classified" we don't even get the source code to the software.
We should have bought the Rafale or Gripen..

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_Martin_F-35_Lightning_II_development
^^ after reading that I think it is not really a good aircraft.. ye gods, it has more flaws than Cyberpunk 2077..

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

Also, for foreign users like us Dutch, all the goodies and nice tech have been cut out because of it being "classified" we don't even get the source code to the software.
We should have bought the Rafale or Gripen..

Do you expect to get the "Source Code" for your car, for any vessel or vehicle that you buy from a Private Company?
What about your gaming consoles? Do you expect the "Source Code" for that?

U.S. to withhold F-35 fighter software code
https://www.reuters.com/article/us-...5-fighter-software-code-idUSTRE5AO01F20091125
No other country is getting the so-called source code, the key to the plane’s electronic brains, Jon Schreiber, who heads the program’s international affairs, told Reuters in an interview Monday.

“That includes everybody,” he said, acknowledging this was not overly popular among the eight that have co-financed F-35 development -- Britain, Italy, the Netherlands, Turkey, Canada, Australia, Denmark and Norway.

Schreiber said the United States had accommodated all of its partners’ requirements, providing ways for them to upgrade projected F-35 purchases even without the keys to the software.

“Nobody’s happy with it completely. but everybody’s satisfied and understands,” he said of withholding the code. It is also a rebuff to Israel, which has sought the technology transfer as part of a possible purchase of up to 75 F-35s.

Whenever your country buys a "Tank", "Warship", etc from a private defense company do you expect the manufacturing company to give you the source code? The Source Code is Private Property, you get to use the product as designed.

If you wanted a "Open Source" Aircraft, you shouldn't have agreed to buying a privately coded product.

But then you'll see how many Defense Contractors will really want to do work with the government when they can't own the source code. I'm betting that it'll be a VERY small number, if not ZERO.

Part of what makes any modern computerized device special for a company is their "Source Code".

And you're not getting that when you purchase off the catalog products from Private Firms.

So unless you plan on Nationalizing every Private Defense Contractor do all the work for you and give you all the code, it's not happening.

So you'd rather buy a less capable aircraft that is going to get shot down in a worse case scenario.

And if you really believe it's that bad, then prove it.

What about it makes it that bad compared to it's competition?

What are the "So called flaws"?

 

[Santaman]

Eh yeah, I linked to a list of flaws and I am not going to type it out.. but still whatever you say we've got a handicapped aircraft with all the juicy stuff removed so it is useless, so again, I'd rather have a real working aircraft like a Rafale of Gripen and that is all I will say about it since I have the feeling this otherwise is going nowhere.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

Eh yeah, I linked to a list of flaws and I am not going to type it out.. but still whatever you say we've got a handicapped aircraft with all the juicy stuff removed so it is useless, so again, I'd rather have a real working aircraft like a Rafale of Gripen and that is all I will say about it since I have the feeling this otherwise is going nowhere.

You linked to the Wikipedia page for F-35 development.

You have a perfectly fine aircraft, nothing is "Handicapped" as you would artificially define it since you don't get the "Source Code" for other platforms that you buy as well from Defense Contractors or most other things IRL.

You're crazy if you think the Rafale or Gripen would give you their "Source Code" either.

 

[Gingerbread Demon]

But why do other countries get the same plane but some of the features are left out, and what if those were things the other countries wanted?