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Spoilers Avengers: Infinity War grade and discussion thread

How do you rate "Avengers: Infinity War"?


  • Total voters
    165
You seem to have missed the entire point of the movie and Thor as a character. I’ve seen all the movies and I actually like the Thor movies. It’s entirely in character for him and expected from him. It’s even set up in the movie, Thor tells him that he’ll die for what he’s done and he says it as he delivers the blow. His failure is even foreshadowed.

The point you continue to miss is that foreshadowed or not, the Thor/Thanos final scene was poor screenwriting when Thor has participated in battles where putting an absolute end to enemies was the goal.

Thor despite his development can still be arrogant, it’s something that the character has always dealt with. Even to this day in the comics, it comes up. That’s why he keeps losing his hammer in them. The movies have streamlined that, but it still gets the best of him at times.

This is all wiped away by Thor fully comprehending the threat of Thanos using the gauntlet if he successfully found every stone. That was a repeated point in the film for every sub-group, with Thor realizing it more than all others, with the exception of Dr. Strange, so again--and above all else--the film sets up Thor needing to kill Thanos on first strike, not go far enough that Thanos has even a moment of life left in him.

Plus generally slamming an axe made for a god into the chest and major organs of a living being tends to be pretty fatal. Especially since it was wiping out an entire army before just by swinging it.

It would be fatal...to an ordinary person. The films have built Thanos to be more than Joe Average male life form who is easy to kill. Moreover, with Thanos wearing the bejeweled gauntlet (and the repeated build up of that threat throughout the film), there's no excuse for Thor to underestimate Thanos and do anything less than driving that axe through Thanos' head...other than to have him be the thinly plotted screw-up who allows Avengers 4 to happen.

This.

Thor has not really been shown to be a tactical or strategic genius, in fact he's often been largely incompetent outside the delivery of brute force. That's been consistently present throughout his appearances in the MCU in that his combat is as much about pride as strategic gain, about proving himself against ever larger foes, be it for vengeance, pride or simply the challenge.

He works most effectively as part of a team with a more pragmatic and abstract thinker guiding him, be it Cap, Odin or (more subtly) Loki. Let to his own devices he is as much about proving his masculinity as he is about achieving measurable end goals.

In this case--as in the battle of New York--Thor did not need leadership to end the threat. That was the character's drive right up to the ridiculous halfassing of his strike. I do not doubt that if Captain America, Wanda, Black Panther, Bucky or Okoye had the ability to "take the shot" at killing Thanos with one blow, they would have, and made sure their first strike was also the last. One does not need to act as part of a team to understand the magnitude of that mission.
 
I don't understand why you're giving Thor such a hard time, his choice seemed perfectly reasonable? I mean like he drove his ax right into Thanos' heart, I mean why wouldn't he think that would kill him? Usually if you put your ax through someone's heart he's dead, right? I don't feel any heroes need to be dumbed down or changed at all, I mean I was perfectly happy with how everyone was portrayed in this movie, but they still lost didn't they? So obviously being at their best wasn't good enough, and now they've lost like half of them, so they're really in a tough situation?

I don't feel Thor gets lessened at all by Captain Marvel being stronger than him. I mean Thor is way more powerful than Captain America, but it's not like he's useless or anything? Hulk is really super strong, physically probably your strongest Avenger, but he couldn't defeat Thanos and is even too scared now to come back out, lol. So obviously like with this villain, who actually beat them, they need someone like you've never seen before. But she's not going to diminish anyone else on the team, she just has something they don't and can do some things they can't.

Thor seems to know when he's outmatched and he seems like he has no problem with humility and accepting it. Like he knew he wasn't a match for Hela so he allowed his home to be destroyed and deferred to that Ragnarok guy to destroy her, and he like totally was not at all bummed he wasn't strong enough to save Asgard, right? I feel he has gotten over his ego and understands his place better than he ever has before, so he shouldn't have a problem letting Captain Marvel shine as the most powerful Avenger?

I'm not (hopefully) being harsh on Thor (the guy's fictional after all), just explaining how I see the character as written, both here and in the comics. He has learnt over time, he's started to accept he isn't the centre of the universe, but softening a flaw isn't the same as removing it altogether. I wouldn't want that flaw removed, it's part of who he is and what defines him as such fun onscreen, after all who do I have as my avatar?

I don't need my heroes to be perfect, I find Superman to be insufferable most of the time and Rogers sometimes falls into the same category. What matters is first and foremost the way they behave is in fitting with the character as portrayed thus far and whilst Thor has started being willing to accept shows of weakness they are about how he deals with desperation, how he swallows his pride when all other options fail (see Hela). That doesn't take away from the fact his pride and immaturity is a driving character trait and he sees Thanos as a personal challenge to defeat and prove himself against before he sees a tactical or strategic problem to be solved.
 
The point you continue to miss is that foreshadowed or not, the Thor/Thanos final scene was poor screenwriting when Thor has participated in battles where putting an absolute end to enemies was the goal.



This is all wiped away by Thor fully comprehending the threat of Thanos using the gauntlet if he successfully found every stone. That was a repeated point in the film for every sub-group, with Thor realizing it more than all others, with the exception of Dr. Strange, so again--and above all else--the film sets up Thor needing to kill Thanos on first strike, not go far enough that Thanos has even a moment of life left in him.



It would be fatal...to an ordinary person. The films have built Thanos to be more than Joe Average male life form who is easy to kill. Moreover, with Thanos wearing the bejeweled gauntlet (and the repeated build up of that threat throughout the film), there's no excuse for Thor to underestimate Thanos and do anything less than driving that axe through Thanos' head...other than to have him be the thinly plotted screw-up who allows Avengers 4 to happen.



In this case--as in the battle of New York--Thor did not need leadership to end the threat. That was the character's drive right up to the ridiculous halfassing of his strike. I do not doubt that if Captain America, Wanda, Black Panther, Bucky or Okoye had the ability to "take the shot" at killing Thanos with one blow, they would have, and made sure their first strike was also the last. One does not need to act as part of a team to understand the magnitude of that mission.

All I can say is you have a very strange view of Thos as a character, one totally at odds with every interpretation of any version of the character I have ever seen or heard.

More than the film sets up that need to kill Thanos in one strike, the whole multi film arc had set those conditions, but Thor had already made it clear how he saw it as a personal vendetta, he then stood and spoke to what he believed was a dying Thanos rather than confirm the kill.

That's entirely in fitting with everything we know about the guy, how he likes to prove himself, how he likes to assert his masculinity and show a rival how he has bested them, how he wanted Thanos to see it was him at the last moment.
 
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I don't need my heroes to be perfect, I find Superman to be insufferable most of the time and Rogers sometimes falls into the same category.
Well, Rogers was pretty damn far from perfect in Civil War... but that’s a whole other debate.
 
The point you continue to miss is that foreshadowed or not, the Thor/Thanos final scene was poor screenwriting when Thor has participated in battles where putting an absolute end to enemies was the goal.



This is all wiped away by Thor fully comprehending the threat of Thanos using the gauntlet if he successfully found every stone. That was a repeated point in the film for every sub-group, with Thor realizing it more than all others, with the exception of Dr. Strange, so again--and above all else--the film sets up Thor needing to kill Thanos on first strike, not go far enough that Thanos has even a moment of life left in him.



It would be fatal...to an ordinary person. The films have built Thanos to be more than Joe Average male life form who is easy to kill. Moreover, with Thanos wearing the bejeweled gauntlet (and the repeated build up of that threat throughout the film), there's no excuse for Thor to underestimate Thanos and do anything less than driving that axe through Thanos' head...other than to have him be the thinly plotted screw-up who allows Avengers 4 to happen.



In this case--as in the battle of New York--Thor did not need leadership to end the threat. That was the character's drive right up to the ridiculous halfassing of his strike. I do not doubt that if Captain America, Wanda, Black Panther, Bucky or Okoye had the ability to "take the shot" at killing Thanos with one blow, they would have, and made sure their first strike was also the last. One does not need to act as part of a team to understand the magnitude of that mission.
There's quite a bit about that I agree with but not just with Thor. I think having the Hulk so impotent was kind of a weak device. Thor being a loser in the end really opens the door for super duper Captain Marvel to show them all how it's done.
 
I don't really understand where you're coming from, like I don't feel anyone was weakened or was out of character, I feel more like they just had an enemy so far beyond anything they've ever encountered, he fairly defeated them. Like Hulk is really super strong, but Thanos is stronger, I don't think that's against Hulk, it's not like he was beaten by some foot soldier or something? I don't think Thor was a loser, he did exactly what he wanted to do, it just didn't work as he'd thought it would, right? These heroes were never all-powerful before, why should they be now? I really don't have a problem with Thanos, who they've been building up for years and years now, came in and beat everyone.
 
I don't really understand where you're coming from, like I don't feel anyone was weakened or was out of character, I feel more like they just had an enemy so far beyond anything they've ever encountered, he fairly defeated them. Like Hulk is really super strong, but Thanos is stronger, I don't think that's against Hulk, it's not like he was beaten by some foot soldier or something? I don't think Thor was a loser, he did exactly what he wanted to do, it just didn't work as he'd thought it would, right? These heroes were never all-powerful before, why should they be now? I really don't have a problem with Thanos, who they've been building up for years and years now, came in and beat everyone.

I'd have more of a problem if he didn't to be honest :)
 
The Hulk was not at his best. That was a way of diminishing his contribution. Thor was ultimately a fizzer. These were two of the strongest Avengers. It was kind of futile.
 
I felt Hulk was at his best, he just was defeated? Like he only had one fight, right? And it was against Thanos? I don't see why Thanos defeating Hulk is such a terrible thing? I mean, why can't he be stronger? And he did have the Power Stone already, right? I mean just because Thanos was better doesn't mean Hulk wasn't at his top form?

But like didn't Thor almost single-handedly save Wakanda? I mean when he came I thought that was like sooo awesome, he was flying around destroying whole armies, but like how is that fizzing? And Thanos beat Thor when he had just one Stone, so why can't Thanos be even more powerful when he has all six? I really just don't understand, I mean Thor came so very, very close to killing Thanos, and he seemed to do everything right, he just misjudged that putting an ax through his heart wouldn't kill him?
 
Come to think of it, Thor’s mistake with Thanos is almost exactly the same mistake he made in TDW. He brought the Aether to Malekith because he thought he could destroy it with Mjölnir. He was wrong. He plunged Stormbreaker into Thanos’s chest because he thought it would kill him (and probably because aiming for center mass is what he’s trained to do when throwing an axe that can cut through anything). He was wrong again. When he has a plan that he thinks will work, he doesn’t stop to think what might go wrong, he just does it.
 
Well didn't he need like one of Thor's hairs to make his portal work in Ragnarok? And oh dear maybe Thanos planned for that long ago and that's why he's bald?

I feel Dr Strange is the most confusing hero, because sometimes he seems nearly omnipotent when it doesn't matter.
 
Well didn't he need like one of Thor's hairs to make his portal work in Ragnarok? And oh dear maybe Thanos planned for that long ago and that's why he's bald?

I feel Dr Strange is the most confusing hero, because sometimes he seems nearly omnipotent when it doesn't matter.
yes agreed.
 
The Hulk was not at his best. That was a way of diminishing his contribution. Thor was ultimately a fizzer. These were two of the strongest Avengers. It was kind of futile.

Thanos had the Power Gem and, as such, was the most physically powerful peep in the universe. He is also a vastly superior fighter. Hulk was lucky he lasted as long as he did and was in no way diminished. He was totally out of his league
 
The point you continue to miss is that foreshadowed or not, the Thor/Thanos final scene was poor screenwriting when Thor has participated in battles where putting an absolute end to enemies was the goal.



This is all wiped away by Thor fully comprehending the threat of Thanos using the gauntlet if he successfully found every stone. That was a repeated point in the film for every sub-group, with Thor realizing it more than all others, with the exception of Dr. Strange, so again--and above all else--the film sets up Thor needing to kill Thanos on first strike, not go far enough that Thanos has even a moment of life left in him.



It would be fatal...to an ordinary person. The films have built Thanos to be more than Joe Average male life form who is easy to kill. Moreover, with Thanos wearing the bejeweled gauntlet (and the repeated build up of that threat throughout the film), there's no excuse for Thor to underestimate Thanos and do anything less than driving that axe through Thanos' head...other than to have him be the thinly plotted screw-up who allows Avengers 4 to happen.



In this case--as in the battle of New York--Thor did not need leadership to end the threat. That was the character's drive right up to the ridiculous halfassing of his strike. I do not doubt that if Captain America, Wanda, Black Panther, Bucky or Okoye had the ability to "take the shot" at killing Thanos with one blow, they would have, and made sure their first strike was also the last. One does not need to act as part of a team to understand the magnitude of that mission.
So your complaint is that Thor didn’t act on things he clearly didn’t know, but that you as an audience member did? That doesn’t make any sense. Did you actually watch the movie or just read a description?
 
sorry if this was already mentioned...why didn't Dr Strange make aportal over Thanos's arm and just chop off the glove?

Dr. Strange wasn't actually trying to make the glove plan work. Everything that happened in the movie is what Dr. Strange wanted to happen - that's why at the end of the movie he says 'We're in the endgame now' and then a bit later 'Tony, it was the only way.'

In other words, this ending is what leads to that one future out of the 14 million Strange was looking at where the heros actually win in the end. If the glove plan had succeeded, Thanos would've found a way around it and the results would've led to an irrecoverable loss for the heroes.

Well didn't he need like one of Thor's hairs to make his portal work in Ragnarok? And oh dear maybe Thanos planned for that long ago and that's why he's bald?

I feel Dr Strange is the most confusing hero, because sometimes he seems nearly omnipotent when it doesn't matter.

I'm pretty sure the hair was for helping him locate Odin.
 
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