Are any of the old Batman movies worth seeing?
- Thread starter Captain Worf
- Start date
I've watched both Batman and Batman Returns several times the last week, it was on TV and I recorded it to watch again with my kids.
Both Burton films hold up extremely well IMHO. They are dark, demented, macabre, they are totally Burton. They have more in common with Edward Scissorhands than they do with James Bond movies. That does not diminish them in any way.
Watching Batman Begins this week with my kids as well, I have to point out that there are just as many, or more, stupid moments. Bruce Wayne won't execute a criminal but seconds later has no qualms about blowing up house and potentially burning everyone to death? A Batmobile with the weight of a tank driving over rooftops? Bruce Wayne having feelings for a woman he has spent 20 minutes with in the last 20 years, hasn't seen since they were 8? Revealing his identity to her? Microwaves that penetrate steel pipes? But don't fry the humans in their path?
The Nolan movies are James Bond in a Batmask, and that's not a bad thing, but it's not a realistic thing either, when the plot and events are as realistic as Moonraker.
It's a comic book, there's no way to make it "real". The demented macabre versions are just as legimate, and they are well executed, and it is good execution that is really all we can ask for with a superhero movie.
That was Batman's Monica Lewinsky incident, who can resist getting nookie at work?
There's a huge theme however, the whole movie is about identity, the face we show the public and who we really are and so on.
I hated Burton's take on The Penguin.
It was absurd as absurd can be. The Penguin is supposed to be a shrewd, odd looking, dapper mafia hancho.
Not a sewer-dwelling deformed nut case.
It was absurd as absurd can be. The Penguin is supposed to be a shrewd, odd looking, dapper mafia hancho.
Not a sewer-dwelling deformed nut case.
Nicholson's Joker was eclipsed completely by Mark Hamill well before that. Hell, Nicholson's Joker was eclipsed by Nicholson. Because he didn't play the Joker. He played Jack Nicholson in whiteface. He's the least definitive Joker of all time, because the character was completely subordinated to the actor's standard persona. (Although the same could be said of Carrey's Riddler and Schwarzenegger's Mr. Freeze. As for DeVito's Penguin, it was subordinated, not to DeVito's persona, but to Burton's sensibilities. Basically, the Burton & Schumacher films didn't portray any of the characters in a particularly authentic way.)
The coolest thing about BF is that they got Will Shortz to come up with the riddles, so there was actually some cleverness to them. Too bad that didn't extend to the rest of the film. (The riddles in the first couple of B:TAS Riddler episodes were abysmal. So getting decent riddles in BF was refreshing.)
The Adam West movie, on the other hand, is pure gold through and through.
"Confound it! The batteries are dead!"
^^Yeah, but Mafia or not, he was supposed to be a dapper, odd-looking little guy, not a flipper-handed mutant raised in the sewers. Although different portrayals varied on whether he was actually erudite and sophisticated or merely a thug with pretensions. Modern animated adaptations have tended to split the difference. B:TAS used Tim Burton's design for the character but made him an educated, well-spoken man who nonetheless was not as much a part of high society as he wished to be -- though in the later series they gave him a radical makeover to his classic comics appearance (he must've found a terrific plastic surgeon) and had him appear to go straight while running criminal operations out of his superficially legitimate business. The Batman made him the crass, lowbrow black-sheep scion of a formerly wealthy family that had fallen on hard times, so that his pretentions to class and sophistication were more blatantly unconvincing. They also gave him a dumpy, rounded, scruffy look that was slightly evocative of Burton's design while still being fully human.
Christopher, I was under the impression that The Batman version of the Penguin did in fact have deformities like the Burton!Penguin. Can you tell me where you got the info about him being human?
That's kind of why I wish Nolan would do The Penguin, I'd love to see his take on the character in this much more naturalistic setting.
They've already heavily setup the mafia underground's strengths in the last two movies, seems to me The Penguin would fit well into this with him having a "legit" business with the craps tables that rotate out from under the dining tables in the evening.
I think it could be terrific to see Nolan's take and use of the character.
Tim Burton's was just awful.
Ugh.
Makes me shudder just thinking of it.
They've already heavily setup the mafia underground's strengths in the last two movies, seems to me The Penguin would fit well into this with him having a "legit" business with the craps tables that rotate out from under the dining tables in the evening.
I think it could be terrific to see Nolan's take and use of the character.
Tim Burton's was just awful.
Ugh.
Makes me shudder just thinking of it.
Well, the character designs on that show were so stylized that it's hard to say what's deformity and what's just caricature. He was never specifically established as any kind of "mutant" or deformed individual, as far as I can tell. But upon further research, I find that he did have the same kind of three-fingered "flipper" hands that the Burton Penguin did:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Penguin_TB.jpg
http://www.nerf-herders-anonymous.net/images/TomKenny_TheBatman.jpg
I suspect I'm in the minority here, but I liked Burton's whole Caligari-esque take on the character. Much more visually interesting than the traditional version, who was just a fat, waddling man in a tuxedo and top hat.
His master plans were all over the place, but he was memorably grotesque and creepy, which fit in perfectly with Burton's expressionistic horror-movie Gotham.
Then again, I've always found monsters more interesting than mobsters.
I've stated this many times before, but the Burton!Penguin is by far my favorite take on the character, and I was rather disappointed when the PTB behind the DCAU went back to a more traditional 'look' for the character in The New Adventures of Batman and Robin.
I would really like to see a variation on the Burton!Penguin (less creepy and freakish yet still physically deformed and with a bit of a complex about those deformities) show up in Chris Nolan's Batverse, but it'll probably never happen, sadly.
I would really like to see a variation on the Burton!Penguin (less creepy and freakish yet still physically deformed and with a bit of a complex about those deformities) show up in Chris Nolan's Batverse, but it'll probably never happen, sadly.
darkwing_duck1
Vice Admiral
You forgot Batman/Superman: World's Finest, which was released as it's own volume as well as part of Superman: TAS. Batman also plays a MAJOR role in Justice Leage: Starcrossed, also a solo release on top of being part of the 2nd season of Justice Leage.
To the OP, just forget the LA movies altogether and stick with the "Timmverse" DC animateds! (Superman and Justice League as well as the Batman serieses). You can't go wrong!
Batman Returns was really good. The other three--including 1989's Batman--are best avoided for various reasons.
I don't count those as movies because they're actually triple-length TV episodes. They did get DVD releases in "movie" form, but that wasn't their original format. They were made for TV and debuted on TV. Unlike the ones I listed, whose debuts were theatrical or direct-to-video.
darkwing_duck1
Vice Admiral
Released that way or not, they're "movie length" and contain a single story, so I count them for purposes of answering the OP's question.
S
Stone_Cold_Sisko
Guest
Check out "Batman Returns". It's a little weird and Burton-esque but still watchable and fun in its own twisted way. I wouldn't consider a 'quintessential' Batman movie the way I do the Nolan films (and to a lesser extent, the 89 film) but it's still quite good.
"Batman Forever" is probably worth watching, but I don't think too highly of it.
"Batman and Robin"...... well, like T'Baio said, if you think of it as the spiritual successor to the Adam West Batman, it can be fun. But if you really take to the "serious" Batman of the Nolan/Burton films, you're probably gonna hate.
"Batman Forever" is probably worth watching, but I don't think too highly of it.
"Batman and Robin"...... well, like T'Baio said, if you think of it as the spiritual successor to the Adam West Batman, it can be fun. But if you really take to the "serious" Batman of the Nolan/Burton films, you're probably gonna hate.
Ohh, no way. That's kind of what it was trying to be, but it failed miserably. Partly because it couldn't decide on an identity and awkwardly mashed up the campy lunacy with moments of serious melodrama and thereby undermined both. Partly because the campy stuff tried too hard and went too overboard and just wasn't funny.
I love Batman Returns. Awesome movie. Not The Dark Knight, but still hella cool.
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