Discussion in 'Star Trek: Voyager' started by Shatnertage, Aug 11, 2010.
"You just have to get the last word in, don't you."
That's also the episode with the tip o' the hat to "Flight of the Phoenix" - Neelix has a line about working on models. That was pretty much the peak of the episode for me.
Thanks to Spike jumping the rails, it looks like we're back at the beginning. I don't really mind since I haven't seen any of these episodes since they were first broadcast, and I don't remember them in any detail. So we're back to...
"Caretaker Parts I & II"
I'm just going to share a few of my overall thoughts here.
Overall, it was a good episode. Weird, in the Star Trek way--like the Caretaker's holodeck takes them to Schrute Farms instead of someplace exotic. Those producers have a real fascination with rustic folk, don't they?
I didn't quite catch Janeway's backstory. Is she a prodigy, or just another captain? Is this Voyager's first...voyage? I know it's Harry's, but I wasn't sure if this was her first command or not.
(If they said so and I didn't catch it, it's because I'm watching with a 2 year-old who isn't always quiet, and I miss about 20% of the dialog. But she makes up for it by saying cute stuff like, "They're going to warp!" when they go to warp at the end of the credits.")
There's a surprising lack of grief for the sudden deaths of the chief engineer, CMO, conn officer, and first officer. It's not like they don't have Janeway getting emotional--she gets all a bit teary talking about Kim's clarinet (this was my favorite scene, BTW). Presumably she'd worked together with each of the dead officers, maybe for quite some time. But not a word.
Neelix started out promising--I like how he ran a con game on the VOY crew. If only they'd made him look less goofy, or even a little menacing. It's just impossible to take him seriously.
For that matter, they all started out promising. It looked like Kim was going to be a major character. And I love how him and Paris meet cute at Quark's.
If the Kazon have warp drive, why don't they just warp to a planet with a lot of water, bottle some up, and come back to Ocampa-land? I don't get that.
For that matter, the "big choice" Janeway made at the end of the episode seems to be a false choice to me. Blowing up the array and using it weren't mutually exclusive. They could have set a time-bomb to go off, or they could have fitted the tri-cobalt bombs onto a shuttle and set it to auto-pilot, with a five minute delay. Or they could have given the bombs to Neelix and let him take care of it after they left.
And Torres makes a good point at the end, though from the look in Chakotay's eyes I can see he's found his Woman Warrior already. It's the way he says, "She's the captain."
Good episode: nice introduction to the characters, though like I said there are some plot things I didn't quite get.
It is Voyager's first voyage. Tuvok was the only officer specifically stated to have worked with Janeway in the past.
In "Shattered", Janeway says it's her first command, but in "Night", we learn that she was previously CO of the USS Billings.
Although she appears to be pretty young to be a captain, there's no mention of her having advanced exceptionally quickly.
The stuff about the time bomb and why the Kazon have warp drive but can't get water . . . I just pretend there are Good Reasons for those things that weren't explained. Else the entire episode is nothing but a big pile of stupid.
It would have been nice had someone shown a slight bit of concern for the dead officers and crew, but then again . . . http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=U1UIWrkswvA
ETA: I laugh everytime I think about that old lady on the farm trying to give everyone corn. "Since no one seems to care for any corn, we'll have to proceed ahead of schedule." LOL.
^^^Great video. I wondered about that, too--why did he decide to sprint across the bridge at the moment of impact?
And having seen more of the show, it's interesting to see what they followed up on and what they didn't.
Yeah, poor guy. Janeway didn't even bust out with CPR for him. Or perhaps she only learned to do that after she realized she was short a medical staff.
Speaking of medical staff, here's another amusing fact. There's a patient in Sickbay when they're still docked at DS9. It's a new ship. How is someone sick or injured already? And why is this person on board ship rather than in the Infirmary on DS9?
I don't mean to pick too much on this ep, though. They had a ton of stuff to do in a limited amount of time - characters to introduce, a premise to establish, relationships to get started - and all that was accomplished. It's OK by me if a few bits look really dumb in retrospect.
^^Have you considered how dangerous it is, to EAT at Quark's bar? I suspect an acute gastrointestinal illness was the cause; not enough to kick you off the ship but enough to keep you away from your duty station.
Onto an episode that didn't do much for me...
This wasn't a badly-made episode. It was just...boring. The technobabble B-plot didn't really do anything for me, and knowing the human relations A-plot ultimately doesn't go anywhere kind of ruins it for me.
There were some nice moments--Torres is an interesting character, and she had a few nice scenes with Janeway. All in all, though, I think everyone would be a little more freaked out that they're 75 years from home, and you'd have a lot more to worry about than Maquis/Starfleet tensions.
It just seems like they're treading water already, compared to where ENT was at this juncture, with "Fight or Flight."
And this morning I got about 20 minutes through "Time and Again" (home sick today) before I got too bleary-eyed and turned it off. Way too much Treknobabble, and not much else so far. It just seems very tedious right now--this is probably why I tuned out in the first season first time around. Any good ones coming up soon?
Yep. The Phage, The Cloud is OK, and today Eye of the Needle is on. And I don't really remember Emanations but Ex Post Facto was basically an episode from TNG.
The technobabble sideplot of Parallax was crapola but I loved the human relations, some really well written interactions I thought.
OK, I finally sat through the rest of...
"Time and Again"
This one turned out to be a whole lot of nothing for me. It was kind of a neat idea, but the Treknobabble stuff about subspace fractures just killed it for me. And Janeway's interpretations of the Prime Directive just seemed like plot contrivances to me.
I'm not a big fan of the Prime Directive, though: it's like someone reading HR bs to you while you're trying to watch a TV show. I don't want to turn this into an anti-PD rant, but it just does nothing for me dramatically, and philosophically I think it's well-intentioned but ultimately unworkable.
The Kes part of the story didn't really go anywhere, either.
*Searches for something nice to say about this episode*
Um. It was funny when Paris told the kid that he and Janeway were children-eating demons.
Buck up, Shatnertage, you'll be around to "Eye of the Needle" before you know it.
I liked "Time and Again".
^ This is one I skip when re-watching since I've had more than enough time travel over the years. In fact, I'm rewatching Voyager now and due to this thread meant to watch "Time And Again" again last night but forgot about it and did "Phage" instead. Oops.
Speaking of which, it's time for...
When I found out they took Neelix's lungs, my wife and hi had this exchange:
ME: "Hey, it's like a serious version of Spock's Brain. You know which one that is, right?"
SHE: "BRAIN AND BRAIN WHAT IS BRAIN?"
Is she a keeper or what? She also points out random occurrences of the number 47 to me.
So, onto the episode. Some legitimately creepy stuff with the lung thieves, and some really good moments from Neelix. He's still not growing on me, but this is a good episode for him.
I thought Janeway's speech to the Vidiians was a total disaster. Basically, it came down to "if you do that one more time, I'm going to get angry." We could have used a little Robau-esque "What gives you the right..." instead of that "Starfleet principles" speech. And then to just let them go?
The "good guy" bad guy made everything better in the end, but it was a quick way out of a real moral dilemma. And how come Janeway was able to pull the trigger on Tuvix, but wouldn't at least see if the doctor could hack out one of the Vidiian's lungs and give it back to Neelix?
It just seemed like they made what could have been an incredible episode a little too easy.
This is probably my least favorite Janeway moment of all time. "OK, Vidiians, I'm going to send you to time out for stealing lungs! Stealing lungs is rude!"
I must say, though, the Vidiians are some of creepiest aliens in Trek. Organ theft is just . . . ewwww . . . it triggers a whole special kind of disgust/fright. Except in "Spock's Brain", as you already mentioned.
Have you seen "Faces" and/or "Deadlock" yet?
I have seen "Deadlock" but not "Faces." I liked "Deadlock."
I agree, the Vidiians are great aliens. And it's a great sci-fi concept, period: aliens that survive by stealing your organs. It plays on the old "body horror" theme very well. There was something very horrific about Neelix paralyzed, with his lungs missing. About the only thing creepier to me is in "Tomb of the Cybermen" when the Cyberman says, "You belong to us. You will become like us."
Another thing I liked about the episode was Janeway's "How do you know I'm going to do" moment with Tuvok.
Oh man, "Phage" is one of my favorite episodes, and I love the Janeway speech and how she gets all emotional!
OK, if you've seen "Deadlock", I can follow up my earlier remark by saying this: Janeway did say in "Phage" that she was going to kick some Vidiian ass one day, and boy, did she ever!
Oh, and the Janeway/Tuvok dynamic is great throughout the entire series. That's a neat friendship.
I've made it to the episode that AMG says is worth waiting for...
"Eye of the Needle"
This was a different one. Again, it had a great sci-fi concept, and they didn't go heavy on the wormhole technobabble.
I liked Vaughn Armstrong as the Romulan, and could even recognize him as Admiral Forrest under the forehead bones. Good acting from everyone.
They did a good job of making it a show that could only have been VOY and of keeping the surprises coming.
That said, did they give up on going back too easily? I'd guess that "time travel" into the future wouldn't be much of a problem--just go at .999c for a few months and time would pass more slowly than for the rest of the universe, right?
On the other hand, they didn't have the ship, and would undoubtedly contaminate the timeline, so there goes that idea.
This was definitely better than the last few.
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