Actors vs Directors

[RobertScorpio]

There were a whole rash of stories last week about how 'mean' James Cameron is while making his movies; to the point where he makes the actresses cry when he gets mad with anger...

And then Sigorney Weaver says something like "we're paid a lot of money to make these movies. And some of my fellow performers seem to take for granted the lifestyles we are afforded" or something like that...bravo Ms. Weaver...

I side with the directors. No one is putting a gun to an actor/actress's head. They are in one of the most powerful unions in America. If Cameron was as evil as some have made him out to be, then why is he still making movies? Why would other actors knowingly subject themselves to more than one of his projects if he was that evil?

Here would be my dream match up...

James Cameron directing Alec Baldwin. One, a so called ASSHOLE director...the other clearly an Asshole. Would love to hear the behind the scene stories if they ever meet in a project...

Rob

 

[Kegg]

I don't have an opinion on how Cameron treats his actors because I know basically nothing about it (I recall vaguely reading Ed Harris being unhappy with the guy, but what do I know? Nothing, that's what).

However, speaking generally, it's just like everything else. I'm sure there are directors who are mean to actors and vice versa. Such is life.

 

[RobertScorpio]

I don't have an opinion on how Cameron treats his actors because I know basically nothing about it (I recall vaguely reading Ed Harris being unhappy with the guy, but what do I know? Nothing, that's what).

However, speaking generally, it's just like everything else. I'm sure there are directors who are mean to actors and vice versa. Such is life.

Oh, I agree. And yes, Harris did have problems with Cameron. Commenting to the degree that he would never work with Cameron again...But ABYSS was a great movie. So whatever Cameron did? He did good. And I also think is has one of Ed Harris's best performances...

Rob

 

[Temis the Vorta]

There's no excuse for behaving unprofessionally at work. I'm sure Cameron could get the same results without behaving like an asshole.

I've worked with people who are mature and calm and I've worked with assholes. There's no improvement in the quality of the results with assholes vs. mature, professional people. If anything, the quality suffers because of the impact just one asshole in a group can have on the team's morale and motivation.

The focus becomes "isn't X a total asshole?" and "let's gang up on X and make him look bad" rather than "let's all work together to produce something great." Ganging up on the asshole often has the result of sabotaging what the group was trying to accomplish. And of course people get fed up and quit when they otherwise wouldn't have, and you lose people with vital skills and have to spend inordinate amounts of time trying to hire replacements. And if you're honest, you feel compelled to at least hint in the job interview that "X is an asshole even if he hides it well when you interview with him, so maybe you should think twice about taking this shitty job."

If Cameron was as evil as some have made him out to be, then why is he still making movies?

Because he makes shitloads of money. But he'd make the same shitloads of money if he were mature, calm and professional, so there's no excuse for him being an asshole.

Why would other actors knowingly subject themselves to more than one of his projects if he was that evil?

Money and career boost. But that still is no excuse for anyone behaving unprofessionally at work. I personally have nothing but contempt for idiots so immature and lacking in self-control that they cannot keep their emotions under control in a work environment.

 

[Holdfast]

Here would be my dream match up...

James Cameron directing Alec Baldwin. One, a so called ASSHOLE director...the other clearly an Asshole. Would love to hear the behind the scene stories if they ever meet in a project...

I'd pay to see this.

But they'd fight so much that the movie would never get made, and so I'd never get to have the opportunity...

 

[Harvey]

Stanley Kubrick was notoriously mean on the set of The Shining, demonizing Shelley Duvall to the point of tears. Of course, this delivered a great performance, and thirty years later even Shelly Duvall recognizes that is one of her best performances and says she learned more from Kubrick on that film than any other director.

Likewise, Ridley Scott and Harrison Ford had a terrible relationship on the set of Blade Runner. Admittedly, 28 years later Ford is still a little bitter, but nobody denies the film's importance nor do they have much negative to say about Ford's performance.

Direction is all about the proper manipulation of actors, to put it bluntly. Sometimes it takes an asshole persona to accomplish that goal. And, sometimes, the director is just an asshole. Hard to say when it comes to Cameron, who has attracted as much cast loyalty (Michael Biehn, Arnold, Sigourney Weaver) as he has alienated actors.

 

[Aragorn]

I know Ed Harris got pretty annoyed at Michael Bay when Bay spent so much time on on a two-second shot of Harris slamming down a phone.

 

[Holdfast]

I know Ed Harris got pretty annoyed at Michael Bay when Bay spent so much time on on a two-second shot of Harris slamming down a phone.

Why? Did the slamming down result in a massive slow-motion explosion?

 

[RobertScorpio]

I know Ed Harris got pretty annoyed at Michael Bay when Bay spent so much time on on a two-second shot of Harris slamming down a phone.

I like Ed Harris, but I get a 'snobby' vibe from him when I see him on talk shows. But, as I said, as an actor, I do like him in the movies I see him in. I thought he was great in the TRUMAN SHOW and GlenGary Glenn Ross...

Rob

 

[Aragorn]

I know Ed Harris got pretty annoyed at Michael Bay when Bay spent so much time on on a two-second shot of Harris slamming down a phone.

Why? Did the slamming down result in a massive slow-motion explosion?

No, it was just a shot of Harris hanging up the phone. That's all. But apparently Bay spent more time on that shot than most everything else.

 

[M'rk son of Mogh]

I've worked with people who are mature and calm and I've worked with assholes. There's no improvement in the quality of the results with assholes vs. mature, professional people. If anything, the quality suffers because of the impact just one asshole in a group can have on the team's morale and motivation.

Of course, you're taking the word of the employee here and not the "boss". I've seen the opposite side of the story too often (I'm not in management, so I really have no biases here). Where the lazier unprofessional workers complain about the boss being a jerk and too difficult to work with when, to be fair, he's doing his job and expecting them to do theirs. He's stern and demanding, but still easy enough to work with when you do your job.

Something tells me that SOME (generalizing) of the younger Hollywood types aren't used to being as professional as maybe they should. And aren't used to the fact that sometimes hard work is demanded.

 

[RobertScorpio]

I've worked with people who are mature and calm and I've worked with assholes. There's no improvement in the quality of the results with assholes vs. mature, professional people. If anything, the quality suffers because of the impact just one asshole in a group can have on the team's morale and motivation.

Of course, you're taking the word of the employee here and not the "boss". I've seen the opposite side of the story too often (I'm not in management, so I really have no biases here). Where the lazier unprofessional workers complain about the boss being a jerk and too difficult to work with when, to be fair, he's doing his job and expecting them to do theirs. He's stern and demanding, but still easy enough to work with when you do your job.

Something tells me that SOME (generalizing) of the younger Hollywood types aren't used to being as professional as maybe they should. And aren't used to the fact that sometimes hard work is demanded.

I still remember this story told by John Wayne and recounted by Ron Howard...

Wayne (a right winger) and Henry Fonda (a left winger) were filming the movie FORT APACHE together somewhere in the desert. And all the actors got together, all the extras, to film a scene in the 106 degree desert. All except Henry Fonda....

Henry Fonda came out of his trailer and went into the director's trailer; the director was John Ford. John Wayne was in the trailer too, getting last notes from Ford.

Henry Fonda told Ford that he refused to film the scene because it was too hot outside. John Wayne heard this and then called Fonda a "pussy". To which Fonda said to Wayne that they were not slaves and that he would not work in such heat.

John Ford opens the window and points out at the gathering throng of extras and the other actors, not fortunate to have trailers, and getting paid very little, but still willing to work.

Fonda stood his ground. Ford told him to get out there and do the scene to which Henry Fonda told John Ford to go to hell...John Ford punches Henry Fonda.

The scene was filmed twenty minutes later...

I love that story!!


Rob

 

[T'Baio]

There's no excuse for behaving unprofessionally at work. I'm sure Cameron could get the same results without behaving like an asshole.

I've worked with people who are mature and calm and I've worked with assholes. There's no improvement in the quality of the results with assholes vs. mature, professional people. If anything, the quality suffers because of the impact just one asshole in a group can have on the team's morale and motivation.

What do you do for a living? There's a huge difference between working in an office and working on an artistic, collaborative enterprise like a film. Being a dick in an office based environment is just that, being a dick.

However, for a director who has many millions of someone else's dollars, who is working with an actor who may very well be getting paid more for two months work than most make in years, who is on a severely constricted timetable and under considerable pressure, and yes, has an artistic goal...sometimes you have to treat people a specific way to get the performance you need.

Actors know what they're getting into. They're well schooled far in advance of whatever pressures they may be under. And they're paid considerably to withstand them. Sometimes artists have to yell and scream and be mean and cry and beat on one another to feel that moment that they need to be in. To feel that emotion and make it real on that massive screen.

A lot of people have complained about James Cameron over the years. However, you'll also notice that there a lot of people who work with him constantly. What does that tell you?

 

[Shazam!]

Actors are talking props. Directors FTW.

 

[John Picard]

There's no excuse for behaving unprofessionally at work. I'm sure Cameron could get the same results without behaving like an asshole.

I've worked with people who are mature and calm and I've worked with assholes. There's no improvement in the quality of the results with assholes vs. mature, professional people. If anything, the quality suffers because of the impact just one asshole in a group can have on the team's morale and motivation.

What do you do for a living? There's a huge difference between working in an office and working on an artistic, collaborative enterprise like a film. Being a dick in an office based environment is just that, being a dick.

However, for a director who has many millions of someone else's dollars, who is working with an actor who may very well be getting paid more for two months work than most make in years, who is on a severely constricted timetable and under considerable pressure, and yes, has an artistic goal...sometimes you have to treat people a specific way to get the performance you need.

Actors know what they're getting into. They're well schooled far in advance of whatever pressures they may be under. And they're paid considerably to withstand them. Sometimes artists have to yell and scream and be mean and cry and beat on one another to feel that moment that they need to be in. To feel that emotion and make it real on that massive screen.

A lot of people have complained about James Cameron over the years. However, you'll also notice that there a lot of people who work with him constantly. What does that tell you?

Some people can't take it when the "boss" pushes them to their self-perceived limits, and beyond. Some of the best bosses (and teachers) I've had were people who pushed.

 

[exodus]

There's no excuse for behaving unprofessionally at work. I'm sure Cameron could get the same results without behaving like an asshole.

I've worked with people who are mature and calm and I've worked with assholes. There's no improvement in the quality of the results with assholes vs. mature, professional people. If anything, the quality suffers because of the impact just one asshole in a group can have on the team's morale and motivation.

What do you do for a living? There's a huge difference between working in an office and working on an artistic, collaborative enterprise like a film. Being a dick in an office based environment is just that, being a dick.

However, for a director who has many millions of someone else's dollars, who is working with an actor who may very well be getting paid more for two months work than most make in years, who is on a severely constricted timetable and under considerable pressure, and yes, has an artistic goal...sometimes you have to treat people a specific way to get the performance you need.

Actors know what they're getting into. They're well schooled far in advance of whatever pressures they may be under. And they're paid considerably to withstand them. Sometimes artists have to yell and scream and be mean and cry and beat on one another to feel that moment that they need to be in. To feel that emotion and make it real on that massive screen.

A lot of people have complained about James Cameron over the years. However, you'll also notice that there a lot of people who work with him constantly. What does that tell you?

Exactly!!
Anyone who knows of someone that's a perfectionist can relate to Cameron's behavior. They might not like how he does stuff but he gives you the best he can due to it.

 

[RobertScorpio]

There's no excuse for behaving unprofessionally at work. I'm sure Cameron could get the same results without behaving like an asshole.

I've worked with people who are mature and calm and I've worked with assholes. There's no improvement in the quality of the results with assholes vs. mature, professional people. If anything, the quality suffers because of the impact just one asshole in a group can have on the team's morale and motivation.

What do you do for a living? There's a huge difference between working in an office and working on an artistic, collaborative enterprise like a film. Being a dick in an office based environment is just that, being a dick.

However, for a director who has many millions of someone else's dollars, who is working with an actor who may very well be getting paid more for two months work than most make in years, who is on a severely constricted timetable and under considerable pressure, and yes, has an artistic goal...sometimes you have to treat people a specific way to get the performance you need.

Actors know what they're getting into. They're well schooled far in advance of whatever pressures they may be under. And they're paid considerably to withstand them. Sometimes artists have to yell and scream and be mean and cry and beat on one another to feel that moment that they need to be in. To feel that emotion and make it real on that massive screen.

A lot of people have complained about James Cameron over the years. However, you'll also notice that there a lot of people who work with him constantly. What does that tell you?

Exactly!!
Anyone who knows of someone that's a perfectionist can relate to Cameron's behavior. They might not like how he does stuff but he gives you the best he can due to it.

agreed.. and I liked what Sigourney Weaver said about some of her 'fellow actors' taking for granted the amount of money they are paid to act...

having watched a taping of BIG BANG theory? They do work hard, at least the actors on that show. Everytime they had to cut and go back to an earlier lines, the actors picked it up right away with out looking at scripts and things like that...I found it impressing...

Rob

 

[exodus]

What do you do for a living? There's a huge difference between working in an office and working on an artistic, collaborative enterprise like a film. Being a dick in an office based environment is just that, being a dick.

However, for a director who has many millions of someone else's dollars, who is working with an actor who may very well be getting paid more for two months work than most make in years, who is on a severely constricted timetable and under considerable pressure, and yes, has an artistic goal...sometimes you have to treat people a specific way to get the performance you need.

Actors know what they're getting into. They're well schooled far in advance of whatever pressures they may be under. And they're paid considerably to withstand them. Sometimes artists have to yell and scream and be mean and cry and beat on one another to feel that moment that they need to be in. To feel that emotion and make it real on that massive screen.

A lot of people have complained about James Cameron over the years. However, you'll also notice that there a lot of people who work with him constantly. What does that tell you?

Exactly!!
Anyone who knows of someone that's a perfectionist can relate to Cameron's behavior. They might not like how he does stuff but he gives you the best he can due to it.

agreed.. and I liked what Sigourney Weaver said about some of her 'fellow actors' taking for granted the amount of money they are paid to act...

having watched a taping of BIG BANG theory? They do work hard, at least the actors on that show. Everytime they had to cut and go back to an earlier lines, the actors picked it up right away with out looking at scripts and things like that...I found it impressing...

Rob

Yep.
I remember going to a taping of "The Cosby Show" back in the day. They filmed from 9:00pm to 2:00am just for a half hour show. Any production costs money and you're on a time table. As a director, you don't have time to endulge your actors, the studio wants it done within the budget & time alloted. Making a film or TV show isn't a vacation, it's work and allot of pressure.

 

[RobertScorpio]

Exactly!!
Anyone who knows of someone that's a perfectionist can relate to Cameron's behavior. They might not like how he does stuff but he gives you the best he can due to it.

agreed.. and I liked what Sigourney Weaver said about some of her 'fellow actors' taking for granted the amount of money they are paid to act...

having watched a taping of BIG BANG theory? They do work hard, at least the actors on that show. Everytime they had to cut and go back to an earlier lines, the actors picked it up right away with out looking at scripts and things like that...I found it impressing...

Rob

Yep.
I remember going to a taping of "The Cosby Show" back in the day. They filmed from 9:00pm to 2:00am just for a half hour show. Any production costs money and you're on a time table. As a director, you don't have time to endulge your actors, the studio wants it done within the budget & time alloted. Making a film or TV show isn't a vacation, it's work and allot of pressure.

I was amazed at how fast paced the filming of that halfhour show was..they started at 7pm and were done around 11pm...five hours. They had five standing sets and as soon as the scene was done, wham, they were hustling down to the next one...

I did notice this though..

The dude who plays Leonard? He seemed kind of stuck up. Aloof from the others...where as Parsons (sheldon) and Penny were laughing it with each other...

Oh....Parsons drove a Volvo....the dude who played leonard drove a nissan sports car...and penny drove a jeep suv...

Rob

 

[exodus]

agreed.. and I liked what Sigourney Weaver said about some of her 'fellow actors' taking for granted the amount of money they are paid to act...

having watched a taping of BIG BANG theory? They do work hard, at least the actors on that show. Everytime they had to cut and go back to an earlier lines, the actors picked it up right away with out looking at scripts and things like that...I found it impressing...

Rob

Yep.
I remember going to a taping of "The Cosby Show" back in the day. They filmed from 9:00pm to 2:00am just for a half hour show. Any production costs money and you're on a time table. As a director, you don't have time to endulge your actors, the studio wants it done within the budget & time alloted. Making a film or TV show isn't a vacation, it's work and allot of pressure.

I was amazed at how fast paced the filming of that halfhour show was..they started at 7pm and were done around 11pm...five hours. They had five standing sets and as soon as the scene was done, wham, they were hustling down to the next one...

I did notice this though..

The dude who plays Leonard? He seemed kind of stuck up. Aloof from the others...where as Parsons (sheldon) and Penny were laughing it with each other...

Oh....Parsons drove a Volvo....the dude who played leonard drove a nissan sports car...and penny drove a jeep suv...

Rob

Sorry, I don't know who those guys are.
I don't watch the show.