Makes sense to me. My main question would be who program Control in the first place and if that was a reflection of their personality.
Has she done those things in this universe where they are considered wrong?
About Mirror Georgiou in ”Such Sweet Sorrow, Part 2“
- Thread starter Michael
- Start date
I'm realy not sure how. It only fully turned into that killer version after merging with the Sphere data. The Sphere was a several hundred thousand year old benevolant entity. It's last act was to save Discovery, and imprinted it's principles on the data it uploaded, the self aware ship protecting itsef but not attacking Enterprise, helping them take the data to the future.
How the not actually alive Control, a vicious and evil program, was able to overcome and overwrite the possibly living data of the Sphere and corrupt it's ethical coding is weird.
A conflicted emergent creature sure, but what we got just lazily went "evil AI" for the sake of the story and isn't consistent with the way around the two halves met.
It's consistent with almost every single AI style story I have read over the past 20+ years. TOS did it with the M5, Nomad and the like.
It's neither new, nor terribly creative, but it is understandable to me.
Seven of Nine did some comparably immoral things as a borg. Should she have been thrown out of the Voyager when she didn't offer perfect Starfleet behavior? The Klingons engage in plenty of things the Federation considers pretty horrific, yet they are still allies in the TNG-VOY era, again, serve in Starfleet. Should they be thrown out of Starfleet and disavowed as allies when they don't measure up on every level?
I did not see anything especially new regarding Control. It felt pretty rote to me, in terms of AI set up.
I meant an emergent AI having a good influence in the form of the Sphere data, preventing it from going genocidal. That would have been interesting. Getting the Borg merged with the machines from the Matrix, in space, just killing everyone again isn't new.
No and no. The key difference of course being that in neither example did the show present the immoral things these characters did as “the right thing” and ask the audience to cheer and root for their immoral acts.
Yes, it would have been interesting. However, since Star Trek has established that machines merging can create more harmful or destructive goals I do not see this as requiring much explanation.
YMMV.
I feel no inclination to cheer for Mirror Georgiou, nor do I think it is being presented as such.
I should have stuck to expecting nothing good to come from this series, season 2 changed that slightly, but you're right.
The real challenge is going to be season 3. If they're right about her being with them in the future and didn't somehow stay behind like I thought, then she's going to have no reason to listen to anyone. Section 31 and Starfleet aren't around to let her play spy to get those worse Mirror tendancies under control. It'll all be about protecting Michael by any means she considers necessary.
I already said it once, but I'll say it again, I didn't cheer what Georgiou was doing. I didn't see it as the "right" thing. I didn't think it was, I don't think CBSAA was trying to tell me it was. If Burnham or Saru were around, they would've said something to Georgiou or reacted in some sort of negative way. No one else was there.
When she brought up an over-the-top solution in the Briefing Room of the Enterprise, everyone dismissed her suggestion out of hand. DSC isn't spelling things out for us at every turn in every instance. They're relying on us to connect the dots ourselves.
Seems like an overgeneralization but OK...
That will certainly be an interesting journey to see.
Making us think for ourselves? The horror!
Really? Another character (notably one that's not from the Mirror Universe; so no excuse there) even cheers her on in the dialog (“Yum yum!”) when she expresses her desire to see Control/Leland suffer. You are telling me when you watch that scene and see Georgiou laughing at Control/Leland in pain you get the feeling the writers want you to think about what a horrible thing that actually is she is doing?
I just think I would have been more comfortable had they chosen such a moment to comment on what an inhuman behavior this actually is.
My problem is that they present her as a hero akin to Saru and Burnham. They don't call into question that what she's doing is right. In fact, they do the exact opposite, they say that it's cool that Georgiou enjoys the torture (Nhan in the episode and Michelle Paradise in the interview).
Control itself explained it in the show. Though now I'm forgetting what it said.
What immoral act of Georgio's has the audience been asked to cheer and root for?
Are you reading the thread? The joyous laughter at another being suffering pain and death.
I guess you missed the scene where she suggested create a supernova and everyone in the room rejects the idea as being immoral.
Klingons do the same thing. And we are told they are our pals What's your point again? that the audience can't tell when one character is doing something immoral and when they are not?
Control can't feel pain.
I don't need commentary to know this behavior is not right.
My reaction is very simple-torture is wrong. That is part of my moral compass, has been for a long time. I don't need the writers telling me what to think when I am perfectly capable of thinking for myself. People on the "good side" can do evil things. It happens and is part of storytelling.
As I said above-I am capable of figuring this stuff out.
