8x08 Mummy on the Orient Express (Grading/Discussion) SPOILERS!

[Candlelight]

Does anyone remember when the Doctor said he'd find Gallifrey...? That would be the arc they should use.

I don't think it was ever stated that it would be a major story arc this season.

No but it should've been. Granted it would stunt any individual storylines this season but it should've eventuated in the restoration of Gallifrey, then season nine could have the Doctor struggling to come to terms with his own people being back.

Instead we're stuck with the same story being told since the first season. There's nothing wrong with having other Time Lords around. It's not like they appeared in every single episode of the classic series.

All I can think of is Gallifrey IS the promised land and Missy is somehow bringing dead people's souls through the lock, and she'll somehow use that to escape.

 

[Emperor-Tiberius]

I'll be honest: I don't want to see the Time Lords on the show. Ever.

But, they will appear, eventually. It just take the "long way round".

 

[intrinsical]

You know, I get the feeling that Clara is turning into The Doctorwannabe. Face it, she's seen all 12 reincarnations of The Doctor, saved him countless time. No other human knows The Doctor as well as Clara... So much so that she thinks she can take over the title.

 

[Sindatur]

)
My mother has been turned off by this Doctor and refuses to watch the show. She finds him as unpleasant as the Sixth Doctor. (Her favorite doctors are Tom Baker, Jon Pertwee, and David Tennant.) I wonder how many other people feel this way.

A friend of mine decided this weekend she's done with the show. A couple more are still watching, but are disliking Capaldi. Granted all of them have watched the show only since the Matt Smith era, but even I am experiencing a "wobble" (as Clara put it this week).

I always knew that the "Matt Smith Fangirls(tm)" would leave since they hated the casting of an older Doctor, but I was really excited about Capaldi coming in and even I've mostly been turned off. He's great when he's funny, and I loved the moment in this week's episode when he confronted the mummy himself. That made me think of the 9th Doctor. But other than that, he's a pretty sour character and that's not how it should be. I can only hope that this is part of a story arc and he'll snap out of it, because this sort of Doctor isn't a Doctor that I'm interested in watching for 36-40 episodes.

And I keep going back to the Clara thing...the drama is there between them only because the writers forced it. They retconned Clara's character to make her like this. They wrote the Doctor as someone without compassion to force conflict between them. You can make 12 a different Doctor without making unlikeable. You can change the relationship that THIS Doctor has with Clara without making it "dramaville." Change it from a Doctor Clara can easily tease and wrap around her finger (11) to someone she struggles to keep up with and teaches her things and still has fun. Not a Doctor she's struggling to trust.

They had a magical relationship. It used to make me smile and now it makes me sigh.

Eh, anecdotal evidence is anecdotal.

There's also Tennant Fangirls (And guys) who tuned out during Matt Smith's tenure (Either because they just couldn't cope with the loss of Tennant or they simply didn't like Smith's portrayal) and they have now come back, and found a new love for the show with Capaldi as the Doctor. I know 3 girls and a couple guys like that. Only the ratings can tell us how healthy the show is, and International ratings have been increasing (while domestic ratings are holding steady when adding the Live +7 numbers), despite the Doom and gloom predictions throughout the Moffat Tenure

 

[Timewalker]

You know, I get the feeling that Clara is turning into The Doctorwannabe. Face it, she's seen all 12 reincarnations of The Doctor, saved him countless time. No other human knows The Doctor as well as Clara... So much so that she thinks she can take over the title.

And that slap in the face to all the previous Doctors, especially the Classic ones, is why I'm really not that fond of nuWho and definitely not fond of Clara. She was never in those stories, wasn't needed, and it's insulting to the show's long history to think that the only way the Doctor and his Companions survived their adventures was due to Great Holy Time Goddess Clara.

 

[Sindatur]

You know, I get the feeling that Clara is turning into The Doctorwannabe. Face it, she's seen all 12 reincarnations of The Doctor, saved him countless time. No other human knows The Doctor as well as Clara... So much so that she thinks she can take over the title.

And that slap in the face to all the previous Doctors, especially the Classic ones, is why I'm really not that fond of nuWho and definitely not fond of Clara. She was never in those stories, wasn't needed, and it's insulting to the show's long history to think that the only way the Doctor and his Companions survived their adventures was due to Great Holy Time Goddess Clara.

Some people interpreted it that, and some of us, don't understand where that interpretation comes from. What we saw, was The Great Intelligence sabotaging the Doctor's accomplishments, and Clara putting things back the way they were, reversing that sabotage (IE: A perfect example of what the Time War was like, when the Timelords would rewrite Dalek History, and the Daleks would rewrite it again to their advantage, and back and forth and back and forth)

 

[The Wormhole]

I have enjoyed every episode this season, but for some reason I've found this Season to be slightly weak. Maybe it's because the arc is pretty poorly defined. Here we are four episodes to the finale and the only things we have of the arc are the few times we've seen "Missy." That's not necessarily a bad thing, but it doesn't feel like this Season is about anything. Since Davies, each Season has worked towards something, but I just can't feel it here.

Oh, I don't know. There certainly are themes running through each episode of the season, such as the Doctor's attitude towards soldiers, Clara's relationship woes and the fact she seems to be herself becoming just like the Doctor, death and an afterlife (or "promised land"). The whole thing with Missy may only be getting minimal coverage, but the season is clearly "working towards something."

 

[Timewalker]

Did you watch Classic Who back in whichever decade was your first introduction to the show? I did. There wasn't that much lag between the PBS reruns of the later Tom Baker stories and Peter Davison's early ones, and I remember the sheer anticipation of watching Castrovalva. We'd just seen the beloved Fourth Doctor die and this new Doctor be 'born' and weren't sure what to expect (other than what we saw in The Five Doctors, which aired before some of the previous Davison stories on the Spokane PBS station).

Well, it was pretty damn good. And the Master's trap in that story involved his using Adric's mathematical abilities in a very creepy way (yes, I'm one of the few people on this planet who liked Adric). To see that retconned with Clara inserted into that episode was a slap in the face.

I'm still collecting the DVDs of Classic Who episodes. Other than the 50th anniversary movie (bought for the Tom Baker scene and the extras), I don't own a single one of the nuWho stories and never will.

At this point I'm watching out of habit and a hope that the show will improve, but as long as Clara the Time Goddess is on the show, I don't see it improving.

 

[Lonemagpie]

I have enjoyed every episode this season, but for some reason I've found this Season to be slightly weak.

Yeah, I'm feeling that - it's like series 6 all over again: love the regulars and the episodes individually, but it is so not working for me as a *series*. And this time, with no split in the middle, I'm not sure why.

Maybe it's jut going to turn out that Moff's odd-numbered seasons are great, and even-numbered ones not so...

 

[Count Zero]

I would have liked the Orient Express to have been placed on an Earth colony world, with retro-20s fashion and technology. This is where the original Doctor Who had an advantage - the people involved had a better understanding of what would work in space. I don't remember a flying steam ship, steam train, or Spitfires in space. (By the way, what was the OE expelling from its smoke stack?)

There were, however, sailing ships in space (in "Enlightenment") which was pretty awesome.


On a sidenote I dislike the term Matt Smith or Tennant fangirls. It tends to come off as disrespectful. People watch shows or are fans of shows for different reasons and I don't feel it's right to differentiate between right and wrong reasons. Besides, there's an underlying notion to the word that implies girls or women can only watch shows where they fancy the lead actor which is nonsense.

 

[Sindatur]

I would have liked the Orient Express to have been placed on an Earth colony world, with retro-20s fashion and technology. This is where the original Doctor Who had an advantage - the people involved had a better understanding of what would work in space. I don't remember a flying steam ship, steam train, or Spitfires in space. (By the way, what was the OE expelling from its smoke stack?)

There were, however, sailing ships in space (in "Enlightenment") which was pretty awesome.


On a sidenote I dislike the term Matt Smith or Tennant fangirls. It tends to come off as disrespectful. People watch shows or are fans of shows for different reasons and I don't feel it's right to differentiate between right and wrong reasons. Besides, there's an underlying notion to the word that implies girls or women can only watch shows where they fancy the lead actor which is nonsense.

I personally have never used it as a blanket statement that meant that's the only a reason a girl (or a guy) can watch a show or movie. However, it is certainly true, that there are people who only watch a show (or intially tune in at least) because of a specific actor or actress. To me, that's not a judgement, and certainly not a depiction of the entire gender, it's merely an acknowledgement that there are indeed viewers/fans who's primary motivation for watching a show or movie is a specific actor or actress.

 

[Romulan_spy]

You know, I get the feeling that Clara is turning into The Doctorwannabe. Face it, she's seen all 12 reincarnations of The Doctor, saved him countless time. No other human knows The Doctor as well as Clara... So much so that she thinks she can take over the title.

You might right according to this teaser for the next episode:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqJb4OmNn_U

 

[SeerSGB]

The end of the movie left me with the impression that Season 8 would be about finding Gallifrey. But he pretty much did find it in the very next episode, and resolved that they can never come back. They send him some help and sealed the crack, so that storyline seemed to be (prematurely) resolved then.

There's no reason to think that Gallifrey can't return just cause the cracks are sealed or that the enemies of the Timelords are lined up to restart the Time War. As the Doctor said in "Day Of The Doctor" he'll just have to go the long way around.

Return Gallifrey and maybe cloak the planet?

It'd be a good way to sign off on Capaldi if he last act was before regenerating was to swoop in at the end of Day Of the Doctor; the orignal 12 save Gallifrey, we get our big boom. Then Capaldi's Doctor reveals that he cracked the problem and changes things so Gallifrey doesn't go anywhere, it just hidden. to anyone that doesn't know how to access it. It's still in our universe, just "protected" from its enemies.

You know, I get the feeling that Clara is turning into The Doctorwannabe. Face it, she's seen all 12 reincarnations of The Doctor, saved him countless time. No other human knows The Doctor as well as Clara... So much so that she thinks she can take over the title.

You might right according to this teaser for the next episode:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vqJb4OmNn_U

So long as they don't go down the whole "Child Of The TARDIS" route or somehow being mutated into a Timelord cause of being spread across the Doctor's time-stream.

All though...crap...it would lead weight to the ideal that Missy is somehow connected to or is Clara.

 

[Mr Awe]

They already found Gallifrey this season, in Listen.

Mr Awe

 

[Skellington]

I think he just left it behind the sofa.

Anyone want to bet that it's in the TARDIS, maybe heated by the Eye Of Harmony?

 

[Mr Awe]

^ Not a bad guess actually! There's definitely room in there!

 

[SeerSGB]

I think he just left it behind the sofa.

Anyone want to bet that it's in the TARDIS, maybe heated by the Eye Of Harmony?

Not a bad ideal. The last Timelord, the last TARDIS, the last Guardians Of Gallifrey and them not even knowing it.

 

[Worf2DS9]

But it seemed like when she left the Tardis in "Kill the Moon", she had already made the decision. She said she didn't want to see the Doctor again, so the next week she's going on one final adventure? Where did that change of heart come from?

Clara is bordering on creep character now, which suffice it to say is a lot worse than what RTD ever did with Rose.

Next week for us, weeks for Clara according to the dialogue. And Danny told her she wasn't really finished unless she was calm.

That's not to say it didn't feel like a cheat when Clara suddenly popped up in a new adventure just like that.

I also couldn't help but notice that the Radio Times poster in the OP did not have Jenna's name headlining at the top or down in the bottom credits, as if they were trying to fool us into thinking Clara wouldn't be in the episode (which actually would have made sense after last week's blow-up).

 

[Lakenheath 72]

In addition to the ships from "Enlightenment", there was the bus from "Delta and the Bannermen". The former was a great serial; I haven't seen the latter.

I was watching the serial "The War Games". Even though it was part of a season, considering the number of episodes, it could be considered a season within a season. With each episode, the audience learned more about what was happening. For me, this is an example of how a 12 or 13 episode arc should be.

The shows Lexx and The Prisoner had season long arcs set in specific locations. Could the writers of the modern Doctor Who create an arc where the Doctor and Companions are at the same location and they unravel a mystery? Each episode would be an adventure at this location, with the mystery always having a presence.

I am worried that the writers will botch this arc by hurriedly adding in the information and concluding it in the last few episodes. This is a terrible misuse of the season long arc in my opinion.

 

[Captrek]

The reviewers felt that the Doctor was being made more into a jerk, and he did a 180 on his opinion of people. In an early episode, the Doctor said that every person was important; this latest Doctor said to Courtney Woods that she wasn't special.

Tenth said the same thing to Donna when they first met.