Spoilers Star Wars: The Last Jedi - Grading & Discussion

Also, as said numerous times, the First Order's grand armada leisurely trailing after the Resistance vessels, taking occassional potshots and launching l the odd TIE fighter wing, was incredibly dumb and as unengaging as the Trade Federation blockade of Naboo.

Fantastic Star Dreadnought design though.

 

Yeah and my emotions are hitting the same peak of depression and frustrations.

 

Go rewqatch the ORIGINAL Star Wars - they SHOW R2 fixing/supplementing Luke's stabilizer (and in a better fashion then 'plugging electronic shorts' as was ridiculously done in TLJ). It's a fairly quick shot though so you need to pay attention to see it.

 

Went to see the movie today... very conflicted about it to be honest.

* Liked Luke's part. But then again he's been my favourite of the OT, so it's always good to see him. And yes, if Yoda knows something, it's failure, and the necessity to learn from it. But incidentally, I don't quite get why Luke didn't learn from his successes. He turned back Vader because he wanted to save his father, not because he confronted evil (like he failed to do in ESB)... and now he's back to confrontation with Ben? Only to sort of remember that fighting for something (in this case the chance for the rebellion to escape) in the end? That's a bit inconsistent and stagnant in characterization. And quite frankly, why, or rather of what, does he die? Reminded me awfully of the needless broken heart explanation for Padme's death - because he was clearly still alive at the end of the projection. If they had shown that such a projection is an enormous drain on his energy, and he's sort of left a lifeless husk, that would have worked better (or they pull another Obi-Wan ANH-stunt - I'd have liked that *g*). That he just sort of decides to go into the force, peaceful or not, doesn't quite work for me.

* Leia - sorry, but don't quite see the point in this character, save that she's part of the OT and therefore has to play a role here. The floating through space-thing was simply ridiculous, force or no force. And otherwise Dern's character had more impact than she had (and one of the best scenes). Of course, she'll be missed in Ep 9, but not because of her importance to the plot itself. Especially since we already got that "Ben can't kill his mother"-moment here.

* Rey and Kylo Ren - liked that connection, even the idea that they are sort of the polar opposite of each other, therefore balancing each other out (puts an interesting spin even on the Chosen-One-prophecy... because who was balancing out Anakin). But could have used a bit more of an explanation how this physical representation of this connection really worked, a representation that Luke saw. And if Rey is drawn to the dark side (while staying in the light), is Ben drawn to the light side while being a darksider himself? That was a bit too ambiguous. But Rey, of course, was awfully naive, especially in thinking that there are only 2 sides: Snoke or Luke's. Still, liked that Ben (keep calling him that for some reason) was fleshed out a bit more here, even if I'd have liked to learn more about how he learned of the dark side, especially given the shrine featuring Vader's mask we saw in TFA. That's a bit missing here. I don't have as many issues with Rey's background, even though I'd have liked her to have some link to the past. However, that was ambiguous enough (just a ploy by Snoke and Kylo?) that it could change in ep 9. But what about the apprentices that Ben took with him the night he destroyed the Jedi temple?

* Finn's plot - stood way too far apart from the rest... actually, I'm considering fast-forwarding those scenes whenever I get the movie on DVD. Granted, the moral of the story was good, but contrived and awfully dragging, and that Rose character did nothing for me. And what about those slave-kids? Force-sensitive boy on planet ruled by gamblers and race-masters? The circle beings anew?

* Poe... well... hot-headed, prone to blowing things up rather than thinking things through... still, with a bit more information maybe he'd have acted differently. Still another plotthread that was a bit overused here. Don't quite understand all the negativity focussed solely on him: Ultimately Leia made the decision to attack the dreadnought that cost those bomber ships in the beginning...

Other tidbits:

* Liked the misdirection the score did with the Emperor's theme in the Snoke-Rey confrontation.

* When Rey and Kylo fought over the lightsabre with their mental powers - why didn't either of them, esp Kylo, pull the trigger (like Kylo just did with Snoke)?

* Loved the Force explanation scene, but: Granted, decades have gone by, but the humour used here was way more Han-like than Luke's.

* the wrong lightsabre: Why did Luke project himself with the blue sword instead of the green one, especially since we've seen Rey with that sword after she left the island. I mean he changed his appearance, his clothes etc, but the lightsabre?

* Honestly, would have preferred Obi-Wan instead of Yoda - because Obi-Wan actually had an apprentice turn on him, so he would have worked quite as well (especially since Luke proved him wrong with Vader).

* could have lived with way less of 3PO. R2D2 is rendered a bit redundant with BB8... but I'd love another K2 - now that was a droid to my liking.

* What was the point of the First Order fleet chasing the Alliance fleet? Why not jump ahead of them or attack them from the side?

* the humour overall was so so... why even go to such lengths? But sorry, I loved the Luke throwing away the sword-moment. Unexpected and so out of the blue. Hamill's delivery was spot on there - but this definitely was his strongest performance, so that scene was just a glimpse of what was to come.

* those critters on the island... urgh, I feared we'd get another dose of ewoks, and those puffins aren't much better (best moment, though was when Chewie ate one of them, hehe)... the crystal cats were much better.

* Someone early on in this thread said that the movie destroys the image of the Jedi Order: Well, I'd say the prequels did that pretty much for me: an inflexible, rigid system full of arrogant fools who made Palpatine's job and their own annihilation pretty simple. So I'd say it's good that they abandon this old system finally and build something new. And even better: They even have Yoda's approval to do so.

Overall, while TFA reminded me awfully of ANH, I came away from it well entertained and smiling, remembering why I like Star Wars. I didn't quite get that feeling from TLJ.

Thank you - now I've got to clean up my keyboard... teaches me something about drinking my tea while reading posts...

 

It was also stated as such by Obi-Wan (Ben) Kenobi in the original Star Wars:

Obi Wan Kenobi: "It's an energy field createdby all living things. It surrounds us, penetrates us, it binds the galaxy together."

No one (at lesast in the OT) even intimated jedi created or had a 'monopoly' on "The Force" - they just learned how to use it to augment and use certain mental and physical abilities.

 

Well, Luke tells Rey that he was planning to die on the island so my take is that after he confronts Kylo, he was able to finally come to term with his actions towards Kylo, he no longer blames himself, he has helped saved the resistance, and even got to say goodbye to his sister. So he accomplished what he needed and was now at total peace and ready to be with the Force. So it kinda makes sense within the narrative of the movie. But I personally would have preferred if he had not died just yet.

 

I'm not a Star Wars fan at all, I've always been a much more into Trek who has a horrible record for movies. I'm a sci-fi fan. The Last Jedi was a horrible sci-fi movie. Take the Star Wars name off of this and you wouldn't be thinking it was a god like movie or whatever BS you are trying to pass off as fact. It's a poorly made movie, a poorly made sci-fi movie and a waste of time Star Wars movie wich sadly Disney is out of time now. Luke and Han are dead in universe and Carrie Fisher is dead in real life.

 

Amazing - everything in that post is wrong.

 

Thanks, I needed that! Looking forward to Star Wars’ version of Star Trek Beyond then.

That stupid line...

 

I saw it Saturday afternoon.. I give it a B.

IMO, it's better than VII. I liked much of it. But there are some big things I did not like. I liked not knowing what would happen. Being surprised is great. Parts had humor that were funny and appropriately timed. Others felt like poorly injected cringe worthy ST5 humor. Some have said they were trying to be Marvel's Avengers. And I think I see what they were saying. Between humor that felt out the Star Wars universe to rapid techno babble to give the B team a mission. They made some bold unexpected choices in this film.

Unlike many, I like how they portrayed Luke's failure. As well as why he retreated from the Galaxy. I just don't like how it was resolved.

Spoiler: Especially

with the loss of Fisher. You would think they would write her out in TLJ. At least Luke can return as a force ghost.

As for the new Trio, I like how they're not infallible. They make mistakes several times.

Spoiler: But

Rey still demonstrates a mastery of the force with out on screen training or trial and error. Luke still couldn't control it by the end of Empire. And since we know TLJ takes off right after TFA, they can't claim of screen. And we're given a precise amount of time that passes from Rey being on AchTo and the final battles.

Some things I've noticed after viewing.

Spoiler: 1.

They're killing the OT trio in reverse order they originally appeared.. 2. Once they kill Leia in IX, the Skywalker bloodline is dead.

 

Y'all are just mad that not only did Rian anticipate the complaints from the vocal minority, he supplied the ammunition to deal with them.

 

The Skywalker bloodline isn't dead, we still have been Kylo Ren. He might be a villain, but he's still a Skywalker.

I thought Luke's death was great, he sacrificed himself to save Rey and Leia, and to confront Kylo face to face one more time. I thought it was a wonderful, heroic ending for the character.

Do we know that Leia will be dead? I don't remember them saying she will be dead. She won't be in the future movies, but that doesn't mean she has to be dead, they could just come up with reasons to keep her offscreen, but still alive. Even if she can't appear onscreen they could always leave her alive so they have the option of using the characters for books, comics, or games.

I have to disagree, I much prefer a flawed hero to an absolutely perfect hero, who never makes mistakes and never does anything wrong.

That's not entirely true, the stuff in the books, comics, and games are also "known facts".

 

Spoiler: Except 9

is supposed to be the end of this trilogy. And given how things turned out in 8, I doubt he survives 9.

 

That's a good point - and I see what you mean. And make no mistake I liked that he found peace (and made peace with himself and what happened with Ben). But in a sense he put himself above what's happening outside of his island. Of course, in a sense with his death he guarantees that the Jedi Order won't be revived, but at what place is the Alliance as a whole? At least Yoda was old when he passed on, but Luke just decides he's at peace and dies. The projection, the moment with Leia that was all great, but IMO the moment of his death could have been handled better.

 

Rethinking post, didn't like what I wrote. Removed post.

 

Yes. Undoubtedly, in the years after the Empire wiped out the Jedi, Obi-wan had much time to reflect upon and appreciate the more spiritual, all-encompassing dimensions of The Force, and understand the ways in which the formalistic Jedi Order had gone wrong.

But prior to that, the Jedi Order in the PT had become arrogant, dogmatic and narrow-minded in their philosophy of The Force, and they considered their way to be the only way. They even made sure that Force-sensitive children in Republic territories were brought into their order, so as to maintain their version of Force orthodoxy. Apparently there wasn't much of a place in Jedi belief for philosophies from other Force-believing traditions from elsewhere in the galaxy, or for personal exploration that didn't conform to their views. Even Qui-Gon's idea of "the living Force" was not the mainstream Jedi view. Yet he was the one who discovered how to maintain individual consciousness after death, a concept that had apparently eluded thousands of years of orthodox Jedi thinking. And when Yoda and a few other characters were exposed to non-Jedi Force traditions during the Clone Wars, there were some very interesting and insightful revelations.

Kor

 

Let me help you out

 

According to IGN the TLJ Visual Dictionary has revealed the names of the kids from the stables at Canto Bight and the stable groom. The Force user is Temiri Blagg, the girl is Arashell Sar, the other boy is Oniho Zaya, and the stable groom is Bargwill Tomder.

 

And I also wasn't bothered about

Spoiler

Snoke getting killed suddenly as this was a thrilling total surprise that really enhanced the characterisation of Kylo Ren and Rey to a certain extent, and Snoke was a "diet" Palpatine given enough build up and presence in TFA.

 

As already mentioned, Kylo Ren is still alive. Further, there is no guarantee that Leia will be killed off. All we know is that Carrie Fisher isn't in the film and Leia won't appear as CGI or archival footage or audio. That doesn't inherently mean she'll die in between films.

Eh. What happens in those mediums don't have immediate bearing to the films themselves. They're supportive material at best. And no, I don't care if they're canon or not (more directed at people in general, not specifically you, JD).