TMP Re-Edit & Restoration Project - Ideas, Feedback, Advise

[Synnöve]

Still working on the Pod Ride. Most exterior color correction should be locked in (waiting for effects work for some cases), now I'm tackling the pod interior.

I tried removing the overly yellow cast from the entirety of those scenes... I'm not entirely sure why they felt the need to shoot them like that. Here is an example of my very rough first draft.

Before:

After:

Suggestions, comments? Should I just leave the yellow cast and tone down saturation or try and realize my removal efforts?

I'd also like to start getting suggestions for how to tackle Vulcan and SanFran. I'd like to use a large establishing shot like the DE does in the beginning of the SF scene, followed by the one we have in theatrical, followed by a shot similar in style to the one I posted a few pages back.

With Vulcan, should I try and photo shop some yellowstone type mattes or tweak the theatrical types?

 

[Maurice]

First suggestion is NEVER call it "SanFran". Only tourists call it that.

Second, can you scale down the pix? They're too big.

 

[Peach Wookiee]

Your friendly neighborhood moderator also requests a scaling down. This is a bit big...

 

[Jeyl]

First suggestion is NEVER call it "SanFran". Only tourists call it that.

Michael Giacchino is a tourist?

Star Trek Into Darkness Soundtrack
12. The San Fran Hustle

 

[Maurice]

Effectively, yes. People here don't call it that. Even "Frisco" is more acceptable, albeit frowned upon. It's "San Francisco", "SF" or "The City" and that's pretty much it.

 

[Synnöve]

Fine, I'll use SF (even though I have next to no familiarity with the city) : P

Pictures updated with smaller versions.

 

[Synnöve]

Took a shot at creating a new Vulcan matte, incorporating original shots from the shoot, yellow stone photos, and Venus volcanoes (among other things), and photoshop's handy oil painting filters, so as to make the background look more like a painted in piece vs the "live action" area on the left. Only piece from the film it self is Spock's head.

I now just need to figure out how to add some water rippling, steam venting... and of course figure out what to do with the other matte shot.

HD version here: https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/-.../XfDz7qfpWzM/w1598-h899-no/Vulcan_Matte1b.png

 

[Mytran]

That's a lovely piece! And FWIW, I've always felt the Transporter Room scene to be out of place, for a lot of the reasons already mentioned upthread.

Another curious issue from the original TMP - when the Epsilon 9 station has just been destroyed, there is a lot of tension on screen. A hushed silence falls upon the crew. The audience are ready for the mission to begin, Kirk announces "pre-launch countdown will commence in twenty minutes" - and THEN we see the crew sitting around waiting for some of those minutes, a lighthearted scene from Disco McCoy (ruining any pathos from the transporter accident), before FINALLY having the ship slowly depart spacedock. Talk about a way to dissolve the tension and remove any momentum!

It may just be me, but shouldn't the action have jumped straight from the Rec Deck to the departure?

 

[Ssosmcin]

First suggestion is NEVER call it "SanFran". Only tourists call it that.

Michael Giacchino is a tourist?

yup, from Jersey.

 

[Synnöve]

A composition of the matte I posted earlier/my replacement for the first Vulcan establishing shot (please watch in HD).

http://youtu.be/BuXdWiPGbO0

I think Spock's movement might need more work. I do feel somewhat proud that I was able to create my Spock from movie shots and behind the scenes photos (no CGI here).

 

[Maurice]

Nice. Much closer to Mike Minor's concept painting.

One issue I have, and had with the concepts, is that the horizon is too low. It's a sadly all too common mistake in matte shots. The Vulcan shot is a down-angle, which means the horizon should be high in the frame.

Here's a section of some of the original photography. I trimmed it down because Bob Burns gave it to me and I don't know that the full image has been released anywhere. The actual horizon line would be at about the height of the top of the uppermost rock at the far left side of the frame.

 

[Synnöve]

That is a good point. I should be able to easily fix it by moving the Venus mountains up somewhat.

I was able to procure that photo, along with Minor's concept (though somewhat low resolution). Tis what I used for the stairs and statue head (The photo that is, not the concept).

I'm really stressing on what to do about the second matte shot as I'll have to incorporate the live action portion in to it and there are no preexisting concepts to go off of. I'll post a concept when I finish one.

*edit*

I think a upscaled DE shot might have to do in this case; the theatrical footage is very dark, and I don't have the skills to create a matte from scratch/CGI the background.

 

[pfontaine2]

I've been following this topic with much interest. I really admire what you've been able to do so far.

I'd like to offer my help in any way. You could say I am a high functioning amateur with lots of experience with 3D and some compositing. If there are any scenes you'd like me to try, I'd be happy to help.

I might try my hand on that Tram scene and see if I can work up something close, just for fun. If you can use it then it's yours. What resolution are you working with?

Lastly, I really like the edit suggestion above regarding the McCoy's transporter scene. The intensity is lost after the Rec Room scene and yet you do need to show how McCoy joins the team.

I would suggest losing the bridge scene and jumping directly from the Rec Room to the transporter engaging and McCoy beaming up to the Enterprise. That scene could then play out as is. I wouldn't mind losing Kirk's "I need you" to McCoy. IMO, it only makes Kirk seem strangely weak and overly needy though I guess that's the reason it's there.

The new Vulcan matte is fantastic. The low horizon makes the location feel like its up in the mountains but raising the horizon is probably the right thing to do.

Thanks again and good luck with this project!

Pierre

 

[Maurice]

There is concept art (drawings) for the reverse angle on Vulcan, there's just not a matte study. It's what the DE Vulcan is (very loosely) based on.

I noticed the rocks in your matte are dry. You obliterated the geothermal pools for a reason?

Also, re pfontaine, the horizon is effectively always at the eye level of the viewer, unless you start getting like REALLY High up. When you look out at airplane window the horizon is basically horizontal to you. All that happens when you cheat the horizon down is that you make the planet appear to be about 1/1000th its actual diameter.

 

[Synnöve]

I'd like to offer my help in any way. You could say I am a high functioning amateur with lots of experience with 3D and some compositing. If there are any scenes you'd like me to try, I'd be happy to help.

I might try my hand on that Tram scene and see if I can work up something close, just for fun. If you can use it then it's yours. What resolution are you working with?

Thank you for the kind words!

I'm working @ 1920x1080 24P (includes scope bars) 10 bit for the footage, 16bit for compositing and effects work.

That'd be much appreciated! As mentioned, I want to implement three shots for the tram sequence: one similar to the first shot in the DE, followed by the theatrical establishing shot, followed by something like this following shot:

http://farm6.staticflickr.com/5034/5909200209_41436bf0f2_o.jpg

However, if possible I'd like the frame opened and the camera bit higher to show some beach, more of the city, and the top of the hanger. I'd wager the hanger and city would be the hardest parts of this, especially since I want all of this work to look like 1979 elements instead of CG.

I'm also interested in doing probably three E shots (the V'Ger island scene, as well as a few others), with a few more for lighting passes (there are some shots where the E has no environmental lighting). I have a model in mind and am well versed in animation, but I have no experience as far as lighting and rendering are concerned.

I'd also kill to have the V'ger model used in the DE.

Lastly, I really like the edit suggestion above regarding the McCoy's transporter scene. The intensity is lost after the Rec Room scene and yet you do need to show how McCoy joins the team.

I would suggest losing the bridge scene and jumping directly from the Rec Room to the transporter engaging and McCoy beaming up to the Enterprise. That scene could then play out as is. I wouldn't mind losing Kirk's "I need you" to McCoy. IMO, it only makes Kirk seem strangely weak and overly needy though I guess that's the reason it's there.

I agree with your conclusions however I'm not sure how this'd be possible; there needs to be some indication that the transporter is fixed so the bridge scene must be retained, and if I move that to before the rec deck McCoy would be absent from the briefing. Another problem would be not enough time passing after the accident... not really sure how to "fix" this as it seems to be an inherent problem in the film that can only be minimized, only way would be to remove the accident entirely however that introduces its own host of problems.

There is concept art (drawings) for the reverse angle on Vulcan, there's just not a matte study. It's what the DE Vulcan is (very loosely) based on.

I noticed the rocks in your matte are dry. You obliterated the geothermal pools for a reason?

I think I might have seen that art, and I'm not sure it can be done with the theatrical footage (unless one had superior 3D and digital painting skills).

The color correction took some of the water contrast out, however if you watch the HD clip on youtube you'll see steam and the shimmer of water in the pools, including one that flows by Spock. I made it very slight so that it doesn't look overtly fake, but I guess it could be more obvious, though the high amounts of video compression surely do not help.

 

[lurok]

I'd also kill to have the V'ger model used in the DE.

Not sure if this helps at all, but in unlikely event you could get hands on original, there are many very talented trek-fan 3d modellers out there who might be willing to help. I could suggest some links if interested. Also, admire work you're doing as well

 

[Maurice]

Sadly, the DE V'ger model is inaccurate. It's too stubby. The Syd Mead side profile line drawing (incorrectly labeled as an early concept) in the Phase II has the correct proportions.

 

[Synnöve]

Are you sure? I have't seen any of Mead's drawings (unfortunately), however this looks somewhat accurate to me:

http://www.foundation3d.com/forums/attachment.php?attachmentid=46242&d=1298561900

 

[Maurice]

It's difficult to say since there was only a models built for the movie (maw, stern, one of the six sides) but considering its reported length versus the width of some of the parts scaled next to people in the photos I'd say the CGI models are all a bit too fat.

Click to embiggen​

Note this one has cross-sections indicated which smacks of a production blueprint.

Click to embiggen​

 

[Synnöve]

That does look somewhat closer save for the "tail fins".

I might know someone who can make a 3D model for this... not sure if he can do high resolution modeling with the needed detail (he mostly works on video games) but I'll inquire.