Kirk, the PD, "The Omega Glory" and "Miri"

[CrazyMatt]

Roddenberry thought this episode was worthy of an Emmy and submitted it for a writing award from memory.

I think Lucas may have been fired by this point?

Well, GR have an ego... He also happened to be the episode writer's best friend.

John Meredith Lucas did produce this episode, but he did not produce the subsequent final episode of the second season, "Assignment: Earth." GR produced that episode as he was trying to use it to sell a spin-off from it.

 

[Botany Bay]

Thankyou guys, I stand corrected, we will give Lucas the "honour" of being Omega Glory's producer

I've always had this suspicion in the back of my mind that Roddenberry may have parted ways with Lucas after Ultimate Computer in order to get Omega Glory (everyone else thought it was terrible, but he thought it was brilliant) and Assignment Earth (a way to possibly get himself employed the following season) made.

For what it's worth, I wish Lucas had done more episodes.

 

[BillJ]

I love "The Omega Glory".

 

[Harvey]

Nobody's perfect, BillJ.

Of course, if they were, they'd like "Genesis" and "Masks" like I do...

 

[The Old Mixer]

I think it's decent, ham & cheesy fun, what with Woodward's scenery chewing and Shatner reciting the preamble....It's not a boring episode.

 

[CrazyMatt]

Lucas wasn't fired. He was contracted to produce the rest of the second season after Coon left, and he did so. Roddenberry took on the producing chores for the last episode, "Assignment: Earth," because it was a backdoor pilot.

Presumably, Roddenberry submitted "The Omega Glory" for Emmy consideration because it was the one episode that season in which he had sole writing credit.

Sorry if I keep echoing your posts. You are obviously quicker on the draw!

 

[Warped9]

I love "The Omega Glory".

I wouldn't say love, but I do like it.

 

[Botany Bay]

Looking forward to seeing what kind of score The Omega Glory pulls on our weekly episode ratings once we get up to it. Opinion seems divided on the TOS forum, as it was at Desilu.

Roddenberry not only thought it was an Emmy-winner, he also let it be the only TOS episode to get the View-Master treatment. But on the other hand I recall a story about one of the editing team almost coming to blows with Shatner after the editor complained to him about the quality of the episode, and some of Shatner's acting in it.

The great man sure gives it his all here :
[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uGO-SldLrNA[/yt]

 

[CorporalCaptain]

I love that speech, especially:

"They must apply to everyone, or they mean nothing!"

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

Kirk, for all his mouth service, blew the PD out of the f***ing water. All Tracey did was try and save a peaceful nation from savages. (putting aside any other motives he may have had).

Quite incorrect. The Khoms took the Yangs' land by force, and frankly, no peaceful nation has a practice of beheading enemies (recall how we were introduced to Cloud William).

By the way, this calls into question Kirk's actions in "The Apple". There Kirk says the PD only applies to a living, growing civilization. WHAT?? Well obviously the civilization on the Omega Glory planet isn't growing, in fact it's about to take a giant step backwards. But the PD very much applies.

The civilization on Omega was growing--until war, followed by oppression followed. Kirk used the "Holy Words" to restore the idea of fair play and justice, rather than the revenge and domination model employed by the Khoms.

edit: A couple of other things, I'm watching the episode now. The psychopathic and greed angle of Tracey is completely unnessecery. His character would have been much more compelling if he felt some grief over killing Galloway and if he had violated the PD out of a true desire to provide immortality to people and not out of greed.

It was not textbook greed. His obsession with immortality was a desperation-induced response to grief. He had the option to just stay on Omega and survive, but his focus on immortality tied into the rapid death suffered by the Exeter's crew.

Also, in Miri a couple of things.

1) So the landing parties are in the habit of beaming down without ascertaining if the dangerous germs are about? Smart Kirk, real smart.

2) Had this been a TNG episode, Picard would have held back the cure from the inhabitants because curing them would violate the PD.

Really? Picard and his crew were no angels, as in "The Best of Both Worlds" (part 2), Riker, et al, had no trouble destroying the Borg cube---full of life forms (yes, the Borg are still partially living beings)...just to save their own asses.

I guess in the TNG era, the end finally justifies the means.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

Tracey had already "contaminated" the planet by taking sides with the Comms and using phasers as well as arming the Comms with the phasers he took from Kirk's party. Advanced tech had already been introduced. Kirk "explaining" the meaning of the Yangs' document hardly complicates matters.

Well said. Phasers in the hands of Khoms (and the Yangs who witnessed the incredible sight of "fireboxes" at work) alters the culture more than someone reading a native document, simply reiterating its meaning.

 

[Dale Sams]

Tracey had already "contaminated" the planet by taking sides with the Comms and using phasers as well as arming the Comms with the phasers he took from Kirk's party. Advanced tech had already been introduced. Kirk "explaining" the meaning of the Yangs' document hardly complicates matters.

Well said. Phasers in the hands of Khoms (and the Yangs who witnessed the incredible sight of "fireboxes" at work) alters the culture more than someone reading a native document, simply reiterating its meaning.

Prior contamination doesn't give you liberty to do anything you want. Kirk pushes an old man out of the way and gets his greasy paws all over a 2,000 year old document and starts waving it around. And Kirk DOESN'T simply reiterate it's meaning. He gives it a sweeping new definition by saying it applies to the Kohms as well.

If Kirk had just left: executions, looting, pillaging, raping (No, I'm not going to give the Yangs any more credit than any other conquering people)

After Kirk leaves: (In story) At the very least the Yang leader has promised vast social reform.

(In reality) As stated earlier in the thread, some sort of in-house struggle probably resulting in the deposing of Cloud William.

That is the definition of the PD *Interference*.

 

[Dale Sams]

I love "The Omega Glory".

I wouldn't say love, but I do like it.

For all my PD talk, I quite enjoy it also. Even with the stuff at the end, it's very good. And Kirk's speech (with the music) still makes the hair stand up on my arms.

"Weeeee the people!"

 

[Warped9]

Tracey had already "contaminated" the planet by taking sides with the Comms and using phasers as well as arming the Comms with the phasers he took from Kirk's party. Advanced tech had already been introduced. Kirk "explaining" the meaning of the Yangs' document hardly complicates matters.

Well said. Phasers in the hands of Khoms (and the Yangs who witnessed the incredible sight of "fireboxes" at work) alters the culture more than someone reading a native document, simply reiterating its meaning.

Prior contamination doesn't give you liberty to do anything you want. Kirk pushes an old man out of the way and gets his greasy paws all over a 2,000 year old document and starts waving it around. And Kirk DOESN'T simply reiterate it's meaning. He gives it a sweeping new definition by saying it applies to the Kohms as well.

If Kirk had just left: executions, looting, pillaging, raping (No, I'm not going to give the Yangs any more credit than any other conquering people)

After Kirk leaves: (In story) At the very least the Yang leader has promised vast social reform.

(In reality) As stated earlier in the thread, some sort of in-house struggle probably resulting in the deposing of Cloud William.

That is the definition of the PD *Interference*.

No, he doesn't reinterpret it. He reiterates what it actually means. And it works in context because the original American Constitution is also meaningless if it doesn't apply to everyone. When it was first drawn up it certainly didn't apply to a whole segment of society that was enslaved in America. But eventually the realization of this crazy paradox was no longer acceptable---it made a mockery of the meaning of the document and the high moral principles Americans professed to stand for.

And in the 1960s, in the midst of racial tensions, this episode was reiterating that message to the audience just as Kirk reiterated to the Yangs.

And there are people today who still cling to notions that the meaning of the Contitution, the principles it espouses, cannot possibly apply to whatever segment or group of people they're against.

 

[Dale Sams]

Well said. Phasers in the hands of Khoms (and the Yangs who witnessed the incredible sight of "fireboxes" at work) alters the culture more than someone reading a native document, simply reiterating its meaning.

Prior contamination doesn't give you liberty to do anything you want. Kirk pushes an old man out of the way and gets his greasy paws all over a 2,000 year old document and starts waving it around. And Kirk DOESN'T simply reiterate it's meaning. He gives it a sweeping new definition by saying it applies to the Kohms as well.

If Kirk had just left: executions, looting, pillaging, raping (No, I'm not going to give the Yangs any more credit than any other conquering people)

After Kirk leaves: (In story) At the very least the Yang leader has promised vast social reform.

(In reality) As stated earlier in the thread, some sort of in-house struggle probably resulting in the deposing of Cloud William.

That is the definition of the PD *Interference*.

No, he doesn't reinterpret it. He reiterates what it actually means. And it works in context because the original American Constitution is also meaningless if it doesn't apply to everyone. When it was first drawn up it certainly didn't apply to a whole segment of society that was enslaved in America. But eventually the realization of this crazy paradox was no longer acceptable---it made a mockery of the meaning of the document and the high moral principles Americans professed to stand for.

And in the 1960s, in the midst of racial tensions, this episode was reiterating that message to the audience just as Kirk reiterated to the Yangs.

Simply put. The Constitution does not apply to conquered peoples.

 

[Warped9]

Simply put. The Constitution does not apply to conquered peoples.

And if someone is espousing high sounding morals yet is going around conquering other peoples and enslaving or marginalizing them then they are the ultimate hypocrates. It's the age old story of oppressors being overthrown and then becoming no better than the ones they replaced.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

Prior contamination doesn't give you liberty to do anything you want. Kirk pushes an old man out of the way and gets his greasy paws all over a 2,000 year old document and starts waving it around. And Kirk DOESN'T simply reiterate it's meaning. He gives it a sweeping new definition by saying it applies to the Kohms as well.

Of course he reiterated its meaning; whether the Yangs understood it or not, the words--as read--do not say, "Yangs only, damn it"!" The words are quite broad to the people, so Kirk merely tells the Yangs (who in all honesty--could have lost the vision of the document meaning over the generations) that the conflict will never end unless the Yang directives apply to all on Omega.

After Kirk leaves: (In story) At the very least the Yang leader has promised vast social reform.

(In reality) As stated earlier in the thread, some sort of in-house struggle probably resulting in the deposing of Cloud William.

That is the definition of the PD *Interference*.

Your In Story point IS the point. Social reform is not really doing something alien to the document's meaning. It is simply enforcing the meaning which has--as Kirk's states--been slurred over the passage of centuries.

 

[Dale Sams]

Of course he reiterated its meaning; whether the Yangs understood it or not, the words--as read--do not say, "Yangs only, damn it"!"

"We the people of The United States of America"=Yangs.

And in your own post you admit that Kirk interfered with the destinations of two civilizations. Whether he "merely" or he "simply"...he did it.

Maybe Kirk would like to hang around and "Merely" point out the hypocrisies in their Bible too. Maybe he should "simply" point out their is no empirical proof for their God.

 

[BillJ]

I agree with Warped9, TREK_GOD_1 and Roddenberry (through Kirk) here. The words of the U.S. Constitution are ultimately meaningless if they don't apply to everyone, friend and enemy alike. The document would likely be the greatest ever created in the history of man if we treated people the way it says we should.

 

[Harvey]

Roddenberry not only thought it was an Emmy-winner, he also let it be the only TOS episode to get the View-Master treatment.

Someone else here has said that Roddenberry picked the episode to get the View-Master treatment because he would get more royalties from the project as the episode's sole credited screenwriter than he would if another episode had been chosen. Not sure if that's true, but it's believable.