Ha, new phrase for the day - had to look that one up.
Are we forgetting why Spock is a great character?
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Heresy is right
The only thing "cheesy" about Spock's death scene, was "what the hell was he doing in that thing?" "What the hell was he fixing in there?"
Count me among the heretical. I saw TWOK the week it opened (I've been watching TOS since 1973 at the age of six). While I didn't find Spock's death scene overly "cheesy", I found it less compelling than what I watched in the cinema this past summer (and will soon watch again). The quality of acting from Pine/Quinto sold the scene more effectively than did Shatner/Nimoy (and I enjoy the work of each).
As for the scream--it had a far more compelling contextual justification than Kirk's scream in TWOK. The character arc building over two films for Spock made the moment far more believable than Kirk's motives for his scream. Certainly one is free to disagree, but let's not pretend that the entire scene is one that should be "obviously bad" to all viewers. And in two packed screenings, I did not hear a single sound that remotely hinted at laughter or any other derogatory thought. More than one person was dabbing at their eyes, though. So anecdotal evidence is rendered moot by other anecdotal evidence (as is usually the case).
Save a spot on the pyre for me too. I felt hurt more when the Enterprise was destroyed than when Spock died. Then again, even at as a kid watching it, I knew they'd bring him back. Doesn't make what the character did any less bold, just that you knew they'd never kill off Kirk, Spock, or McCoy and let them stay dead.
Never liked Kirk's "Khaaaaaaaaaaaaan!" Mainly cause 3 minutes later we find out that there was nothing to worry about cause he knew Spock was waiting with the Enterprise. I've no problem with Quinto's yell being there, just that it felt like he was restraining himself a little when he should have been raging it.
TOTALLY agree about Kirk yelling "Khan" for the reasons you've stated.
I was torn between the two. The connie crashing and Kirk saying, "Bones, what have I done" still gets me to this day.
[HERESY ALERT!] Very astute observation by your wife. Frankly, I thought Spock's death scene in TWOK was cheesy, too. It even had moments of humor. I remember muffled chuckles in the theater three times during the scene (and that included me): 1. When Spock gets up and then thinks enough to straighten his tunic. 2. When he walks into the wall and bounces off because he apparently can't see well. 3. When he seems concerned enough to ask Kirk what he thought of his solution to the no-win scenario. [/HERESY ALERT!]
At least to me, in comparison, Kirk's death scene was far more gut-wrenching with the tight shots, sad music, and real fear expressed by Kirk and real emotion expressed by Spock. The ONLY thing it had in common with TWOK was it was a similar situation done much better than the first time. (Now, I'll just go put on a hard hat to withstand all the rocks and garbage that will be thrown at me. Imagine, an original Trek fan going back to TOS disliking Spock's death scene.)
Heresy is right
The only thing "cheesy" about Spock's death scene, was "what the hell was he doing in that thing?" "What the hell was he fixing in there?"
Count me among the heretical. I saw TWOK the week it opened (I've been watching TOS since 1973 at the age of six). While I didn't find Spock's death scene overly "cheesy", I found it less compelling than what I watched in the cinema this past summer (and will soon watch again). The quality of acting from Pine/Quinto sold the scene more effectively than did Shatner/Nimoy (and I enjoy the work of each).
As for the scream--it had a far more compelling contextual justification than Kirk's scream in TWOK. The character arc building over two films for Spock made the moment far more believable than Kirk's motives for his scream. Certainly one is free to disagree, but let's not pretend that the entire scene is one that should be "obviously bad" to all viewers. And in two packed screenings, I did not hear a single sound that remotely hinted at laughter or any other derogatory thought. More than one person was dabbing at their eyes, though. So anecdotal evidence is rendered moot by other anecdotal evidence (as is usually the case).
As I've already stated, Kirk's "Khan" was useless and over dramatic.
I'm not knocking Chris Pines acting performance BTW. He nailed it even better in STID than he did in ST09. Outstanding job, specifically in the death scene. ... and I can accept his side of that scene. With his mind meld with Spockprime it all fits. It's Spock's side that makes no sense and hadn't been earned in the 2 movies.
Oh, and I wasn't "looking" for laughing folks, it just caught my attention.
Folks are making it sound like I went into the theater with some agenda or something.
I've tried clicking it. Just haven't figured out how the damn thing works.
Guidance please?
Click multi quote for each post added, then Quote on the last post you add.
Sorry bud, just not getting it. I click "multi quote" and nothing happens.
Multiquote should turn yellow when you click it, then when you click Quote on the last post you want it'll up the reply window with each post clicked stacked in one reply window.
Better to show it, I did a quick desktop record on how to use multiquote.
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I surprising myself (as I take Star Trek too seriously) found that quite funny. Just as an aside to this thread I think PrimeSpock should go around giving hints here and there to Starfleet to stop the Doomsday Machine, the giant space Ameoba, Vger, Romulus' Supernova, the whale Probe etc. He could save billions of lives. Not everything they did of course. Just the major things.
I agree that it affects our hero's lives by solving all their problems. Its a big universe with many other problems to deal with. They can solve those.
The worst part is that "Spock phone home" moment meant absolutely nothing. You can remove it and it changes nothing about the rest of the movie.
No.
Maybe. But it still ends up being a small bit of fun.
I like Spoony's take on that scene [34 minute mark, warning: language]
Is the scene needed? No. But it's a bit of misdirection too, cause you think they're setting up for Spock to be the one to die.
While I understand the reasons why nuSpock is more emotional than TOS Spock, it's not something I really care for. Same thing with nuKirk having no father thus being even more rebellious and such when he was younger. I don't care for any of that. I'd like to see Kirk and Spock as they were in their prime because I find that dynamic much more interesting and rewarding. After two films in a row, it would be refreshing to see Pine and Quinto playing the characters at their peak. There might not be a lot of films left for this cast (at this rate, a hypothetical sixth movie would be released in 2025, unless the cast loves Trek that much and wants to keep making more beyond a fourth film, I can't see that happen), so I'd like it for these movies to get past the growing pains for these characters instead of holding onto the frat boy Kirk and emo Spock.
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