common misconceptions about Voyager

[MacLeod]

there is no point in this argument

if she hadn't reverted Tuvix back to being Neelix and Tuvok there would probably be just as much arguing about her still being a murderer for letting Neelix and Tuvok die. This is a no win situation

How would a charge of murdering Neelix and Tuvok work?

What action did she perform that resulted in her personallykilling them did she shot them with a phaser, turn off the life-support? Last I checked failling to act unless you had a duty of care to do so would not result in a murder charge. Starfleet's primary mission is to seek out new life not to exterminate it.

The Transporter can like any bit of technology fail, and surely those that use it accept the risk that it might malfunction when they are in transit and they could be lost. So Tuvok and Neelix accept the risk and with that the consequences.

 

[Guy Gardener]

From watching The Good Wife last week where they kept lawyering to delay an execution... If Tuvix had "confessed" to murdering Neelix and Tuvok, wouldn't Janeway be forced into erecting a trial because it's what the rules demand? And if somehow he was found guilty. The law would further demand that he serve his complete sentence, and anyone that tried to "seperate him" could then be accused of staging a jail break and go to jail themselves?

 

[JarodRussell]

there is no point in this argument

if she hadn't reverted Tuvix back to being Neelix and Tuvok there would probably be just as much arguing about her still being a murderer for letting Neelix and Tuvok die. This is a no win situation

How would a charge of murdering Neelix and Tuvok work?

What action did she perform that resulted in her personallykilling them did she shot them with a phaser, turn off the life-support? Last I checked failling to act unless you had a duty of care to do so would not result in a murder charge. Starfleet's primary mission is to seek out new life not to exterminate it.

The Transporter can like any bit of technology fail, and surely those that use it accept the risk that it might malfunction when they are in transit and they could be lost. So Tuvok and Neelix accept the risk and with that the consequences.

Since the case is absolutely fictional, is there something in real life that comes close?

Maybe organ donation. You do not murder someone by not performing a transplantation.

 

[Anwar]

How would a charge of murdering Neelix and Tuvok work?

Not murder, but a betrayal of her duties. She's the Captain, and she's supposed to protect her crew.

Starfleet's primary mission is to seek out new life not to exterminate it.

Even if said life means the crew she's charged with protecting is now basically dead?

No matter what happened, someone would've ripped into her for what she did. Either she betrays her charge to protect the crew, or she "murders" Tuvix. Either way you'd be ripping into her.

Nevermind if Kirk had been in a similar position you'd be cheering for him to bring back McCoy and Spock.

 

[R. Star]

There's all the moral difference between two people dying in an accident(which let's face it has happened enough in Voyager) and deliberately taking a person's life against their will. That's a line that should never be crossed by any civilized society no matter the circumstances. No one in authority should decide -you- have to die to satisfy the greater good ever.

 

[Guy Gardener]

No. Your CO has the moral authority to say that sometimes you have to die for the greater good. That's part of the job.

The problem here, is that Tuvix died for the greater ho hum.

Compare that to Janeway Grudgingly allowing B'Elanna to flatline momentarily to see the ghost of her mother?

Janeway permitted that girl to kill herself to preserve the greater Meh.

That Dreamwalk was no more beneficial than getting her ears pierced but still she could have died for a lot longer than she anticipated if the Doctor frakked up, surely Janeway had the mora... I think suicide is somewhat illegal since they stopped Kurn from following through on DS9 but Worf had to be guilted by Riker into continuing tp persist in Ethics.

Every couple years the Doctor has to eat a living hologram as sentient as he is to avoid going space crazy. How many living lightbulbs does that chrome dome have to devour until Janeway puts her foot down and stops the ongoing slaughter?

 

[MacLeod]

How would a charge of murdering Neelix and Tuvok work?

Not murder, but a betrayal of her duties. She's the Captain, and she's supposed to protect her crew.

Starfleet's primary mission is to seek out new life not to exterminate it.

Even if said life means the crew she's charged with protecting is now basically dead?

No matter what happened, someone would've ripped into her for what she did. Either she betrays her charge to protect the crew, or she "murders" Tuvix. Either way you'd be ripping into her.

Nevermind if Kirk had been in a similar position you'd be cheering for him to bring back McCoy and Spock.

You are correct in one repect she has a duty to her crew, but she has a higher duty to protect the lifes of civillians. As Tuvix never attended starfleet he was a civillian.

 

[JarodRussell]

Made clear by Captain Sisko in Deep Space Nine (1:31 in the video):

[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1HSJtJZLyls[/yt]

The very same philosophy can be found in the novelization of Wrath of Khan. In the briefing after Saavik's Kobayashi Maru test, Admiral Kirk gives her that dilemma to solve: she and a civilian are lost in shark infested waters, who will she safe? Herself, as Starfleet spent A LOT of resources, and she is more valuable than a simple civilian, or will she safe the civilian?

 

[Guy Gardener]

"Save" dude.

But I suppose if you lock someone in a safe, that the shark can't get in and eat them.

Unless it was a really smart shark.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

I am reading Jarrod's word "safe" in Arnie's voice.

 

[Anwar]

How would a charge of murdering Neelix and Tuvok work?

Not murder, but a betrayal of her duties. She's the Captain, and she's supposed to protect her crew.

Starfleet's primary mission is to seek out new life not to exterminate it.

Even if said life means the crew she's charged with protecting is now basically dead?

No matter what happened, someone would've ripped into her for what she did. Either she betrays her charge to protect the crew, or she "murders" Tuvix. Either way you'd be ripping into her.

Nevermind if Kirk had been in a similar position you'd be cheering for him to bring back McCoy and Spock.

You are correct in one repect she has a duty to her crew, but she has a higher duty to protect the lifes of civillians. As Tuvix never attended starfleet he was a civillian.

And Neelix was also a civilian as well. So by not restoring them she's betraying both her crew AND a civilian.

So she "saves" a civilian by betraying another civilian and her own crewmate.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Tuvix should have knocked a girl up.

"You can't kill the father of my baby!" carries a lot more weight than "I miss my pg13 relationship of nothing more erotic than hand-holding with Neelix."

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

Okay but if that happened Janeway's solution would have given the baby two daddys. Which, in space, is good insurance.

 

[Guy Gardener]

Hmmm.

That wouldn't work.

My Two Dads?

Worst idea ever.

Besides, Janeway would have cut the baby in half too.

 

[TEACAKE'S PLEATHER DOME]

Janeway loves babies. Don't you remember how tenderly she held the Borg baby in its pink blanket? And no, I don't want to hear about the DE-evolutionized sprog.

 

[Guy Gardener]

If they could cut Tuvix's baby into a Vulcan/Human(?) hybrid and a Talaxian/human(?) hybrid, they they could slice almost anyone in half like was done to B'Elanna all the way back in season one.

Which would be weird!

Why would they force Neelix and Tuvok to raise the babies of another man when some frantic woman is screaming about how her baby has been diced?

Hmmm...

If One had survived would he have inherited Mulcahey's parents as his own?

 

[JarodRussell]

I am reading Jarrod's word "safe" in Arnie's voice.

 

[Captain Kathryn]

I think my Halloween name change is appropriate for this thread.

 

[R. Star]

Which reminds me... that 100+ page Tuvix thread hasn't been bumped in awhile.

 

[garaks the best]

Which reminds me... that 100+ page Tuvix thread hasn't been bumped in awhile.

*cough*He was coldly murdered*cough*