Was the reveal of the Enterprise-A a big surprise?

[Belz...]

I don't have a problem with someone asking a second time to clear up a misunderstanding. But that's not what happened.

Oh, yes it is. Anyway, this misunderstanding has now been cleared to my satisfaction. Thanks. I consider the matter closed.

You may not like it--and even I would go for another design--but compared to others I've seen, it's not that bad.

I guess not everyone likes the same thing, right ?

 

[mos6507]

Nothing wrong with fan designs. But the NX-1701-A is hideous.

It's not my favorite either, but I've seen worse.

--Sran

I've had my disagreements with Belz to be sure, but I am with the majority on this. It's not a very good design. I really dislike nacelle struts with curves, which is a big reason why I dislike the JJ Prise. The U-curves on the -D are OK, but when it's just an arc like this it comes across as "bow-legged", like someone left a plastic model in their car and it started to melt. The secondary hull is also too small and nonsensical. It looks like an ergonomic mouse or something.

 

[C.E. Evans]

You may not like it--and even I would go for another design--but compared to others I've seen, it's not that bad.

I guess not everyone likes the same thing, right ?

You get it! Yes!


What one person dislikes, another likes and vice-versa, so taste is a relative thing.

 

[Belz...]

You get it! Yes!


What one person dislikes, another likes and vice-versa, so taste is a relative thing.

I guess it went right over your head, but my point was that you seem to have this compulsion to point out to people who are giving their opinion that it is, in fact, their opinion.

 

[Captain Clark Terrell]

I guess it went right over your head, but my point was that you seem to have this compulsion to point out to people who are giving their opinion that it is, in fact, their opinion.

That's because people often tout their opinions as facts when they're nothing of the sort.

--Sran

 

[C.E. Evans]

I guess it went right over your head, but my point was that you seem to have this compulsion to point out to people who are giving their opinion that it is, in fact, their opinion.

That's because people often tout their opinions as facts when they're nothing of the sort.

Exactly.

Belz, you make broad declarations such as "the design is hideous." If someone else doesn't think so, then they are well within their rights to disagree with you. I hope that didn't go right over your head.

 

[Belz...]

I guess it went right over your head, but my point was that you seem to have this compulsion to point out to people who are giving their opinion that it is, in fact, their opinion.

That's because people often tout their opinions as facts when they're nothing of the sort.

Very true. One must be careful, however. Not everyone puts the "in my opinion" (or equivalent) in every post, so sometimes it may be hard to tell if they are simply expressing an opinion or projecting it onto objective reality.

CE Evans: Saying something is ugly is automatically a statement of opinion, so it's hard to believe you thought I was doing anything else. I, for one, am getting tired of writing "in my opinion" everywhere. So in the future, please assume that any aesthetic or qualitative statement is my opinion, and nothing else.

 

[C.E. Evans]

CE Evans: Saying something is ugly is automatically a statement of opinion, so it's hard to believe you thought I was doing anything else.

You're wrong on both counts. There's a difference between stating something as an opinion and stating something as a fact. You tend to do the latter with your posts.

I, for one, am getting tired of writing "in my opinion" everywhere.

That's really too bad for you, because that's how other people know when someone's expressing an opinion.

So in the future, please assume that any aesthetic or qualitative statement is my opinion, and nothing else.

I'm not going to make a special case for you because you don't feel like expressing yourself clearly.

 

[JarodRussell]

CE Evans: Saying something is ugly is automatically a statement of opinion, so it's hard to believe you thought I was doing anything else.

You're wrong on both counts. There's a difference between stating something as an opinion and stating something as a fact. You tend to do the latter with your posts.

I, for one, am getting tired of writing "in my opinion" everywhere.

That's really too bad for you, because that's how other people know when someone's expressing an opinion.

So in the future, please assume that any aesthetic or qualitative statement is my opinion, and nothing else.

I'm not going to make a special case for you because you don't feel like expressing yourself clearly.

Don't be silly. He's right.

If someone says "This thing looks ugly" and you attack him for it because "he stated it as a fact", the fault lies with you, not him. It's obviously an opinion. By definition it's an opinion. If you want to play some weird version of a grammar nazi who looks for every statement of opinion that doesn't begin or end with "in my opinion" and then go "Yeah well you know that's just like your opinion man", it's your problem alone.

 

[Captain Clark Terrell]

At TrekBBS, all posters are cold posters.

--Sran

 

[C.E. Evans]

CE Evans: Saying something is ugly is automatically a statement of opinion, so it's hard to believe you thought I was doing anything else.

You're wrong on both counts. There's a difference between stating something as an opinion and stating something as a fact. You tend to do the latter with your posts.
That's really too bad for you, because that's how other people know when someone's expressing an opinion.

So in the future, please assume that any aesthetic or qualitative statement is my opinion, and nothing else.

I'm not going to make a special case for you because you don't feel like expressing yourself clearly.

Don't be silly. He's right.

If someone says "This thing looks ugly" and you attack him for it because "he stated it as a fact", the fault lies with you, not him. It's obviously an opinion. By definition it's an opinion. If you want to play some weird version of a grammar nazi who looks for every statement of opinion that doesn't begin or end with "in my opinion" and then go "But that's just like your opinion man", it's your problem alone.

That's all total bullshit. And that's a fact.

 

[JarodRussell]

You're wrong on both counts. There's a difference between stating something as an opinion and stating something as a fact. You tend to do the latter with your posts.
That's really too bad for you, because that's how other people know when someone's expressing an opinion.

I'm not going to make a special case for you because you don't feel like expressing yourself clearly.

Don't be silly. He's right.

If someone says "This thing looks ugly" and you attack him for it because "he stated it as a fact", the fault lies with you, not him. It's obviously an opinion. By definition it's an opinion. If you want to play some weird version of a grammar nazi who looks for every statement of opinion that doesn't begin or end with "in my opinion" and then go "But that's just like your opinion man", it's your problem alone.

That's all total bullshit. And that's a fact.

Here's a threadbomb for future use then:

 

[C.E. Evans]

^^^
The same applies to you, definitely.

 

[Captain Clark Terrell]

"There are four lights!"

Fact or opinion, people?

--Sran

 

[C.E. Evans]

When people include themselves in a sentence, you know that they're talking about how they personally feel about something--it's an opinion. But when someone makes a broad generalization that "this is that" and you don't agree, eh, then it becomes an issue for debate.

 

[EliyahuQeoni]

When people include themselves in a sentence, you know that they're talking about how they personally feel about something--it's an opinion. But when someone makes a broad generalization that "this is that" and you don't agree, eh, then it becomes an issue for debate.

Yes, you are free to debate on the disagreement, but it is beyond stupid to point out "That's just your opinion" when that is obviously the case, even if the person didn't specifically say "In my opinion..."

 

[Belz...]

You're wrong on both counts. There's a difference between stating something as an opinion and stating something as a fact. You tend to do the latter with your posts.

I'm sorry but that's ridiculous: NOTHING can be objectively ugly or attractive. Just like nothing is objectively good or bad or moral or tasty. I have no idea how you could possibly interpret a statement of that nature as anything else than personal opinion.

But at least now I see what the source of our disagreement is.

 

[dub]

Ah, but some people believe their opinions are facts on this board, so it's not a bad idea to specify.

I can't remember if seeing the Enterprise A was a surprise to me initially. But it was a surprise to the crew and a nice moment. A great way to wrap up the arc of II through IV. Spock died and was reborn, Kirk was given a rebirth as captain again so to speak, and here the destroyed Enterprise was reborn in a way. And while the score for this film is my least favorite among the classic Trek films, I think the cue during the Enterprise reveal scene and going into the end credits is quite nice.

 

[The Old Mixer]

The reveal was such a surprise that this thread has spoiled me--I was going to get around to watching that movie someday, goddammit!

 

[JarodRussell]

Ah, but some people believe their opinions are facts on this board, so it's not a bad idea to specify.

But that's just your opinion, right?