Not an original idea in the whole damn thing. Lots of plot holes and failures to bring true character development. Cool effects, though. A "gentleman's" C-, at best.
I'll bit: What plot holes?
STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]
- Thread starter Agent Richard07
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I'll bit: What plot holes?
The TOS Scotty would have had no problems with new torpedoes.
In truth, the modified (suspended animation) torpedoes need to be called drones--at least we know the JJprise can deliver a full broadside. I assume the neck torps are TOS ball lightning blobs
Now I actually identified with Admiral Marcus a bit, the speech about who is going to protect starfleet"...you?"
I think Kirk took that to heart.
Having Spock and Kirk swtich roles (Khan's healing blood was telegraphed early so I wasn't really worried--but the scene worked until the "Khaaan" bit).
I was hoping Khan might actually be a good guy at the end of the movie and serve on the Enterprise, finally giving us closure to Space Seed. Khan would be given a new world and no one dies.
I loved Enterprise in the ocean. The do anything ship.
Saw the NIF chamber for the warp core http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Ignition_Facility
The only thing I hated was the Vengence's sound effect as it overtook the Enterprise. What was that? A motorboat?
Khan and Spock have similar strength, so I liked the fight.
Saw a Kazon/Trabe ship hover at Earth--modified by Eaves?
Now the JJprise looks to have a more extensive impulse deck
In truth, the modified (suspended animation) torpedoes need to be called drones--at least we know the JJprise can deliver a full broadside. I assume the neck torps are TOS ball lightning blobs
Now I actually identified with Admiral Marcus a bit, the speech about who is going to protect starfleet"...you?"
I think Kirk took that to heart.
Having Spock and Kirk swtich roles (Khan's healing blood was telegraphed early so I wasn't really worried--but the scene worked until the "Khaaan" bit).
I was hoping Khan might actually be a good guy at the end of the movie and serve on the Enterprise, finally giving us closure to Space Seed. Khan would be given a new world and no one dies.
I loved Enterprise in the ocean. The do anything ship.
Saw the NIF chamber for the warp core http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Ignition_Facility
The only thing I hated was the Vengence's sound effect as it overtook the Enterprise. What was that? A motorboat?
Khan and Spock have similar strength, so I liked the fight.
Saw a Kazon/Trabe ship hover at Earth--modified by Eaves?
Now the JJprise looks to have a more extensive impulse deck
Woah. Just returned from seeing the movie again. I'm glad I did. Plot makes more sense now that I know what I'm looking for. We enjoyed it very much (me and the wife).
And I couldn't spot anything besides the impulse deck and nacelle fins that are different at the end. We didn't get to see the deflector, however, the only other thing that was massively damaged in the movie.
And I couldn't spot anything besides the impulse deck and nacelle fins that are different at the end. We didn't get to see the deflector, however, the only other thing that was massively damaged in the movie.
I just saw STID and I loved it.
I do find myself hoping that they don't use Khan again for awhile, though. Let him stay a popsicle. He got what he deserved, in the end.
I do find myself hoping that they don't use Khan again for awhile, though. Let him stay a popsicle. He got what he deserved, in the end.
Broken link.
EDIT: Not sure I see it properly. Is that an added detail on there ? Anyway, very minor.
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Thanks for the link! It's almost an engineering deck plan, like in the old Star Trek Fact Files
I went to to see this last week as my 'birthday treat', and if i'm totaly honest I was massivly disapointed 
It's not so much that it was bad, just the fact that there was soooooo much missing!
If this is Star Trek for a new generation, where were the back storys?
I found it as entertaining as i did frustrating lol
It's not so much that it was bad, just the fact that there was soooooo much missing!
If this is Star Trek for a new generation, where were the back storys?
I found it as entertaining as i did frustrating lol
You want backstory? Read the comics. Read the apps. (I am probably missing something.)
In this new age of entertainment, the people involved are expecting that people have a familiarity with other products, so as to have a fuller story of what is happening. If you did what they expected, you would have read a comic series and played a video game, and two references in the movie would not have come out of the blue. They are awarding you for your loyalty to the brand with these Easter eggs.
There are surprises in the comics. According to one issue, this Federation in the alternate universe achieved what the one in the prime hadn't done by 2260. The Federation spans 8,000 light years and has 150 members.
In this new age of entertainment, the people involved are expecting that people have a familiarity with other products, so as to have a fuller story of what is happening. If you did what they expected, you would have read a comic series and played a video game, and two references in the movie would not have come out of the blue. They are awarding you for your loyalty to the brand with these Easter eggs.
There are surprises in the comics. According to one issue, this Federation in the alternate universe achieved what the one in the prime hadn't done by 2260. The Federation spans 8,000 light years and has 150 members.
^I just take that to mean that Federation-Prime has been stagnant for 100 years. It's something I can very easily imagine, going by Picard's ultra-pretentious monologues during early TNG.
"Wile E. Coyote. Super-Genius."
Still never caught that roadrunner, though.
As hard to write it here as it is for the guys writing for TV.
I do get weirded out by the odd accusation that my various (I thought innocent) posts reveal my "hidden agenda". So hidden, it's even hidden from myself. Still never worked that one out.
And yes, it's also tricky if you've been living with a ST truism for four decades and you finally find out it's not necessarily the only interpretation. Or when an innocent typographical error in the ST Encyclopedia becames a mandated change because novel authors of a particular era were told to use the ST Encyclopedia as the definitive guide for all spellings.
But that's all part of the fun of being in a fandom.
I disliked "ST V: The Final Frontier" and a lot of early DS9 and VOY, but I stuck with them through (often) multiple viewings because even really "bad" ST can have little gems to enjoy - and most ST withstands repeat viewings, with new insights waiting to be discovered.
Always a no-win scenario for the writers.
Had STiD had few or no easter eggs whatsoever, you can bet this board would be maligning Bad Robot for "lost opportunities".
* "You could have toyed with the fans more by giving Carol Marcus a hairstyle that immediately reminded us of a previous canon character, such as Elizabeth Dehner!"
* "That trader vessel could have been confiscated from a known trader, such as... Harry Mudd. Or his daughter. Or some K'Normians from TMP."
* "Talking about traders, you could have dropped a hint about Cyrano Jones' wherabouts. And he could have brought on board... tribbles!"
* "You could have been really brave and made John Harrison reveal that he was... Khan!"
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Broken link.
EDIT: Not sure I see it properly. Is that an added detail on there ? Anyway, very minor.
Not that minor. The dome structure above the bridge-deck is much more visible from this back view now after the refit.
Compare it with a shot from '09 where it is nearly flush with the structure behind it:
http://movies.trekcore.com/gallery/albums/xihd/trekxihd1006.jpg
I not 100 % sure, but I think they changed the height of the bridge-deck for that refit. Or something else.
trevanian
Rear Admiral
I hope there are interviews with the ILM guys soon. I'd love to know what else they changed.
FXGUIDE.com has already got article, interview & podcast up. I don't think CINEFEX comes out for another month. No mention of anything interesting FXwise in the icgmagazine.com piece.
I hope there are interviews with the ILM guys soon. I'd love to know what else they changed.
FXGUIDE.com has already got article, interview & podcast up. I don't think CINEFEX comes out for another month. No mention of anything interesting FXwise in the icgmagazine.com piece.
Thanks.
I saw the movie 2 weeks ago and still haven't been able to make up my mind about it.
On the one hand, it's a good action movie with enough humour, emotions and ST-references to keep a fan happy... on the other hand I feel that this movie is kind of a missed opportunity due to trying to keep fans happy.
* Why have 2 villains - and neither of them really fleshed out? Introducing Section 31 was a nice touch, and it makes sense in this nuTrek-universe, and it would have worked as kind of a background thread that weaves throughout a couple of movies, kind of a plot arc, but Adm Marcus came across as paranoid warmonger. And we didn't really get a reason for his conflict with his daughter. I'm a fan of connecting people and places, but those connections have to have explanations, they don't just work because TPTB want them to.
The same applies to Khan. Did Harrison really have to be Khan? I felt that was forced because just the name doesn't bring back the character itself. So why not have a genetically engineered villain called Harrison? Section 31 could have worked with volunteers and genetically enhanced them - and then used them as kind of toy soldiers. Harrison escapes and starts his revenge. Khan's background wasn't changed, since the Botany Bay has been in space for generations, so every one (i.e. ST-fans) knows he's evil. And even if he's able to make sense to this Kirk we as the viewers know his real agenda. And that takes away from the suspense. It's no longer a question of who's right, but rather of when is he going to reveal himself.
* I really liked the symmetry of the death scene to TWOK. But why cheapen Kirk's sacrifice via Khan's all-healing blood? When I saw that scene in the trailer I thought it would be Pike sacrificing himself in the TWOK-way. And honestly, in retrospect I'd have preferred that to this rather simple resolution (and Pike's senseless death early in the movie). And it would have meant that there's no ready-made all healing blood lying around in some cryochamber on Earth for future use.
* Did Uhura really have to have such a big role, being in practically every scene and talking about emotions whenever (in)appropriate? Saldana's a big name now, granted, but I'm a fan of using characters when it makes sense, not just because the actors have to have a certain amount of screen time.
* Back to Carol Marcus: In the last scene when the Enterprise is recomissioned and Kirk welcomes her as a member of the family... when she turned around after that, I definitely wouldn't have been surprised had she been pregnant...
* 3d: Unfortunately, around here the movie was only available in 3d, but I think it would have worked better for me without it. Lense flares *and* fast movement *and* 3d were a bit too much IMO.
I certainly hope for the next movie that it's going to be original material and a bit less action-heavy. Let the characters grow and shine - after all that's always been the strength of ST. At least IMO.
On the one hand, it's a good action movie with enough humour, emotions and ST-references to keep a fan happy... on the other hand I feel that this movie is kind of a missed opportunity due to trying to keep fans happy.
* Why have 2 villains - and neither of them really fleshed out? Introducing Section 31 was a nice touch, and it makes sense in this nuTrek-universe, and it would have worked as kind of a background thread that weaves throughout a couple of movies, kind of a plot arc, but Adm Marcus came across as paranoid warmonger. And we didn't really get a reason for his conflict with his daughter. I'm a fan of connecting people and places, but those connections have to have explanations, they don't just work because TPTB want them to.
The same applies to Khan. Did Harrison really have to be Khan? I felt that was forced because just the name doesn't bring back the character itself. So why not have a genetically engineered villain called Harrison? Section 31 could have worked with volunteers and genetically enhanced them - and then used them as kind of toy soldiers. Harrison escapes and starts his revenge. Khan's background wasn't changed, since the Botany Bay has been in space for generations, so every one (i.e. ST-fans) knows he's evil. And even if he's able to make sense to this Kirk we as the viewers know his real agenda. And that takes away from the suspense. It's no longer a question of who's right, but rather of when is he going to reveal himself.
* I really liked the symmetry of the death scene to TWOK. But why cheapen Kirk's sacrifice via Khan's all-healing blood? When I saw that scene in the trailer I thought it would be Pike sacrificing himself in the TWOK-way. And honestly, in retrospect I'd have preferred that to this rather simple resolution (and Pike's senseless death early in the movie). And it would have meant that there's no ready-made all healing blood lying around in some cryochamber on Earth for future use.
* Did Uhura really have to have such a big role, being in practically every scene and talking about emotions whenever (in)appropriate? Saldana's a big name now, granted, but I'm a fan of using characters when it makes sense, not just because the actors have to have a certain amount of screen time.
* Back to Carol Marcus: In the last scene when the Enterprise is recomissioned and Kirk welcomes her as a member of the family... when she turned around after that, I definitely wouldn't have been surprised had she been pregnant...
* 3d: Unfortunately, around here the movie was only available in 3d, but I think it would have worked better for me without it. Lense flares *and* fast movement *and* 3d were a bit too much IMO.
I certainly hope for the next movie that it's going to be original material and a bit less action-heavy. Let the characters grow and shine - after all that's always been the strength of ST. At least IMO.
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