STAR TREK INTO DARKNESS - Grading & Discussion [SPOILERS]

[Therin of Andor]

Everybody is so quick to Dismiss Star Trek V, but I would go back and watch that before watching into Darkness. At Least in Trek V they got the Trio of Kirk, Spock and Mccoy Right.

One of the only things that Shatner got right.

There was still too much insistance on Humor and especially Scotty suffered in the film by using his as Comic Relief

Scotty bumping his head was absolutely hilarious in the ST V trailer, but less so in the context of the whole movie. We got to see the trailer for the first time at a marathon cinema screening of ST: TMP/ST II/ST III/ST IV. We laughed like drains.

In retrospect, though, with ST IV, we had laughed with the characters. In ST V, we laughed at them. (I well remember squirming in my seat on opening night of ST V.)

fans bitched about that then and now are alright that Simon Pegg's Scotty is suffering the same fate.

There is a difference. Simon Pegg is an amazing comedy actor. I think I first got to know his work in "Paul". James Doohan was great in his own way, but ST V? Bleh.

 

[cbspock]

Has anyone watched the history channel special Trek Secrets of the Universe. It has an extended version of the Kirk standing at the view screen / window scene when the Enterprise is stopped in Klingon space. The camera starts a lot further out and the Enterprise appears upside down as the camera moves in and spins.

http://www.history.com/shows/star-trek-secrets-of-the-universe/videos#


-Chris

 

[cbspock]

Star Trek 5 is like a season 3 episode. It has some good character moments in it, and some bad ones too. It felt more like the series though.


-Chris

 

[mos6507]

Scotty bumping his head was absolutely hilarious in the ST V trailer, but less so in the context of the whole movie.

What I find so interesting is that this scene kind of typifies the TOS movies jumping the shark, and yet when you send Simon Pegg through the brewery tubes in 2009 Trek as if it's a scene from Willy Wonka, that's considered brilliant moviemaking. I guess that's the difference with using a younger actor and a whole different generation of audience for you. But certainly the slapstick tone is exactly the same.

 

[Therin of Andor]

when you send Simon Pegg through the brewery tubes in 2009 Trek as if it's a scene from Willy Wonka, that's considered brilliant moviemaking.

Who was saying that?

 

[shatastrophic]

The second time for me was better, trying to wrap my head around it after the first viewing made me realize that 90% of the story occurs off screen.

All we see on screen is; mission at the beginning, loss of command, attack on hq, warp to Kronos and get Khan, race home without dying. When you think about it alot of the story has already occured off screen. Marcus has a plan to start a war Cheney style and it has a little to do with Vulcan's fate, Khan de-rails that plan a bit, but Marcus is able to make it work to his benefit.

Then the movie starts, and Kirk and Co mess up Marcus's plan even more. Its really not that much and alot of what I thought were plot holes after the first time, were explained in an offline at the beginning or end of a scene.

I think Spock yelling Khan was not silly after thinking about what old Spock would've said to young Spock concerning how they defeated him. Of course old Spock told them that one of them had to sacrifice themselves to survive. NuSpock yelled Khan because in just acting to save the ship there was no way around it here either, one of them had to sacrifice themselves...and at that point Khan still wasn't defeated. The first time I saw it, it seemed cheesy but on the second time it did not.

My wife made a comment, I know its not applicable but I thought it was cute. Shes not fully up on the alternate reality thing, she still in some ways thinks its a reboot and with some of the stuff we see shes right. But when the tribble came back to life she stated, "Ahh, so that's how they multiple so quickly...Khan's blood's regenerating powers!" I just said yeah probably, but I though it was cool.

 

[ConRefit79]

And please bring back the optimism of old trek, Fans all of a sudden say that notion is quaint, I say that notion is what kept Trek Going for 50 years, and it is needed as much today, if not more, than it was needed 50 years ago.

I would say it's needed more. The world has been so dark and ugly since 2001. Sometimes its difficult to imagine how we'll ever get to the world of Star Trek. And now some Hollywood thinks its best to bring the people of the Star Trek universe down to our level.

 

[ConRefit79]

the effect were stilted by a non -existant budget, the story was also gimped by the budget, There was still too much insistance on Humor and especially Scotty suffered in the film by using his as Comic Relief, fans bitched about that then and now are alright that Simon Pegg's Scotty is suffering the same fate.

The budget was small, but the effects problem is due to the hard date set by the Studio and the fact that ILM was booked and could not do the effects.

The studio is also to blame for the bad shoe horned humor. The story was initially darker. But the studio wanted laughs cause it worked in the ST:TVH and drew more non Trek fans.

 

[gornsky]

Scotty bumping his head was absolutely hilarious in the ST V trailer, but less so in the context of the whole movie.

What I find so interesting is that this scene kind of typifies the TOS movies jumping the shark, and yet when you send Simon Pegg through the brewery tubes in 2009 Trek as if it's a scene from Willy Wonka, that's considered brilliant moviemaking.

Yeah, who says that? Even the people I know who LOVE ST09, to a man, think that's a stupid scene.

 

[BillJ]

And please bring back the optimism of old trek, Fans all of a sudden say that notion is quaint, I say that notion is what kept Trek Going for 50 years, and it is needed as much today, if not more, than it was needed 50 years ago.

I would say it's needed more. The world has been so dark and ugly since 2001. Sometimes its difficult to imagine how we'll ever get to the world of Star Trek. And now some Hollywood thinks its best to bring the people of the Star Trek universe down to our level.

How exactly have they been brought down to our level? I didn't see people concerned with Kirk stooping to our level in episodes like Arena, Devil in the Dark, The Conscious of the King and Obsession. We watched him struggle with his darker impulses and come out better for it, just like we're watching this version of the character due the same.

 

[ConRefit79]

That's funny, because walking out of this movie was the most optimistic I have felt about Trek since Wrath of Khan.

Yeah but for 2 hours you see man at his worse. When they tried to spotlight our problems on TV, the Aliens they encountered portrayed them most of the time. And there wasn't always a need for all out space battle.

 

[ConRefit79]

How exactly have they been brought down to our level? I didn't see people concerned with Kirk stooping to our level in episodes like Arena, Devil in the Dark, The Conscious of the King and Obsession. We watched him struggle with his darker impulses and come out better for it, just like we're watching this version of the character due the same.

Admiral Robocop. Adrmiral Facelift. Khan. And many of the people in these films are too similar to us.

 

[BillJ]

How exactly have they been brought down to our level? I didn't see people concerned with Kirk stooping to our level in episodes like Arena, Devil in the Dark, The Conscious of the King and Obsession. We watched him struggle with his darker impulses and come out better for it, just like we're watching this version of the character due the same.

Admiral Robocop. Adrmiral Facelift. Khan. And many of the people in these films are too similar to us.

Human being human? Whodathunkit?

 

[ConRefit79]

Human being human? Whodathunkit?

People today are quite different from 1813. Wouldn't you expect them to be different in the 2250's?

 

[BillJ]

Human being human? Whodathunkit?

People today are quite different from 1813. Wouldn't you expect them to be different in the 2250's?

Not in a movie made for audiences of 2013. Star Trek characters have always been reflective of the times Trek was made in.

 

[Kpnuts]

I love the look Khan gives Marcus after he says "If you think you're safe at warp, you're wrong". Almost willing her to go alert the bridge.

 

[ConRefit79]

I love the look Khan gives Marcus after he says "If you think you're safe at warp, you're wrong". Almost willing her to go alert the bridge.

But you're never safe at Warp. All prior Trek establishes that ships can be caught and fired upon while at Warp. Now Star Wars has never shown that. Are we certain anyone involved has a clue about Star Trek?

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Human being human? Whodathunkit?

People today are quite different from 1813. Wouldn't you expect them to be different in the 2250's?

No. It's a movie.

 

[Squiggy]

I love the look Khan gives Marcus after he says "If you think you're safe at warp, you're wrong". Almost willing her to go alert the bridge.

But you're never safe at Warp. All prior Trek establishes that ships can be caught and fired upon while at Warp. Now Star Wars has never shown that. Are we certain anyone involved has a clue about Star Trek?

Probably not, seeing as how I enjoyed this much more than any trek from the previous decade and a half.

 

[Belz...]

Yeah, who says that? Even the people I know who LOVE ST09, to a man, think that's a stupid scene.

I don't think it's a stupid scene. I thought it was amusing.

Not in a movie made for audiences of 2013. Star Trek characters have always been reflective of the times Trek was made in.

This.

But you're never safe at Warp. All prior Trek establishes that ships can be caught and fired upon while at Warp.

I think maybe he was refering to the fact that no one expected the Vengeance to catch up to the state-of-the-art Enterprise.