If only they would have taken Season 7 Troi (Or Movie Troi) and put her in Season 3, the character might have been a little more tolorable. I mean I've always liked the outfit (especially the Blue dress) but everything else just felt wrong.
Season THREE OFFICIAL TNG Blu-Ray Discussion Thread
- Thread starter Salinga
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If only they would have taken Season 7 Troi (Or Movie Troi) and put her in Season 3, the character might have been a little more tolorable. I mean I've always liked the outfit (especially the Blue dress) but everything else just felt wrong.
I've been meaning to post my impressions here, but am just now doing it. First, these releases did get covered by a local US TV station. See that here.
Now, I must say the picture is spectacular. The colors truly pop (especially with so many shows/movies filmed in that washed-out, gray style these days), the effect shots are amazing and the new planets are great. I've mainly stuck with my favorite episodes so far like "The Defector," "Best of Both Worlds," and others...and still others I enjoy I haven't had a chance to watch yet.
I've sampled some of the extra features too--the documentary is quite interesting. I knew there was some strife in the writers room, but I had no idea...wow. On the BOBW side, the commentary was quite entertaining--great to hear from Shelby's actress.
I still need to watch about half the episodes and the writer's roundtable. One other cool thing, Amazon refunded me the price difference after my copy shipped--kudos to them!
Now, I must say the picture is spectacular. The colors truly pop (especially with so many shows/movies filmed in that washed-out, gray style these days), the effect shots are amazing and the new planets are great. I've mainly stuck with my favorite episodes so far like "The Defector," "Best of Both Worlds," and others...and still others I enjoy I haven't had a chance to watch yet.
I've sampled some of the extra features too--the documentary is quite interesting. I knew there was some strife in the writers room, but I had no idea...wow. On the BOBW side, the commentary was quite entertaining--great to hear from Shelby's actress.
I still need to watch about half the episodes and the writer's roundtable. One other cool thing, Amazon refunded me the price difference after my copy shipped--kudos to them!
I am curious how that single tear looks in "Sarek" when he cries. That shot always bugged me with how frozen Sarek's face was.
Let's see, Picard alone gets it in "Booby Trap", Riker and Geordi get it in "The Enemy", and Beverly switches to a one-piece with a seam down the middle, Worf and Data get it in "The Price", Beverly's uniform loses the seam in "The Defector", and O'Brien gets it when he reappears after several episodes in "The Hunted."
The rest of the crew magically receive them right after Riker gives the order to fire on the Borg cube.
The animated tear itself looks better than I remember, but Sarek himself remains a still image.
trevanian
Rear Admiral
And yet all of the TNG fans love BOBW, which is about as contemporary and non-enlightened as you can get vis a vis Shelby out to get Riker's job -- pure soap opera, right down to the apparently evil vixen. On first viewing, I remember turning to my then-girlfriend and saying something like they must have had Roddenberry out of the room when they did this one.
It wouldn't have seemed so objectionable to me except for the fact it really ran in the face of all the 'we're so enlightened' platitudes Capt. Baldy kept trotting out (yeah, you can tell I'm not a TNG fan, right? Well, I will admit that I find season 3 to be about as good as I could have hoped for with the show -- probably because they didn't have time to rewrite everything into the ground, from what I've read.)
Season 3 of TNG on BR ... yeah, strange as it sounds, I will probably buy it at some point -- gotta have something to hold me over till DS9 gets remastered (not holding breath on that one!), now that I've got TOS series and features BR'd.
The lack of time doesnt seem to be a bad thing. AGT was also written in a hurry, while GEN took one year. I guess if you have no time, the writers and producers dont question bold moves in a story so much, so instead of taking them back/smoothing them out, they are left in and as a result the story has some edges that make it special.
I'm just now listening to this. It's interesting that right off the bat Dan Curry misidentifies this shot as original and not CG. He's asked by Mike Okuda to give details about the shot and he says something to the effect of, "The Enterprise is the 4-foot miniature built by Greg Jein and the bird of prey was built by ILM for Star Trek III."
Now, while it's true this shot was done by CBS Digital for the Next Level sampler disc before Curry was brought aboard the Blu-ray project for S2... and he's probably confusing it with the same shot he re-supervised for "A Matter of Honor" which does in fact have the original miniature elements in it... it's still wrong because that was the 6-foot Enterprise miniature and not the 4-footer (because that wasn't built until S3) and "Sins of the Father" just originally used that S2 shot. But he should know all this because he was the VFX supervisor for both episodes back in the day and the shot should be fresh in his mind from S2. He should have said, "Wait a minute... that's not the shot we just worked on. What is this crap? That looks terrible!"
But of course, CBS Digital decided not to replace the shot with the found elements from S2 and instead retained Max Gabl's digital matte with the CG ships.
If only there were an image on the internet that was from TNG which properly expressed exasperation.
I agree also. The writers were frustrated, because Roddenberry's "box" forced them to think outside the usual box of conflict that writers use. Roddenberry's vision for TNG was to show a different culture, not just the 21st century culture in a 24th century setting. For writers it is always more easy to just take todays human behaviour and put it into another surrounding - just because it makes their job easier (easy earned money). Because of Roddenberry's rules they could not do just that. They actually had to wrap their mind around human beeings that behaved different than they do today.
I lost interest in DS9 during the later seasons, when it pretty much became a show about 21st century culture in the 24th century setting of Star Trek. It became boring to me, because it was just the usual stuff. The writers of course loved it, because it was much easier for them to do their job. And maybe some viewers too, because they could relate better to the characters, since they behaved not so much different anymore like todays characters. I personally didnt, because that is not why I watch Star Trek.
I lost interest for those very same reasons. There was conflict, drama and action but it was, like you said, the usual stuff. I didn't find it believable that the people of that time would be acting so much like us. TNG felt much more real to me and actually gave me something to aspire to.
It's the same issue I had with DS9 post s4. Very little exploring, boring drab colours and the same monotonous war which kept on going and going and going. Sure, it was good for what it was but it didn't provide any where near the enjoyment I get whilst watching TNG. 
For me it was the opposite. TNG became stilted, boring and pretentious. DS9 went back to more of what was at the heart of the original series, social commentary and action adventure. I think current events eventually caught up with DS9. Homefront / Paradise Lost and the Dominion War issues sure came to the front after 9/11. I think DS9 has aged better, while TNG is stuck in the 80s. Voyager was awful when they tried to be TNG Lite, it was a much better show when it was not trying.
-Chris
Likewise.
Roddenberry's Box was not some technique to get writers to think more creatively or write stories that would add to the overall uniqueness to Star Trek. It was just a tool that Roddenberry insisted on so that his creative input would have a more tangible presence in the show.
And even when it was applied, it wasn't fool proof either. Season 3's episode "The Bonding" is a great example on how the box should never be looked at as an absolute. We have numerous crew members mourning the death of an officer and we see how each one of our characters is affected by it in different ways. Riker feels the heavy weight of loss despite not knowing this crew member very well, Worf is angered about how her death was senseless and Picard takes on the responsibility of informing the their families. But when it comes to the officer's son, the one character who should have been at the very center of this emotional turmoil, we get Roddenberry's Box in action by showcasing Jeremy to be alright with his mother's passing.
And the thing is, I LOVED the parts of the episode where the crew are affected by Aster's death. I never liked the "Red Shirt" syndrome so seeing what should be a red shirt die in an episode and having her death affect the crew not only showcases that these characters actually give a crap about what happens to everyone, but also how they deal with it.
Yeah “The Bonding” is a whole lot better and more well-written than I remembered it being. The idea isn’t anything all that special, but it’s executed surprisingly well, with the alien being genuinely creepy and the crew coming across more tender and human than we’ve probably ever seen them (especially in the scenes between Wesley and his mom and between Wesley and Picard at the end).
I can see now why they hired Ron Moore based off of it.
I can see now why they hired Ron Moore based off of it.
Agree on the Bonding. The commentary is really interesting and really telling how restrictive and un-relatable the "box" was. Picard was never liked until they showed he had a human side to him in Best of Both Worlds, and I think from that point forward Picard was a better character. Picard came off like a bureaucrat in a lot of episodes. He would also spout off how great they were, etc. In the original series it was about ideas, and the characters could argue over them, in TNG there was really no other opinion allowed to where it would reach to a major conflict between characters. It just made it hard for the writers to flesh out the various characters. I remember seeing "All good things" and at the end when Picard joins the poker game, my reaction was WTF!! why the hell didn't they do this 4 seasons ago. I think its one reason why the TNG movies don't work, they had to change the dynamics of the characters to work on the big screen, and fans complained the characters were not the same as on the TV series. TOS just aged the characters, gave them some additional insights based on their pasts and took it from there. They amped up the relationship angle between Kirk, Spock, and McCoy. They didn't have to change the entire dynamic between all of the characters.
Getting back to the Season 3, Allegiance while not a great episode, it did look really great. The effects shots of the Enterprise wow! Especially the one where she flys above the camera and the shot is looking up toward the bottom of the ship as it enters the system.
-Chris
Getting back to the Season 3, Allegiance while not a great episode, it did look really great. The effects shots of the Enterprise wow! Especially the one where she flys above the camera and the shot is looking up toward the bottom of the ship as it enters the system.
-Chris
That's one of my favorite shots from S3. The team did a great job compositing that one
I haven't watched the documentaries on the last disc yet, just going through episodes and the commentaries as I make my way to the end of the season. The impression I get from the commentaries is that the show was a big mess behind the scenes. I can't wait to see what played out. Pillar sounds like a real jerk at this point. It sounds like there was more drama going on behind the scenes than in front of the cameras.
-Chris
-Chris
