Yes, yes. We're all aware the Lieutenant Valeris was wearing Lieutenant Commander pins. That was something left over when the character was still suppose to be Saavik.
Your own personal continuity
- Thread starter Lon Suder
- Start date
Yes, yes. We're all aware the Lieutenant Valeris was wearing Lieutenant Commander pins. That was something left over when the character was still suppose to be Saavik.
My reality:
There's a series of timelines superseding one another. In the "true" original Trek timeline...
THEN something happened (maybe some side-effect of the careless time travel in ST IV?), giving us the timeline seen in TNG. (Recall among other things that it was the final episode of TNG's first season that provided the Gregorian date on which Trek timelines have been hung ever since.) In this reality...
THEN we get a new cascade of timeline changes (let's call it a combination of the effects of ST VIII [First Contact] and ST:Voyager's "Future's End"). In this one...
THEN something else happens c. 2380 (I'm really not sure what to pin this on; open to suggestions!) to splinter the timeline into at least two main VARIANTS, including...
...AND of course, as an offshoot of the second of those, we get...
So by my count that's (at least) six main timelines involved, just to account for the variations familiar to us from "canon" Trek. Unfortunately for me my personal favorite of these is the first, but it's also the most remote from anything being written or produced these days or likely ever to be seen in the future.
There's a series of timelines superseding one another. In the "true" original Trek timeline...
- The Eugenics Wars were open warfare, and happened between 1992 and 1996.
- World War III cost 37 million lives in the early 21st century.
- Warp engines were discovered by Zefram Cochrane of Alpha Centauri in the mid 21st century, shortly after first contact with Earth.
- The USS Enterprise NCC-1701 was the first starship of that name. Robert April was its first captain, Chris Pike its second, and James Kirk its third.
- The events of TOS, TAS, and movies I-IV happened basically as depicted, in the early 23rd century
- Romulan culture is as described by Diane Duane. Klingon culture is as described by John M. Ford.
THEN something happened (maybe some side-effect of the careless time travel in ST IV?), giving us the timeline seen in TNG. (Recall among other things that it was the final episode of TNG's first season that provided the Gregorian date on which Trek timelines have been hung ever since.) In this reality...
- World War III was much more devastating than it had originally been, costing 600 million lives and leaving parts of Earth in a "post-atomic horror" as late as 2079
- TOS, TAS, etc. happened roughly 60 years later than they had before
- Klingons, Romulans, and the entire 24th century are as depicted in TNG and DS9
- Kirk died as depicted in ST VII [Generations]
THEN we get a new cascade of timeline changes (let's call it a combination of the effects of ST VIII [First Contact] and ST:Voyager's "Future's End"). In this one...
- The Eugenics Wars were fought covertly
- World War III was over by 2053
- Zefram Cochrane was from Earth, and discovered warp technology in 2063, coinciding with humanity's first contact with Vulcans
- Events of the 2150s were (substantially) as depicted in ST: Enterprise, including the existence of the NX-01, earlier-than-previous contacts with Klingons, Ferengi, and Borg, and somewhat altered history surrounding the Romulan War and the founding of the Federation
- The 2230s looked as depicted in the early scenes of ST XI (pre-Nero)
- The events of ST IX [Insurrection] and ST X [Nemesis] took place in the late 2370s
THEN something else happens c. 2380 (I'm really not sure what to pin this on; open to suggestions!) to splinter the timeline into at least two main VARIANTS, including...
- The reality depicted in the post-Nemesis Trek novels, including (e.g.) the final end of the Borg as depicted in the "Destiny" trilogy and subsequent events
- The reality seen in the framing scenes in ST XI, in which Romulus is destroyed; this also leads into the early 25th century history found in ST Online
...AND of course, as an offshoot of the second of those, we get...
- The main reality depicted in ST XI, in which (after changes in the 2230s) the Enterprise NCC-1701 is built later than before, but Jim Kirk takes command earlier than before, in 2258, and oh, yeah, the planet Vulcan is destroyed
So by my count that's (at least) six main timelines involved, just to account for the variations familiar to us from "canon" Trek. Unfortunately for me my personal favorite of these is the first, but it's also the most remote from anything being written or produced these days or likely ever to be seen in the future.
^This:
A big part of my personal continuity: Dr. Gillian Taylor would have gone into genetics research and been a major factor in the Eugenics Wars had she been left in the 20th century.
Not sure how that would actually fit?
The Voyage Home takes place in 1986, less than six years before the wars start. Khan and his other supermen would likely already be young adults by that point.
Accelerated genetic growth, perhaps? Khan and the other supermen were full adults by the time of the Eugenics Wars although they were chronologically not that old.
Would explain Khan's occasional temper tantrums too...
Accelerated genetic growth, perhaps? Khan and the other supermen were full adults by the time of the Eugenics Wars although they were chronologically not that old.
Would explain Khan's occasional temper tantrums too...
I didn't say she created the Augments... just that she played a major part in the war. It's just my way of reconciling the fiction with the fact.
I guess my second thought regarding Gillian Taylor would be how could she have played a part in the war? She left in 1986.
That's the point.
I didn't say she created the Augments either.Accelerated genetic growth, perhaps? Khan and the other supermen were full adults by the time of the Eugenics Wars although they were chronologically not that old.
Would explain Khan's occasional temper tantrums too...
I didn't say she created the Augments... just that she played a major part in the war. It's just my way of reconciling the fiction with the fact.
This would explain the majority of Khan's crew in TWOK, they were all early teens/pre-teens, but were the size of adults.
Besides Khan, there was one older guy.
I didn't say she created the Augments either.Accelerated genetic growth, perhaps? Khan and the other supermen were full adults by the time of the Eugenics Wars although they were chronologically not that old.
Would explain Khan's occasional temper tantrums too...
I didn't say she created the Augments... just that she played a major part in the war. It's just my way of reconciling the fiction with the fact.
No, but BillJ stated he didn't understand how Gillian could fit a role in the Eugenics Wars since Khan and Co. were already young adults by 1986. What about Khan's age in 1986 affects Gillian involvement/lack of involvement with the Eugenics Wars?
I gather that the point being made is Gillian's presence influenced or affected the Eugenics Wars in some fashion (shades of Edith Keeler). When Kirk took Gillian back to the 23rd Century, he altered history.
Speaking of the Eugenics Wars... I don't see from the context of the episodes how the Eugenics Wars could have been fought covertly (sorry Mr. Cox). Just because a portion of the United States (as seen in Voyager) was unscratched doesn't in itself imply the Eugenics Wars were covert. WWI and WWII did not leave a mark on the North American landscape either, yet they were pretty overt. I see the Eugenics Wars as suped-up versions of the Ethnic Cleansing we saw in Bosnia and Rwanda back in the 90s. But hey, that's my personal continuity.
Master and Commander and Galaxy Quest are both part of the Star Trek canon.
It depends on how long the Augments have been around. If they've been around since (at least) the 1960s, then they'd be fairly old news to Gillian in 1986. But if they suddenly came out of nowhere in 1986, then they'd be just something Gillian had only recently heard about (I proposed having them be the product of accelerated growth as one way that could happen).
Either way, I think Gillian's "involvement" in the Eugenics Wars would be tangential, perhaps no more than she was alive when the first seeds of the conflict were probably planted, with actual direct hostilities to occur about six years later, IMO.
I gotta disagree. Edith Keeler's life had a great impact on World War II, yet she had no connection to Hitler. Gillian could likewise have had a profound impact on the Eugenics Wars without ever meeting Khan.
Eh, all this is spitballing though. I personally don't like the notion of Gillian having an influence ala Edith Keeler. We've already been there and done that. But it's fun to what-if.
Wesley crusher was never born !!!
Explain how, please. Gillian's work was in Cetacean biology (namely whales). You'd have to come up with a connection between whales and the Eugenics Wars.
Gillian Taylor is one of the least likely persons to be involved directly in the Eugenics Wars, IMO, but a case could be made that she was there to see the events leading up to it.
In My AU ENT These Are The Voyages NEVER FRELLING FRAKING HAPPENED and Trip and T'Pol had their happy ending
