Dallas - Season 2
- Thread starter Agent Richard07
- Start date
He's his daddy's son, from tip to tail. 
HOLY CRAP! WHAT A TWIST!!!
Indeed! Did not see that coming at all!
Awesome way to end a fantastic episode.
Cliff in jail for Murder? Check!
Ryland in jail for trafficking? Check!
Governor under Sue Ellen's thumb? Check!
Very hostile takeover of Barnes Global? Check!
Elena recruits her own army? Ch- Wait...what?
That last scene was the only thing I didn't get...
I'm glad they didn't drag out the "who shot JR" plotline beyond the season - and they easily could have. The actual killer was surprising and fitting for the character. (not spoiling it further, in case someone hasn't seen it yet)
John Ross sure is cut from his daddy's cloth.
Cliff, Cliff, Cliff ... he's exactly where he deserves to be. Wonder how long he'll be there?
After dragging out the "Is Pam alive or dead?" plot, I'm glad there is definitive answer, and I'm sure the original actress is happy about it.
When Sam Anderson opened the door, was anyone else hoping L. Scott Caldwell would be inside that mansion too?
John Ross sure is cut from his daddy's cloth.
Cliff, Cliff, Cliff ... he's exactly where he deserves to be. Wonder how long he'll be there?
After dragging out the "Is Pam alive or dead?" plot, I'm glad there is definitive answer, and I'm sure the original actress is happy about it.
When Sam Anderson opened the door, was anyone else hoping L. Scott Caldwell would be inside that mansion too?
doubleohfive
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So far I've only been able to see 214 "Guilt By Association," which TNT's website has loaded already. Otherwise staying away till they put up 215 "Legacies" and I can watch it before commenting further.
It'd be great if they actually had put up both episodes on the site, like they say they are...
It'd be great if they actually had put up both episodes on the site, like they say they are...
Up until now, she's been one of the more sympathetic characters on the show for me. But this just didn't make any sense at all. She's been spending most of the season riding her brother's ass about his poor decisions and then she goes and does this? All because of "evidence" given to her by Cliff Barnes? As they're fond of saying on the show, bullshit!
J.R. may well have done exactly what Cliff says he did, but now that he's dead.... why the hell doesn't Elena just show Bobby what's she's found? Why seek out Joaquin, a man who is probably not that different from Vicente, the
man who almost killed her a few episodes ago? Bullshit!
Other than this silliness which leaves Elena in danger of becoming as annoying a TV character as Andrea from "The Walking Dead," (Season 3... uh-huh...) I thought this was a solid finale. John Ross is definitely his father's son. I guessed correctly the resolutions to Christopher's search for his mother and to the identity of J.R.'s killer, but that final swerve caught me by surprise.
Don't drop the ball on this one, TNT! Give us at least one more season!
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doubleohfive
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^^Thanks, OmahaStar! 
Finally had a chance to watch the episode this morning and am blown away. I was really hoping for Pam to come back, but I think I like what the new show has done even better. Bobby gets his hands dirty. John Ross marries Cliff's daughter. Christopher finally mourns his mother. Sue Ellen finally puts some of J.R.'s wheeling and dealing to good use on her own.
John Ross had some great moments in the last two episodes, and when he finally asks the question - "Who shot my father?" it was a tender, believable moment. Too, I was happy to see (happy from a storytelling perspective) that Bobby finally, when it was all over, let himself have the emotional release to cry and grieve J.R., even if briefly.
As for J.R.'s plan, what a masterpiece indeed. I don't know how none of us ever thought it was going to be about ending the Barnes-Ewing feud once and for all (even though Cliff tried to end it at some point during the original series)...
But all I can say is wow. Wow. Back when they ended that earlier episode with John Ross on the phone with JR (when J.R. was shot) I had a slight suspicion that J.R. knew he was going to be killed based on his conversation, but having it confirmed now makes his last conversation with John Ross all the more poignant.
My only real critiques would be of Elena and Ann. Elena, because WTF is she doing at the end? Why is she taking Cliff Barnes' word over everything and everyone who have been in her life with the Ewings? Is she just angry? Is she scorned because of Christopher (however rightly, if in his super emo way) being angry with her?
Ann, because I get that she's the modern day Miss Ellie and matriarch of the family, but she's also basically not been involved in the Ewings/J.R./Masterpiece plan. Nowhere was this more evident than when Bobby and Bum were revealing the plan to John Ross, Christopher, Pamela and Sue Ellen. Ann just showed Bum in and then closed the door to leave. Seriously?
I'm absolutely itching now for season three, and sincerely hope TNT will do right by how well done this series has been the last two years and renew it soon.
Finally had a chance to watch the episode this morning and am blown away. I was really hoping for Pam to come back, but I think I like what the new show has done even better. Bobby gets his hands dirty. John Ross marries Cliff's daughter. Christopher finally mourns his mother. Sue Ellen finally puts some of J.R.'s wheeling and dealing to good use on her own.
John Ross had some great moments in the last two episodes, and when he finally asks the question - "Who shot my father?" it was a tender, believable moment. Too, I was happy to see (happy from a storytelling perspective) that Bobby finally, when it was all over, let himself have the emotional release to cry and grieve J.R., even if briefly.
As for J.R.'s plan, what a masterpiece indeed. I don't know how none of us ever thought it was going to be about ending the Barnes-Ewing feud once and for all (even though Cliff tried to end it at some point during the original series)...
But all I can say is wow. Wow. Back when they ended that earlier episode with John Ross on the phone with JR (when J.R. was shot) I had a slight suspicion that J.R. knew he was going to be killed based on his conversation, but having it confirmed now makes his last conversation with John Ross all the more poignant.
My only real critiques would be of Elena and Ann. Elena, because WTF is she doing at the end? Why is she taking Cliff Barnes' word over everything and everyone who have been in her life with the Ewings? Is she just angry? Is she scorned because of Christopher (however rightly, if in his super emo way) being angry with her?
Ann, because I get that she's the modern day Miss Ellie and matriarch of the family, but she's also basically not been involved in the Ewings/J.R./Masterpiece plan. Nowhere was this more evident than when Bobby and Bum were revealing the plan to John Ross, Christopher, Pamela and Sue Ellen. Ann just showed Bum in and then closed the door to leave. Seriously?
I'm absolutely itching now for season three, and sincerely hope TNT will do right by how well done this series has been the last two years and renew it soon.
That bothered me a bit, too, but not so much now that I've had a chance to think about it.
If Ann had been in on J.R.'s Masterpiece (which sounds like it should be a barbecue sauce, but I digress
), it would have left questions as to whether she was manipulating her daughter when Emma stole Harris' ledger and gave it to the Ewings. Emma's certainly got her own agenda — what's in the case she brought to John Ross? — but for Ann to be playing her would tarnish what the writers and the actors did this season with the character arcs for both of them. Ann isn't a candidate for sainthood the way Miss Ellie was, but being the Miss Ellie figure on the new series, she has to be able to rise above the schemes.BTW, TNT would totally be missing out on a great marketing opportunity if they didn't add those J.R. Ewing signature decanters to the Dallas shop on their website.
I'd buy one.
Didn't they have bank records with Pam's and someone else's signatures, but in the same handwriting?
They seemed to forget that point this week. Or was that part of the conspiracy?
They seemed to forget that point this week. Or was that part of the conspiracy?
doubleohfive
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Not only that, but Pam's death in 1989 means that for the final two seasons of the old show, Cliff knew about her passing and effectively had been lying to Bobby and Christopher even then. It'd be interesting to go back and rewatch those two seasons (especially the Cliff storylines, like his accidentally murdering Johnny Dancer and his flirtation with Michelle and Liz Adams) and see if there might be any kind of nuance to it knowing that he knows Pam is dead by that point.
^ It's also very "soap" to re-write history, and like I said earlier, to make us think someone is dead when they're not.
For example, GH just featured the second resurrection of Stavros Cassadine.
Even when there is a body, which there isn't in the case of Pam.
She could have faked her own death to get out of the Barnes-Ewing feud, then Cliff took advantage of the situation.
For example, GH just featured the second resurrection of Stavros Cassadine.
Even when there is a body, which there isn't in the case of Pam.
She could have faked her own death to get out of the Barnes-Ewing feud, then Cliff took advantage of the situation.
Oh, this bugs me now. About the only reason I can conjure for Cliff hiding Pam's death from Bobby and Christopher is that he was keeping the information to himself to sort of hedge his bets in case things came to a head and J.R. forced him out of Ewing Oil (Cliff ended up quitting in disgust over the oil tanker fiasco in Season 13). Otherwise it just doesn't really jibe with his character as he was written at the time.
Here's another hole in the scenario: Cliff got all despondent when he got back from seeing Pam at the beginning of Season 12; while he was in this funk, he sold Barnes-Wentworth and all its assets to Westar. At that point, once he found out Pam had died, wouldn't that mean Christopher inherits 1/3 of the huge pot of money Jeremy Wendell paid Cliff, since 1/3 of the company was still Pam's? While I could see him wanting to keep the company from Christopher, he's got no reason to keep the money from him. Yeah, Cliff and J.R. continued to butt heads until the end, but his relationships with Bobby and Christopher were always still friendly; indeed, it was Bobby's heart-to-heart that appealed to Cliff's inner sense of fairness to rule that neither Ewing nor Westar was liable for the tanker accident. Meanwhile, fast-forward to 2012, and Cliff not only still has Barnes-Wentworth (did he buy it back from McKay after he suckered J.R. into selling his half of Ewing Oil at the end of Season 14?), but he's grown it into a huge conglomerate.
This has been the problem with Cliff since the new show began — remember last season, and we were trying to figure out just when in the late '80s Cliff would have had time to go to Pakistan and rescue a street urchin, take him into his family like he's his own son, and bring him up to be his feared right-hand man, Captain Rob— I mean, Smilin' Frank Ashkani? They're rewriting things into Cliff's history on the original show that just don't fit.
edit: or, I could remember what Joel and the 'Bots tell me: "It's just a show, I should really just relax."
Here's another hole in the scenario: Cliff got all despondent when he got back from seeing Pam at the beginning of Season 12; while he was in this funk, he sold Barnes-Wentworth and all its assets to Westar. At that point, once he found out Pam had died, wouldn't that mean Christopher inherits 1/3 of the huge pot of money Jeremy Wendell paid Cliff, since 1/3 of the company was still Pam's? While I could see him wanting to keep the company from Christopher, he's got no reason to keep the money from him. Yeah, Cliff and J.R. continued to butt heads until the end, but his relationships with Bobby and Christopher were always still friendly; indeed, it was Bobby's heart-to-heart that appealed to Cliff's inner sense of fairness to rule that neither Ewing nor Westar was liable for the tanker accident. Meanwhile, fast-forward to 2012, and Cliff not only still has Barnes-Wentworth (did he buy it back from McKay after he suckered J.R. into selling his half of Ewing Oil at the end of Season 14?), but he's grown it into a huge conglomerate.
This has been the problem with Cliff since the new show began — remember last season, and we were trying to figure out just when in the late '80s Cliff would have had time to go to Pakistan and rescue a street urchin, take him into his family like he's his own son, and bring him up to be his feared right-hand man, Captain Rob— I mean, Smilin' Frank Ashkani? They're rewriting things into Cliff's history on the original show that just don't fit.
edit: or, I could remember what Joel and the 'Bots tell me: "It's just a show, I should really just relax."
doubleohfive
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I just checked. They don't seem to be. Which is kind of silly, but at the same time, its entirely possible Warners pulled them so that you could go from renting discs from the old series to renting discs/streaming the new series (season one is available.)
How is she the modern Miss Ellie? Ellie was the matriarch at Southfork, it was her home, she grew up there and tried to keep the family together on the ranch. Ann is just a chick who moved in after she married Bobby, she's the new Pam.
Ann is also much nicer than Miss Ellie, the latter was an annoying cow who was close to a nervous breakdown every time one of her adult sons wanted to leave her house. She also silently approved of Lucy's kidnapping, Elli was a bitch and if I owned Southfork I would start drilling just out of spite.
Now that I think about Ellie I remember Jock, who was an even bigger asshole, in fact all of the Ewings were a bunch of unsympathetic jerks. I guess that's what made the show fun.
awesome interview with the executive producer. They actually killed Pam off because of that shitty thing Victoria Principle said about desperate attempts to relive the past 
http://www.tvguide.com/News/Dallas-Finale-Burning-Questions-1064125.aspx
she also says that as of 2 days ago it hadn't been renewed.
http://www.tvguide.com/News/Dallas-Finale-Burning-Questions-1064125.aspx
she also says that as of 2 days ago it hadn't been renewed.
doubleohfive
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That was a GREAT interview, thank you for sharing, wissaboo!
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