Why do folks dislike the Skant?

[Gotham Central]

I've noticed that a lot of fans seem to dislike the Skant from the first season of TNG. I'm curious as to why. Is it because of the design generally or is it because they had the audacity to put them on men?

I think that part of the problem was the overall design. They do have something of a cheerleader look to them that was not apparent in the TOS uniforms. It might have helped if they were a little longer. I also think that they lost some points because they were short sleeved. I noticed that the TOS uniforms shown in ST09 had a more cheer leader quality since they too had short sleeves. That said, I kind of assumed that the Skant was meant to be more of a casual uniform (which explains why Troi, who wears more causal uniforms through most of the series, is wearing one). It also explains why you see a lot more of them (especially on men) in the Farpoint scenes than on the Enterprise.

On the gender issue, I think that the producers slightly undermined the concept by not having any of the main male characters appear in one. Having Lt. LaForge wear one when he first reports to Riker at Farpoint would have fit with the more casual concept (and there are actually quite a few guys wearing them at Farpoint).

It is interesting that the Skat receives a lot of criticism from fans but many of the same people that ridiculed the idea for TNG were perfectly ok with the fact that all of the women were forced to wear them again on ST09.

 

[Christopher]

I think the objections to the skant are simply due to conventional assumptions about gender and fashion. Our culture is fine with seeing women in pants, but can't accept seeing men in "skirts," even though throughout history men have routinely worn draped garments such as kilts, saris, kimonos, etc. It's a silly double standard, and a failure to recognize that the conventions of our culture and era are not universal norms. If anything, it's implausible when shows set in the future don't use fashions that look strange to us.

 

[Green Shirt]

Well, without over analyzing and being overly dramatic, a person's taste in clothing (or whatever else), is a matter of personal opinion. What looks 'hot' to one person will look ridiculous to another. Nothing silly about that.

 

[BillJ]

It could be that they were hideous looking on both men and women...

 

[Green Shirt]

It could be that they were hideous looking on both men and women...

Especially the men.

 

[Christopher]

^See, that's just our culture's double standard, the expectations of our own tiny sliver of history about what looks appropriate on men and women. Future fashions shouldn't look normal to us. We see fashions from the '70s or '80s, just a few decades ago and within many of our lifetimes, and they look completely bizarre to us. So why would we expect uniforms from 350 years in the future not to look strange?

 

[-SS-]

I personally would like to see some men in skirts in ST 12. Though it's probably highly unlikely.

 

[Gotham Central]

It could be that they were hideous looking on both men and women...

Especially the men.

I actually thought they looked better on the men. The guy in the photo from the show that often gets circulated with this looked way better than Deanna in that uniform. It made her look short and a bit dumpy. Though admittedly she looked better in it in "All Good Things."

 

[SchwEnt]

Pulaski wore one, but with pants underneath. In that combination, the skant didn't fare too badly.

 

[T'Girl]

I think just the name puts people off, it's just a damned skirt already. Call it that.

Plus the ones on TNG looked like nothing more than a long tube shirts, a miniskirt (personal opinion now), should have at least a little bit of flare below the waist. The minidresses worn during TOS did, so did the ones in ST Eleven.

The OP noted that the fans themselves were okay with the flare style, but (to a degree) condemning of the non-flare. For (most) women, it not a particularly comfortable thing to wear, I have a few, and they're fine for a environment where you're basically showing off a fashion, but the "skant-band' around one of your legs make dancing difficult, and becomes uncomfortable with time.

Plus the fore mentioned Skant-band has to be periodically readjusted, or it bunches up. Kind of like the Picard-maneuver, except you're having to reach up your own skirt to do it.

If I might ask Gotham Central, have you yourself ever worn one for a few hours? It might give you some prospective.

Returning to the name skant, it does have a certain urban slang meaning to young people, that's not associated with a garment. You do want the youth demographic right?

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=skant

 

[Gotham Central]

Pulaski wore one, but with pants underneath. In that combination, the skant didn't fare too badly.

The thing about Pulaski's uniform was that it was long sleeved and was entirely blue instead of having just the colored panels in the front and back.

So part of the acceptability of her uniform, aside from the pants is that it was really a fundamental redesign.

 

[Gotham Central]

I think just the name puts people off, it's just a damned skirt already. Call it that.

Plus the ones on TNG looked like nothing more than a long tube shirts, a miniskirt (personal opinion now), should have at least a little bit of flare below the waist. The minidresses worn during TOS did, so did the ones in ST Eleven.

The OP noted that the fans themselves were okay with the flare style, but (to a degree) condemning of the non-flare. For (most) women, it not a particularly comfortable thing to wear, I have a few, and they're fine for a environment where you're basically showing off a fashion, but the "skant-band' around one of your legs make dancing difficult, and becomes uncomfortable with time.

Plus the fore mentioned Skant-band has to be periodically readjusted, or it bunches up. Kind of like the Picard-maneuver, except you're having to reach up your own skirt to do it.

If I might ask Gotham Central, have you yourself ever worn one for a few hours? It might give you some prospective.

Returning to the name skant, it does have a certain urban slang meaning to young people, that's not associated with a garment. You do want the youth demographic right?

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=skant

The original concept of the Skant/Skort, as I understand it, was that it was supposed to be a combination of shorts and a skirt.

 

[Bry_Sinclair]

It was an interesting concept, though I do think they would have worked better if they'd been a little longer. It was nice to see them attempt a different style of uniform for crewmembers to wear, in addition to the jumpsuit.

I personally would like to see some men in skirts in ST 12. Though it's probably highly unlikely.

Here here!!!!!!!

 

[horatio83]

I think the objections to the skant are simply due to conventional assumptions about gender and fashion. Our culture is fine with seeing women in pants, but can't accept seeing men in "skirts," even though throughout history men have routinely worn draped garments such as kilts, saris, kimonos, etc. It's a silly double standard, and a failure to recognize that the conventions of our culture and era are not universal norms. If anything, it's implausible when shows set in the future don't use fashions that look strange to us.

Precisely. And then people complain about TNG not having gone further in stories like The Host and so on.
Another motivation behind the skant might have been the de-sexualization of Roddenberry's miniskirts. It is not easy to transform a sexploitative in a postgender piece of clothing.

 

[sbk1234]

My only problem with them was the men wearing them. Double standard and unequal attitude? Yeah, probably, but I don't like men in skirts.

 

[C.E. Evans]

We're just not that enlightened yet, or perhaps we've stopped being so after biblical times...

 

[Nighthawk]

I personaly love the Skant on a woman and find it just a tad bit too short for a guy.

In my Star Trek Club we use the skant as a running joke that it is the uniform of the day for all Star Trek Conventions.

 

[Sci]

Another motivation behind the skant might have been the de-sexualization of Roddenberry's miniskirts. It is not easy to transform a sexploitative in a postgender piece of clothing.

This.

The miniskirts were basically there to sexualize the female characters in TOS and early TNG. Extending that to male characters doesn't make for egalitarianism, it just extends the objectification.

If they wanted to do something with draped fashions as part of 24th Century Federation culture, that would be valid, but they'd need to give it context. The only context we the audience saw was the pre-existing objectification of women in the miniskirt uniforms. (Which is gross in its own right -- imagine the outcry if the United States Navy were to start requiring its female sailors and officers to wear short miniskirts as part of their uniforms. People would rightly be outraged.)

 

[Orac]

Transphobia: An irrational fear of transvestites.

 

[scotpens]

. . . The miniskirts were basically there to sexualize the female characters in TOS and early TNG. Extending that to male characters doesn't make for egalitarianism, it just extends the objectification.

If they wanted to do something with draped fashions as part of 24th Century Federation culture, that would be valid, but they'd need to give it context. The only context we the audience saw was the pre-existing objectification of women in the miniskirt uniforms. (Which is gross in its own right -- imagine the outcry if the United States Navy were to start requiring its female sailors and officers to wear short miniskirts as part of their uniforms. People would rightly be outraged.)

Remember, though, that in the popular culture of the late 1960s, the miniskirt was seen as symbolic of social and sexual liberation for women, like the short flapper dresses of the 1920s. Miniskirted duty uniforms for female starship personnel, however, were just impractical and silly. (And I'm saying this as a leg man!)