Why do they still let Braga do TV shows?

[Jax]

He is an atheist after all it seems.

Pointless comment of the day.

 

[Dick_Valentine]

I noticed that, but wasn't going to bring it up in the hopes we could all just ignore it and not let this thread descend into world war 3.

See what ya did?

 

[TremblingBluStar]

I think he's stuck in space where he belongs like a giant nebulous anomaly.

If he can't get out, I'm guessing he could always use the deflector dish to punch a hole into the event horizon.

 

[TremblingBluStar]

Why do they still let Spielberg do movies? 1941, Always, Amistad, The Lost World, Kingdom of the Crystal Skull. What an awful lot of duds on his CV!

To be fair, Spielberg had a series of early major hits, and is more or less still reaping the benefits of those successes. If Braga had a resume that started with something like Jaws, Close Encounters, Raiders of the Lost Ark, and E.T. instead of Voyager, Enterprise, and Threshold, his continued success wouldn't be such a mystery.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Braga must be one hell of a presenter because if he would be judged by a panel of creative experts his career would be over.

No.

Unless by "creative experts" you mean "group of random opinionated posters on the Internet," which is what this kind of thing really usually comes down to.

 

[stj]

He is an atheist after all it seems.

Pointless comment of the day.

It's not a pointless comment, it is a symptom. Internet whipping boys are selected for reasons other than objective esthetic appraisal. There are lots of unbelievers in pews and pulpits but there are still few atheists, and it would be foolish to think bigotry doesn't play a role.

That said, there are professional skills, like the ability to fit commercial breaks or placement into a script, or write out characters when negotiating a contract and carry on a working relationships (aka shmooze the bosses,) that are highly valued by the company men. But people who are just interested in the product, not the bottom line, are justly indifferent to those professional skills.

The Shannon family, for good or ill, is very much the kind of family theme strongly associated with Steven Spielber, not Braga. It worked in Falling Skies (so far, though what happens inside the space ship may be so silly as to wreck willing suspension of disblief,) but I think that's because Jason Mara isn't Noah Wyle. I doubt Braga cast him. I think that Lang reprising his Avatar role was a mistake, since it turns colonization in the face of dinosaurs into some wacky war, but maybe that's just me. Conspiracy/war isn't about dinosaurs, so why have them? Still, I doubt that was Braga's idea either.

I think that the show was never truly conceived, every train of thought was derailed by the steady drumbeat of "Dinosaurs! Dinosaurs! Dinosaurs!" There's no story there. There's not really even a premise. It seems to me that Braga was the poor soul trying to find real stories to put on screen. If he tried some SF stories with a Spielbergian family theme added, well, that's not dinosaurs either. Why have them? I see no sign that anybody here has any answers any better than Braga, and some sign that, unlike Braga, they don't even realize that some sort of story does actually have to be put on screen.

 

[Ian Keldon]

DS9 started the path of dumbing Trek down for the lowest common denominator,

Horsesh*t!

DS9 had some of the most complex and mature writing Trek ever did, along with strong characterization and nuanced performances from a well-chosen cast.

Not that any of that has all that much to do with Braga. Neither he nor Berman had all that much to do with DS9. It was Ron Moore, Ira Steven Behr, and Michael Piller who were the chief creative influences on the show.

 

[Ian Keldon]

DS9 started the path of Dumbing down Trek? In what way?

I'm sure he meant VOY. Braga never had anything to do with DS9.

If I had meant the Tits Of Nine Show I would've said so.
DS9 started Trek's decline from a show about exploration into a loose collection of battles that usually leads up to a major battle in the season finale or following opener. They started the trend where, if writers can't even write their way out of a phone booth, they'll introduce just yet another enemy to distract the audience with some shiny new thing.

You mean the writers who gave us such powerful (and occasionally prescient) episodes like "Homefront"/"Paradise Lost", "In the Pale Moonlight", "Far Beyond the Stars", "Honor Among Thieves", "Past Tense", etc?

The writers who gave us such intriguing and multi-layered characters as Ben Sisko, Elim Garak and Gul Dukat?

Those writers?

I'll put them up against any genre writers (and most non-genre writers) out there.

 

[Theodore Jay Miller]

What do Enterprise, Threshold, Flash Forward and Terra Nova have in common?

So far, the only Brannon Braga produced science fiction TV show that didn't get canceled is Voyager. And IIRC, Voyager's ratings weren't exactly stellar either.

Now, who in their right mind would entrust a multi-million dollar TV project (like Terra Nova) to a guy with that kind of a track record?

But it's a great track record in the coveted left-handed Jewish asexual computer programmer demographic. I quite liked Enterprise, Threshold, and Fast Forward, and would have continued watching them if they hadn't been canceled. And typically I've been finding maybe two new shows a season that I like, so that's a way above average "success with me" rate.

 

[Ian Keldon]

Well, DS9 certainly started Trek's steep ratings decline.

Correlation/causation fallacy.

As many have pointed out, the syndication market changed radically during DS9s run, which sent the ratings of a large number of syndicated programs tumbling. Add to that the lack of faith Paramount had in the show (evidenced by their never allowing it to be the "torchbearer", among other things) and a resulting lack of promotive effort, and the ratings decline is easily explained with no inference as to the quality of the show.

 

[Ian Keldon]

Oooh gossip now this thread is getting good!

It was Jolene Blalock, right? Sexual harrassment lawsuit ahoy!

Hey, I did not say it... but you right. Jeri fell for it, but it back fired when he tryed with Jolene. No lawsuit was filed, it was delt with pretty quietly. All I will say that if Star Trek producers were like U.S. presidents, Braga would be Bill Clinton. LOL

Much like GR himself was like Jack Kennedy in that regard.

 

[Ian Keldon]

Aw, that was too easy. I was hoping it was actually Connor Trinneer.

If your were a producer on the show then it would be a big problem, keep you away from Connor and Joe Flanigan on Atlantis.. lol I have seen women almost faint around Connor, he has that effect i guess.

I meant that I hoped Braga had diversified his tastes. Blalock is such an obvious target...I have higher standards in scandals nowadays.

I don't find Blalock all that attractive myself. She has a decent body, but her mouth is so oversized and "puffy" that it ruins her face.

Linda Park on the other hand...

 

[Ian Keldon]

I'm still trying to figure out what exactly the plan was, since we were reminded about that every single episode for 3 seasons.

Something that caught the showrunners by surprise, according to their interviews on the DVDs and elsewhere. That was tacked on by some studio guy at the proverbial last minute.

 

[Sindatur]

Well, DS9 certainly started Trek's steep ratings decline.

Correlation/causation fallacy.

As many have pointed out, the syndication market changed radically during DS9s run, which sent the ratings of a large number of syndicated programs tumbling. Add to that the lack of faith Paramount had in the show (evidenced by their never allowing it to be the "torchbearer", among other things) and a resulting lack of promotive effort, and the ratings decline is easily explained with no inference as to the quality of the show.

Plus the following Series, continued dropping even further. DS9 exerienced a drop off from TNG, but, Voyager dropped even lower than DS9 and Enterprise dropped even lower than Voyager.

 

[Captaindemotion]

The law of diminishing returns, basically. Though I still say DS9 is the best of all Trek shows.

 

[Ian Keldon]

He is an atheist after all it seems.

Pointless comment of the day.

It's not a pointless comment, it is a symptom. Internet whipping boys are selected for reasons other than objective esthetic appraisal. There are lots of unbelievers in pews and pulpits but there are still few atheists, and it would be foolish to think bigotry doesn't play a role.

In Hollywood, being an atheist would get you invited to all the "best" parties. Hollywood's social culture is an almost direct inversion of the (currently) prevailing national social culture.

In Hollywood, it's the traditional culture people who are the most frequent subjects of discrimination, esp anyone defined as "conservative" in any fashion.

 

[Sindatur]

The law of diminishing returns, basically. Though I still say DS9 is the best of all Trek shows.

Oh, absolutely, I enjoyed it from the start during first run, watching it and B5 back to back was a dream each week, oh how I miss those days.

I watched alot of Voyager and most of Enterprise first run, but, they never interested me nearly as much. Though Enterprise S3 started to become really interesting and S4 was everything I was expecting from Enterprise when it was first announced.

 

[Captaindemotion]

^ I agree absolutely with you re ENT, especially re S4.

 

[Admiral2]

^ I agree absolutely with you re ENT, especially re S4.

I still say most ENT watchers get this backward.


To me, Season 3 was barely watchable and Season 4 was utter shite. ENT was best during Season one, when it wasn't trying to have its own Dominion war (3) and wasn't trying to be a frakking TOS clone (4).

 

[Neroon]

4 consecutive posts?

Infraction for spamming. Comments to PM.

Well, DS9 certainly started Trek's steep ratings decline.

Correlation/causation fallacy.

As many have pointed out, the syndication market changed radically during DS9s run, which sent the ratings of a large number of syndicated programs tumbling. Add to that the lack of faith Paramount had in the show (evidenced by their never allowing it to be the "torchbearer", among other things) and a resulting lack of promotive effort, and the ratings decline is easily explained with no inference as to the quality of the show.

Oooh gossip now this thread is getting good!

It was Jolene Blalock, right? Sexual harrassment lawsuit ahoy!

Hey, I did not say it... but you right. Jeri fell for it, but it back fired when he tryed with Jolene. No lawsuit was filed, it was delt with pretty quietly. All I will say that if Star Trek producers were like U.S. presidents, Braga would be Bill Clinton. LOL

Much like GR himself was like Jack Kennedy in that regard.

If your were a producer on the show then it would be a big problem, keep you away from Connor and Joe Flanigan on Atlantis.. lol I have seen women almost faint around Connor, he has that effect i guess.

I meant that I hoped Braga had diversified his tastes. Blalock is such an obvious target...I have higher standards in scandals nowadays.

I don't find Blalock all that attractive myself. She has a decent body, but her mouth is so oversized and "puffy" that it ruins her face.

Linda Park on the other hand...

I'm still trying to figure out what exactly the plan was, since we were reminded about that every single episode for 3 seasons.

Something that caught the showrunners by surprise, according to their interviews on the DVDs and elsewhere. That was tacked on by some studio guy at the proverbial last minute.