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Did Rise of the Apes conquered the uncanny valley?

I think that it did. Everything seemed completely natural and seamless, aside from two or three scenes where we see Caesar swinging all over the place in a manner reminiscent of the Spidey films; though the scenes do have the virtue of being visually stunning.
 
Tintin is totally trapped in the uncanny valley. I also don't see the point, as they could have done the same with real actors, make up and appliances and it would look a thousand times better.
 
Tintin is totally trapped in the uncanny valley. I also don't see the point, as they could have done the same with real actors, make up and appliances and it would look a thousand times better.

Look again at the pic of Hardock in close up Jarod! they aren't replicating real life people, they are replicating cartoon characters. No dead eyes on Haddock as it's a complete finished version of him, he has emotion and all including better hair and lighting. It's from WETA and not Imagemovers from Zemeckis, Spielberg and Jackson aren't gonna repeat the mistakes of Zemeckis. This will be more like Monster House than Polar Express. Even the Thompson twins look unrealistic and not real-like human-like either.

Did Avatar fall in the uncanny valley?
 
I think the uncanny valley is much easier to avoid with apes or blue alien cat people. If they're just slightly "off", people won't notice because they're not as familiar with how they should look. With CGI humans, everyone is going to notice every little mistake the animators or the software make.

That said, the "Apes" effects certainly were fantastic.
 
Hey AV, have you seen the pic of the Captain on TinTin? he looks less creepy this time and more like a cartoon humanoid and even the eyes have expression with emotion even in the face. Same for the Thompsons, but TinTin himself they will complete by the first week of October.
 
Yeah, Haddock and the Thompsons look pretty good, Tintin (and Snowy) less so. The stylization certainly helps with the uncanny valley, although I wish they had stylized the characters even more. Anyway, I'm a life-long Tintin fan and will definitely try to catch the movie next month.
 
CGI is great for creating photorealistic things it would be unfeasible to do in live action, like the apes in RotPotA. But I don't see the point in using CGI to duplicate human beings. To paraphrase Isaac Asimov (who was actually talking about robots), if CGI turned out exactly like human beings, it would be a terrible waste -- we've got human beings. The best way to make a movie about human beings is to put actual human beings in front of a camera.

I think if you're pursuing something like creating digital "stunt doubles" for live actors so you can have them do things it would be too expensive, difficult, or dangerous to do with live actors or animatronics, then the uncanny valley is a legitimate concern. But if you're creating a full-on CGI movie -- something which is essentially an animated cartoon -- then it's rather self-defeating to try to make it look like live action. You shouldn't even be trying to cross the uncanny valley in that case; you should just be trying to design and execute the best 3D cartoon characters you can. And for that, I think hand animation is better than performance capture, because part of what makes cartoons work is caricature, the distillation and exaggeration of what's important and the smoothing over of extraneous detail. Beyond that, animators can make their characters "perform" in ways live actors can't, like squashing and stretching the body, having the hair or clothes move in a certain way, playing fast and loose with how gravity or impact affects a body, etc.

Of course, most motion-capture performances in movies are supplemented by animators tweaking the details of the performance by hand anyway, although I think that's less the case as the facial performance-capture technology improves.
 
^I think one of the main reasons hollywood is pursuing the technique is to revive dead actors. Or at least recreate actors past their prime such as was done with Jeff Bridges in Tron:Legacy and Arnold in Terminator: Salvation.
 
Yeah, I think it did. I find the transformation of Andy Serkis into an Ape quite amazing, yet it really feels natural. The other apes were also very good. But I'd also agree that doing an animal like an Ape is considerably easier, because you expect the animal to look as real as it can to the point of being indistinguishable. With people, it's harder. Sometimes it's down to the animation or the quality of the work and the details in them.
 
The uncanny valley applies to humans. Not human-like apes, nor blue cat people. But humans. It's not a synonym for "anything that looks realistic or at least believable."

So no, it didn't, because it had nothing to do with it.
 
The uncanny valley applies to humans.

That's not at all correct.

In any event, there are aspects to the "uncanny valley" phenomenon other than so-called "dead eyes". The appearance of human skin itself is more complex than we often notice; neither CG nor any kind of prothesis quite matches it, which is why lighting is so important in both cases. WETA sidesteps this aspect a bit in both Avatar and ROTPOTA. But yeah, they're certainly doing excellent work.
 
^I think one of the main reasons hollywood is pursuing the technique is to revive dead actors. Or at least recreate actors past their prime such as was done with Jeff Bridges in Tron:Legacy and Arnold in Terminator: Salvation.

Also: porn.

CGI porn would have the advantage of 1) being able to show characters doing any kind of sick shit, which human actors might be unwilling or unable to do; and 2) no possibility of disease.
 
I think they've definitely figured out the dead-eye problem, but the apes still looked a little too CG for my taste. Unlike the aliens from Avatar or District 9, I know what real apes look like, and these ones just didn't entirely convince me.

Still an excellent movie though.
 
I think they've definitely figured out the dead-eye problem, but the apes still looked a little too CG for my taste. Unlike the aliens from Avatar or District 9, I know what real apes look like, and these ones just didn't entirely convince me.
Exactly. They don't look 100% real, but are a huge step in the right direction.

I personally think it is only a matter of time before computers can render humans or animals 100% convincingly.

The question is, what does that mean for the art of film? What happens when you can create a 100% realistic person on the cheap?
 
^ SAG would probably bitch and moan about that. :sigh:

Yeah, probably. I don't think CGI will ever replace human actors entirely. While it has been explored in scifi that there may one day be an entirely fabricated celebrity, I think people will always want to see a person they know is real and has a real life and all the drama that goes with it.
 
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