DC's New 52: Reviews and Discussion (Spoilers welcolme and likely)

[Admiral_Young]

I'm also going to pipe up and say we need a Damian Wayne Robin ongoing...it's freaking time. I don't know who could write it without totally wrecking the character, MAYBE J.T. Krul since I enjoyed Daiman's Teen Titans cross over. Maybe they're waiting for Morrison to end his Batman run before giving him an ongoing. This needs to happen.


Also just finished Legion of Superheroes #1 and yep this is just carrying on from the previous arcs. The Legion picking up the pieces after Earth Man's sacrifice and Saturn Queen's assault on Legion World and the Academy. The art is awesome. Levitz's writing is the same. It can be frustrating as he seems to seed plots a lot only to leave you guessing as to when they will be picked up, if at all. Mon-El is no longe Green Lantern as he full filled those duties according to Diodynes who left them to search for the new GL. Pretty much status quo in the future Long Live the Legion!

 

[Hound of UIster]

Well, I should have it delivered to me soon, has no one read it yet? I mean, it's Batman! Why are we talking about Supergirl and others. What was Batman like?!

I thought this was easily the best book of the week. It was a very dense read. Snyder really shouldn't be compared to Morrison, he is more like Brubaker or Rucka.

The overarching plot in the batbooks seems to stem from Snyder that is the redevelopment of Gotham under Wayne Enterprises and whatever dark secrets that lurks in the ancient past of Gotham.

Batman > Wonder Woman > Nightwing > Cloak and Dagger >>>>> Birds of Prey > Catwoman > Red Hood

 

[Admiral_Young]

Red Hood is awesome...interesting uh...changes? Done to Kori.

 

[Dar70]

Boy dc really tricked people into this "reboot". I really dont see the incentive for new readers. Except to maybe trick them into buying no.1 issues. Looks like most of the previous story arcs are intact. I was expecting new jumping off points. New origins etc.

Oh well dc will enjoy good sales for a couple of issues and thats it. Nothing new really.

 

[Trekker4747]

So all of the old arcs are still intact?

 

[OdoWanKenobi]

Green Lantern Corps: Guy and John both try to get normal jobs, but their real jobs (being Green Lanterns) get in the way. Meanwhile some unseen enemy is going Elfen Lied on some Corps members. I was excited to see Tomasi come back to the book, but this issue didn't wow. The best Green Lantern Corps moments were between Guy and Kyle. Those two just clicked. Guy and John just don't have that same kind of chemistry. I wish they hadn't decided to change the lineup. Let John go mess around with the New Guardians, and keep Kyle together with Guy where he belongs.

Wonder Woman: Pretty good I guess. I'll admit to not ever having been much of a Wonder Woman fan, so I didn't really know what to expect. It seems a lot closer tied to mythology than standard superhero fare. I may continue checking this one out.

Batman: Now that's more like it, Mr. Wayne. Easily the best of the New 52 that I've read so far. Batman is out solving a mystery, and it's actually an intriguing one. I've noticed in all of the Batman books so far that they've been attempting to bring Batman away from the super neurotic and angsty way he's been written for quite some time. Good. Batman can certainly be that Dark Knight, but that doesn't mean he always has to be such a downer. This book, more than any other Batman book in a long time made me feel like I was watching (er, well reading) an episode of the Animated Series (except for Batman and Bullock actually working together.) That's a high compliment by the way.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Didn't Batman #1 come out today?

Yes, but it doesn't interest me.

 

[Professor Zoom]

So all of the old arcs are still intact?

Except those that aren't.

Less snarky answer: Batman and Green Lantern yes.

 

[Myasishchev]

Boy dc really tricked people into this "reboot". I really dont see the incentive for new readers. Except to maybe trick them into buying no.1 issues. Looks like most of the previous story arcs are intact. I was expecting new jumping off points. New origins etc.

Oh well dc will enjoy good sales for a couple of issues and thats it. Nothing new really.

That and the interstellar medium-like density are my major problems with the relaunch.

I mean, there are a few properties that seem relatively cleanly rebooted--the Superman family, Blue Beetle--or relaunched in a very new reader friendly way, even though it's possible the old continuity holds--Animal Man, Batwoman sort of--but for every incidence of them doing it right, you've got one of the Legion books, or Swamp Thing.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Frankly, though, the outrage over at some of the comics forums about the last pages of Catwoman is entertaining as all hell. These repressed, emotionally arrested readers accusing the DC people of being immature and trying to shock need to look up "projection."

Overall I think they're doing a good and successful job with the relaunch - the majority of comments about the majority of books are good, and they're continuing to generate items at places like USA Today a month in. Now, if you follow comics the publishing cycle means something, but to the news outlets a month-old story - "DC relaunches" - is just a month-old story.

They've gotten five or six times more money out of me this month than at any time I can remember since the 1990s, and I'm buying every title next month that I've bought this month.

 

[Admiral_Young]

Also Legion of Super-Heroes is in tact still carrying on as I mentioned. I don't think they tricked anyone at all. There is if one takes a logical non-emotional glance at things...something for everyone. I just don't think this approach works very well, but again we will see after the first arcs complete themselves.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

You know, though, this is like the oldTrek/nuTrek arguments a few years ago - saying that "the new version isn't all that" carries the implication, intended or not, that the producers tampered with and damaged something that was working.

I don't think that's true in either case. Just because they may have alienated some people by particular changes to things that they liked about the old version, or haven't immediately fulfilled every imagining that fans had about what the new stuff might aspire to, doesn't even strongly suggest that the new approach isn't going to be an improvement across the board for the company.

Right now, they've got one month's more extraordinary success than they could point to last month. When "sales dip" will they fall further, faster, than where they were, oh, three months ago? And does it make any difference either way, given that they were on a predictable path to extinction anyway?

I'm sure that, just like Trek, there's no shortage of people out there on the Intarnets who know exactly what they would have done instead that not only would have been universally recognized and hailed as better than this but could not have helped being stunningly successful in every respect.

 

[Myasishchev]

Also Legion of Super-Heroes is in tact still carrying on as I mentioned. I don't think they tricked anyone at all. There is if one takes a logical non-emotional glance at things...something for everyone. I just don't think this approach works very well, but again we will see after the first arcs complete themselves.

I dunno. You put a #1 on a cover, you raise certain expectations. Legion Lost and to a lesser degree the LSH title are extremely poor introductions. I mean, jeez, even a text recap page would be something. I'm not saying I got tricked (especially on LSH today, I mean, I knew what I was getting into) but c'mon. There's got to be a better way to do it than that.

ETA: actually, on reflection, I might go so far as to say that Legion Lost was more comprehensible than LSH. In LSH, they're sad 'cause someone died. Thankfully, they refer to them by their given name, so there's no confusion there at all. Also, they have awesome, well-known Legionnaires like Chemical King and some woman with red hair who breathes... acid? Why do you need Lady Reptile when you have Chemical King? Corrosion is sort of his bag, isn't it? Also, I initially thought Chemical King was a redesigned Matter-Eater Lad (sunglasses, green and yellow color scheme) and am disappointed even though only my ignorance is to blame.

I guess it has Brainiac in it. Hooray! And I will give them credit for setting up what a "Daxamite" is, in dialogue between Brainy and Mon-El, before the last page reveal. That's almost like trying.

***

So far, the only things I really want to get next month are Animal Man, Action, Batwoman, and Wonder Woman. Although I guess if you just handed me the Legion books, Supergirl, OMAC, and Resurrection Man, I would read them. I might get them? But seriously, Grifter sucks. Don't buy it, folks!

I feel like I need to pick up Demon Knights from last week, too. It's supposed to be the good Paul Cornell, like in Action Comics or Knight and Squire (which I didn't read but am assured is quality), not a horse pill like Stormwatch.

What's up next week anyway? Flash, Firestorm, Justice League Almond are the only ones of note I can think of (I guess there's New Guardians; I hope it has a villain powered by cocaine).

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Out of curiosity, what were the DC books you bought in July?

This is a pretty massive, coordinated effort to remake the entire operation along business and creative lines that are very different from the past. It's a little bit amazing that it's actually been undertaken by people who have been with the company for a while now - almost as if Braga and Berman had gone in to the office in the third year of Enterprise and turned the show into something like the J.J. Abrams movie.

There's no question that a number of the 52 titles will be weak in sales, creativity or both and will tank early - they're doing so much, all at the same time. It looks as if they've expected that - it's not a failure of the model, it's an understood part of it. Every network and cable outlet on TV puts money into new shows every year knowing that some of them will flat-out bomb.

The trick for them will be staying on course month after month, identifying and disposing of failures without sentimentality or undue loyalty. This isn't going to be as cut-and-dried a process, I'd guess, as it is for ABC or CBS because the standards of measurement are probably not as well-defined - the network accountants can draw a curve months in advance based on what a show's costing them not only production-wise but in give-backs to sponsors and say "If we keep it on through January we'll be bleeding more money than we're willing to tolerate. It's gone."

 

[Hound of UIster]

Also Aquaman and Superman for next week.

 

[Saga]

Red Hood is awesome...interesting uh...changes? Done to Kori.

you could say that again.

 

[Admiral_Young]

I wasn't just referring to her body...she's almost a totally new character which I guess is the intent. Yet how does Roy remember stuff that she doesn't? Unless of course she is choosing to simply ignore her past.

 

[Saga]

I wasn't just referring to her body...she's almost a totally new character which I guess is the intent. Yet how does Roy remember stuff that she doesn't? Unless of course she is choosing to simply ignore her past.

i'm not one to ever say that something is 'ruined, ruined forever.' or 'my childhood has been raped'...but i just can't see how someone would think, 'yeah, make Starfire a slut. thats gold!'

 

[Myasishchev]

Out of curiosity, what were the DC books you bought in July?

Fair enough.

But that's the thing, while they sparked my interest in the DCU as a whole, it's not like I didn't have an interest before--they just disarmed my discrimination. It's looking like it'll be back down to three or so in a couple of months. But maybe four or five, who knows?

And if you'll also be fair, I would've bought Batwoman back when it was originally solicited too. And I'd have been buying Superman if it hadn't been JMSed, and wouldn't have dropped Booster Gold if it hadn't been Jurgensed.

I'm not down on relaunch as a whole, though, and you're right; people seem to care a lot more, to be showing a lot more interest and willingness to part with their dollars. I guess they've succeeded, but it's a qualified success. I've been trying to point out their individual triumphs along with their individual failures. The only thing that gets me is that some of the failures seemed to be easily avoidable.

Also Aquaman and Superman for next week.

Oh yeah. Alright, week 4 could be the strongest, potentially. I'm faintly curious about both of those. I expect them to sort of suck, but Geoff Johns has been surprising me lately, almost to the extent that I'm tempted to get back into Green Lantern. Only so long as the reports of an idiot man-child Hal Jordan are not exaggerated.

 

[Saga]

anyway, i thought Nightwing and DC Universe Presents Deadman were the best comics of this week. i like how Dick has 'leveled up' from his time as Batman.