Worst examples of jobbing?

[JoeZhang]

Jobbing describes a situation where a character defeats another character ('The Jobber') in a way that makes little sense given their relatively power levels because the plot demands it. For example in a Captain America story from a couple of years ago, Cap knocked out the Hulk with one punch to the face.

What examples of jobbing bug you? Who is the biggest jobber in fiction?

 

[Hound of UIster]

Anytime Superman physically beats Darkseid.

 

[Myasishchev]

The worst example of jobbing has to be from The World According to Garp.

...Oh, you're using a different definition.

(Anyway, my real answer is every time a character with superspeed is given trouble or even defeated by a strategem that would be immediately countered by the fact they're a thousand or ten thousand times faster than you or I. See: The Dark Knight Returns, any given issue of JLA, any given issue of The Flash.)

 

[JoeZhang]

The worst example of jobbing has to be from The World According to Garp.

...Oh, you're using a different definition.

(Anyway, my real answer is every time a character with superspeed is given trouble or even defeated by a strategem that would be immediately countered by the fact they're a thousand or ten thousand times faster than you or I. See: The Dark Knight Returns, any given issue of JLA, any given issue of The Flash.)

Like the time, Deathstroke took down the Flash by stabbing him in the leg?

More broadly, I think you are correct, that the very concept of Superspeed lends itself to jobbing - otherwise, pretty much flash story should be over in two panels and conclude with the bad-guys wondering why they are naked in a prison cell.

 

[Nerys Myk]

kinky

 

[Myasishchev]

The worst example of jobbing has to be from The World According to Garp.

...Oh, you're using a different definition.

(Anyway, my real answer is every time a character with superspeed is given trouble or even defeated by a strategem that would be immediately countered by the fact they're a thousand or ten thousand times faster than you or I. See: The Dark Knight Returns, any given issue of JLA, any given issue of The Flash.)

Like the time, Deathstroke took down the Flash by stabbing him in the leg?

Indeed, or that time Batman beat up four Martians.

At least a fair number of Flash-specific villains have some sort of anti-speed countermeasure, like Captain Cold and his slows-things-down field, or Mirror Master and his magic powers. But putting the Flash against Deathstroke or Prometheus or anyone like that, he should pretty much never be beaten, or even inconvenienced.

The real kicker is that they always forget that the superspeed characters think at superspeed too. Superman can draw a ten-mile long flow chart on Batman's projected actions and reactions before the latter can toss a Batarang across a room.

 

[sojourner]

Batman vs Guy Gardner: One Punch! Bwah hahahaha!

 

[Owain Taggart]

Anytime Superman physically beats Darkseid.

Ha, it definitely was in the Smallville finale. Talk about cheap!

 

[Christopher]

Batman vs Guy Gardner: One Punch! Bwah hahahaha!

I don't think that counts, because Guy had agreed in advance not to use his ring, hadn't he? So it was just Batman versus an ordinary mortal, not Batman versus a Green Lantern's powers. In which case, obviously Batman's gonna win.

 

[Sheep]

The Borg.

 

[BillJ]

Batman vs Guy Gardner: One Punch! Bwah hahahaha!

I don't think that counts, because Guy had agreed in advance not to use his ring, hadn't he? So it was just Batman versus an ordinary mortal, not Batman versus a Green Lantern's powers. In which case, obviously Batman's gonna win.

Yeah. Guy takes off his ring and hands it to Black Canary, who promptly tosses it away. It's how we ended up with "Nice" Guy.

 

[the G-man]

Damn. The point about the Flash is so true I can't think of anything better.

As far as "Batman beats the Martians" thing, that didn't bother me at the time because it was shown to be a result of Batman having figured out who they were and setting a trap. Of course, had I known it was merely the beginning of the Morrison-created "with enough prep time uber-Bat can defeat anyone" cliche I might have felt differently.

Speaking of the "uber-Bat," the more recent "Batman fights Darkseid" thing bothered me more.

 

[Bonzo the Fifth]

I'd say Batman vs a lot of people would be an example of an ENTIRE UNIVERSE jobbing to one character. Nothing against Batman, but, seriously, the whole 'prep time' argument has, at this point, become worse than cliche. The man's MORTAL, for crying out loud. He does amazing things, given his relative disabled status compared to DC's metahumans. There's really no need to give him an almost mystical Field of Winning for every single encounter he has with... well, anyone... most of the time, it just makes uberpowerful people (Superman being the best example) look stupid and incompetent for no good reason...

Doctor Doom has much the same problem from the Marvel side... unfortunately, most of the time, the writers rely less on 'prep time' arguments there and just take the lazy way out of the timeworn 'all according to plan' or the perennial 'It was a Doombot'.

It just goes to show that infallible characters can get boring, regardless of moral alignment...

 

[Christopher]

Of course, had I known it was merely the beginning of the Morrison-created "with enough prep time uber-Bat can defeat anyone" cliche I might have felt differently.

That predates Morrison by decades. A running gag in the Adam West series was that Batman always, always had insanely plot-specific gadgets ready in his utility belt, often accompanied by lectures on the importance of being prepared for anything -- whether it was an Empty Alphabet Soup Bat-Container and Batfunnel or a supply of live fish in case he needed to reward a helpful seal.

 

[JoeZhang]

Along those lines, one of the nice things about For the man who has everything is that when Mongul reveals himself, Batman doesn't even consider taking him on and remarks to Robin that the fight between Mongul and Wonder Woman is completely 'out of their league' (or words to that effect) and they get on with doing some detective work, he doesn't even make an attempt to take him on. I think if written today, Batman would slug it out with Mongul and defeat him while Wonder Woman looks like a putz in the corner.

 

[Agenda]

That's similar to the 80s' Crisis on Infinite Earths. Batman barely shows up in the series because he's portrayed as a human in a suit. Most of the action is reserved for the super-powered heroes. But if Crisis was done again these days, Batman would probably be taking on the Anti-Monitor by himself.

 

[JoeZhang]

A example of em.. "anti-jobbing" I saw and liked was in JMS's last Spider-Man story - Spider-Man takes on the Kingpin and just beats the shit out of him - telling him, "at the end of the day, you are only Human and I'm not". His early Squadron Superior was similar in that when Nighthawk (A Batman analogue) takes on a meta-human, the guy without effort almost kills him.

Also now I think about it, John Ostrander did something similar in a JLA else-world, where all of the non-powered heroes are pumped up to their eyeballs on steroids and using power armour but still can't compete with meta-humans.

 

[Christopher]

Why is it called "jobbing?"

 

[Admiral_Young]

Joe explains "jobbing" in his original post. It's a pro wrestling term. Yeah the Kingpin/Peter thing would be a good example of anti-jobbing. I'll have to think about this a bit.

 

[Myasishchev]

Damn. The point about the Flash is so true I can't think of anything better.

As far as "Batman beats the Martians" thing, that didn't bother me at the time because it was shown to be a result of Batman having figured out who they were and setting a trap. Of course, had I known it was merely the beginning of the Morrison-created "with enough prep time uber-Bat can defeat anyone" cliche I might have felt differently.

Yeah, but look at how the scene is staged. Batman has already defeated A-Mortal. Fine, he caught A-Mortal with his pants down, but that which should put every remaining Martian on the highest of guards, because they know 1)he's a great detective and 2)their own intense vulnerability to fire.

Instead, they permit him to spout tough guy lines and explain how he deduced their Martian origin (something he's done which they should have already figured out, since it's the most obvious way he defeated A-Mortal). Then they permit him to light a match. One of them is even arrogant enough to say "That little flame can't hurt us."

However, in the time she said that, any one of the three Martians surrounding Batman could have rushed him, and torn him to pieces. Or stayed still, and Martian-visioned him to pieces. Or used their telepathy to tear his mind to pieces. Instead, they allow him to flick the match into a ring of gasoline (I won't get into how being inside a ring of gasoline is not a healthy place for a human to be either).

But! Let's concede them the arrogance. Any one of the three could have caught the match before it reached the gasoline.

But! Let's concede they were afraid for a moment, and didn't act.

They had been, a few pages previously, shown to be able to almost keep pace with Wally West. They can still outrun the chemical reaction of the gasoline before it reaches a level to produce large, disabling flames. They're watching a small fire fall, and then gasoline oxidize, for a subjective hour, yet do nothing.

This is why Flash/Superman-level superspeed is sort of a broken power. At least, it's very difficult to plausibly write about, unless you give everyone else the same ability.