What Is the Definitive Version of TMP?

[Brutal Strudel]

Personally, the only thing the DE or the SLV has that truly improves upon the original release is the "I weep for Vejur" scene. Cutting that was criminal. Other than that, I can live with the shitty Vulcan matte and the sound mix and the viewscreen gazing.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

I think that the exteriors of V'Ger itself as the cloud dissipates and it approaches Earth in the DE are nice because they finally give some of the visual sense of scale of the whole thing as well as showing off the overall design. Keeping it mysterious and never getting a good look at it works, but so does letting us see what the artists intended.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

^^^n the theatrical release the scene starts with "Make your point, Doctor." The reason they cut those lines is they're not necessary.

I think they are. The DE and theatrical versions of that scene start right in the middle of the argument, and not in a good way. In the SLV, the "And another thing..." gives a pretty funny impression that the argument's been going on for awhile, but it doesn't do it unnaturally. Then McCoy gets deadly serious with his line about "command fitness."

For the scene to suddenly start with him mentioning to Kirk that "the point is that it's you who's competing," cheapens that line somehow. Even if Kirk gets to say "Make your point, Doctor" first, that line means nothing if we don't get to hear WHY Kirk said that.

 

[Maurice]

^^^n the theatrical release the scene starts with "Make your point, Doctor." The reason they cut those lines is they're not necessary.

I think they are. The DE and theatrical versions of that scene start right in the middle of the argument, and not in a good way. In the SLV, the "And another thing..." gives a pretty funny impression that the argument's been going on for awhile, but it doesn't do it unnaturally. Then McCoy gets deadly serious with his line about "command fitness."

For the scene to suddenly start with him mentioning to Kirk that "the point is that it's you who's competing," cheapens that line somehow. Even if Kirk gets to say "Make your point, Doctor" first, that line means nothing if we don't get to hear WHY Kirk said that.

The theatrical release:
KIRK: Then I won't keep you from your duties any longer, Commander. Yes, Doctor.
BONES: He may be right, Jim.
...
KIRK: Make your point, Doctor.
BONES: The point Captain is that it's you whose' competing. You rammed getting this command down Starfleet's throat...

To my ear that all connect perfectly and that's how it was in the original release. YMMV.

 

[Warped9]

^^ Works for me. I understand it easily enough.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Seems perfectly reasonable to me.

 

[Mark 2000]

I personally like the extended ABC version the best. If anyone has the ability to rip the Bluray extra scenes I'd love to make an HD cut.

 

[Maurice]

I have on several occasions been tempted to re-edit TMP. I actually started doing it after ripping all the footage from the DE some years back. I wasn't surprised at how easily I was able to tighten up some of the scenes, as the editorial pace in place is just loose and slow in too many spots, especially in the middle.

 

[Pauln6]

I really want to see a tightened up longer version with the newer special effects. We could call it the SSSLV (Slightly Shorter Special Longer Version).

 

[Maurice]

When play-editing I figured out that one way to shorten the tour around the drydock was to take some of the shots from outside the dock (before the big reveal) and make them reflections on the travel pod window, which meant you kept all the views, but you sorta disguised the Enterprise more so when you finally see it that really is the first time you see any part of it clearly.

 

[Therin of Andor]

The SLV is not available on any modern format, pretty sure it was just VHS and LD.

But its extra footage is in the bonus features section of the DE DVD.

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

The SLV is not available on any modern format, pretty sure it was just VHS and LD.

But its extra footage is in the bonus features section of the DE DVD.

Yes, but it's not the same unless integrated into the movie.

 

[Harvey]

When play-editing I figured out that one way to shorten the tour around the drydock was to take some of the shots from outside the dock (before the big reveal) and make them reflections on the travel pod window, which meant you kept all the views, but you sorta disguised the Enterprise more so when you finally see it that really is the first time you see any part of it clearly.

If I were re-editing that sequence, the first thing I would remove would be all the cut-aways to Kirk and Scotty (with the exception of the close-up where Kirk first sees the Enterprise). It's just padding with the characters staring off into space.

 

[Mark 2000]

The SLV is not available on any modern format, pretty sure it was just VHS and LD.

But its extra footage is in the bonus features section of the DE DVD.

Yes, but it's not the same unless integrated into the movie.

Exactly. That's why I'd love the BR extras. I don't have a bluray drive to rip them with.

 

[Maurice]

When play-editing I figured out that one way to shorten the tour around the drydock was to take some of the shots from outside the dock (before the big reveal) and make them reflections on the travel pod window, which meant you kept all the views, but you sorta disguised the Enterprise more so when you finally see it that really is the first time you see any part of it clearly.

If I were re-editing that sequence, the first thing I would remove would be all the cut-aways to Kirk and Scotty (with the exception of the close-up where Kirk first sees the Enterprise). It's just padding with the characters staring off into space.

Disagree, because this sequence is in part about Kirk's passion for the ship as well as our own. Without at least some of those reactions it becomes a very inhuman sequence to most of the non-starship-porn-loving viewers.

 

[Harvey]

If the performances were better, I'd agree, but in most of the shots there's nothing there. The close-up of Kirk I mentioned is a notable exception; there might be a few other shots as well. But the vast majority of those cut-away shots don't express much of interest to me.

Honestly, though, I think that sequence is pretty close to being the proper length. It's the various V'Ger flyovers that feel endless every time I watch it.

In this youtube video, I'd point to the cut-away shots at 1:00, 1:10, 2:57, 3:04, 3:20, 3:53, and 4:10 as fat the sequence doesn't need.

 

[RAMA]

It will always be the version that Robert Wise wanted...the DE. Which is not the "original" version.

I don't care what some old man thought he wanted some twenty years ago. The TC is the original version and the SLV ist he extended version ... both are legit, the DE is not!

Sorry none of this matters...the DE is the definitive version.

They even used production materials from the 70s to create it...

RAMA

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

Sorry none of this matters...the DE is the definitive version.

They even used production materials from the 70s to create it...

RAMA

But, as has been previously stated, the DE production team may have had access to those materials, i.e. pre-production art, but didn't adhere to them and, more often than not, indulged themselves in "fanwank."

 

[Maurice]

Sorry none of this matters...the DE is the definitive version.

They even used production materials from the 70s to create it...

RAMA

But, as has been previously stated, the DE production team may have had access to those materials, i.e. pre-production art, but didn't adhere to them and, more often than not, indulged themselves in "fanwank."

Yep. Otherwise the city of San Francisco would look like this...

...instead of this...

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Sorry none of this matters...the DE is the definitive version.

No, it's not.

It's not even a movie. It's a video collage that's most likely simply going to be a curiosity since it exists only in a rapidly-dating format.

Possibly at some point in the future the studio will commission some new digital "improvements" for a later Bluray or other future format release, and that version will also have its fans who insist that it's "definitive."

The only version that could be said logically to "define" the movie would be the movie as it was released by the studio - and such definitions are really arguing over trivia anyway. That said, any version beyond the original release is simply a snapshot in a process of mucking about with the film for economic or creatively derivative reasons, will have some designation attached to it to distinguish it from earlier and later versions and will be itself superceded in due course.