A Private Little Right Wing War

[Anwar]

Why were the Klingons so interested in this world to begin with? What was the value there that they would be willing to get involved? Was it just some way of messing with the Feds, or what?

 

[Warped9]

Why were the Klingons so interested in this world to begin with? What was the value there that they would be willing to get involved? Was it just some way of messing with the Feds, or what?

A good question since it's not at all clear. My guess would be they want to lay claim to the planet for strategic or territorial reasons and this was their way of "developing" the planet. It could also have been a test of sorts to see what the Federation would do and how far would they go.

 

[Christopher]

We know from Mara in "Day of the Dove" that the Klingon Empire in the 23rd century was poor and in need of resources and land to feed its people. (Maybe that's why the destruction of Praxis, just one moon, threatened the whole empire's survival -- because it was teetering on the edge already.) So they may have wished to conquer Neural as a farming or mining world. Gaining a foothold near Federation territory would be good too.

 

[Warped9]

We know from Mara in "Day of the Dove" that the Klingon Empire in the 23rd century was poor and in need of resources and land to feed its people. (Maybe that's why the destruction of Praxis, just one moon, threatened the whole empire's survival -- because it was teetering on the edge already.) So they may have wished to conquer Neural as a farming or mining world. Gaining a foothold near Federation territory would be good too.

Good point. I forgot about the "Day Of The Dove" reference.

 

[Harvey]

BTW, I checked at the Orion Press and they don't have a treatment for this episode. I was curious to see if there were many changes to the script.

Looking at the finding aid for the Roddenberry papers at UCLA, Don Ingalls (who was credited under a pseudonym -- he didn't like the final teleplay's take on the material, apparently) wrote at least three story outlines (on April 30, June 1, and June 10 of 1967) for the episode before it went to the teleplay stage.

 

[Gov Kodos]

We know from Mara in "Day of the Dove" that the Klingon Empire in the 23rd century was poor and in need of resources and land to feed its people. (Maybe that's why the destruction of Praxis, just one moon, threatened the whole empire's survival -- because it was teetering on the edge already.) So they may have wished to conquer Neural as a farming or mining world. Gaining a foothold near Federation territory would be good too.

Good point. I forgot about the "Day Of The Dove" reference.

I'd be wary to accept that as a fact of life, when it can be as easily taken as her parroting or simply adhering to the Empire's justification for grabbing more lebensraum from the lesser species.

 

[Anwar]

The idea of a spacefaring empire being resource-poor is rather strange, unless it's some super-rare element they're low on that they're dependent on.

 

[Warped9]

Or maybe they're just really bad managers and administrators.

 

[Gov Kodos]

Or maybe they're just really bad managers and administrators.

All they know is guns and blowing shit up, do you think the average Klingon Knows how to install a toilet main?

 

[Warped9]

Or maybe they're just really bad managers and administrators.

All they know is guns and blowing shit up, do you think the average Klingon Knows how to install a toilet main?

No wonder they're often in a bad mood.

I remember David Gerrold in one of his books saying that the word disruptor in Klingon might translate as "shake it till it falls apart weapon."

 

[Christopher]

We know from Mara in "Day of the Dove" that the Klingon Empire in the 23rd century was poor and in need of resources and land to feed its people. (Maybe that's why the destruction of Praxis, just one moon, threatened the whole empire's survival -- because it was teetering on the edge already.) So they may have wished to conquer Neural as a farming or mining world. Gaining a foothold near Federation territory would be good too.

Good point. I forgot about the "Day Of The Dove" reference.

I'd be wary to accept that as a fact of life, when it can be as easily taken as her parroting or simply adhering to the Empire's justification for grabbing more lebensraum from the lesser species.

Doubtful. It's evident that the intent was to portray Mara as a sympathetic, reasonable character and to give some insight into the Klingons' side of things through her. She was kind of the Klingon equivalent of the "good German" in WWII films, the person on the other side who wasn't like the warmongering leaders, who represented the decency of the masses and didn't deserve to be hated. So I really think we were meant to take Mara's words at face value. I mean, the whole message of the episode was denouncing hate and pointless conflict, so it would be inconsistent for the story to paint Klingons in a purely negative light.

The idea of a spacefaring empire being resource-poor is rather strange, unless it's some super-rare element they're low on that they're dependent on.

Given today's understandings, yes, but Star Trek is full of such unrealistic assumptions. It's no different from having starships run out of power if they can't get some rare made-up element from a hostile planet, even when there are countless stars they could collect unlimited power from. Although ST at its best aspires to a fairly credible portrayal of space travel, even at its best it's more concerned with using space and aliens as allegories for our own issues. So such contrivances are just part of the show.

I remember David Gerrold in one of his books saying that the word disruptor in Klingon might translate as "shake it till it falls apart weapon."

No, that was from The Final Reflection by John M. Ford -- the "Researcher's Note" which prefaced the novel-within-the-novel. From p. 16-17:

For clarity's sake, certain klingonaase technical terms have been translated as their Federation standard equivalents: thus warp drive, transporter, disruptor instead of the more literal anticurve rider, particle displacer, vibratory destructor (most literally: the "shake-it-till-it-falls-apart-tool").

 

[Gov Kodos]

Good point. I forgot about the "Day Of The Dove" reference.

I'd be wary to accept that as a fact of life, when it can be as easily taken as her parroting or simply adhering to the Empire's justification for grabbing more lebensraum from the lesser species.

Doubtful. It's evident that the intent was to portray Mara as a sympathetic, reasonable character and to give some insight into the Klingons' side of things through her. She was kind of the Klingon equivalent of the "good German" in WWII films, the person on the other side who wasn't like the warmongering leaders, who represented the decency of the masses and didn't deserve to be hated. So I really think we were meant to take Mara's words at face value. I mean, the whole message of the episode was denouncing hate and pointless conflict, so it would be inconsistent for the story to paint Klingons in a purely negative light.




Given today's understandings, yes, but Star Trek is full of such unrealistic assumptions. It's no different from having starships run out of power if they can't get some rare made-up element from a hostile planet, even when there are countless stars they could collect unlimited power from. Although ST at its best aspires to a fairly credible portrayal of space travel, even at its best it's more concerned with using space and aliens as allegories for our own issues. So such contrivances are just part of the show.

I remember David Gerrold in one of his books saying that the word disruptor in Klingon might translate as "shake it till it falls apart weapon."

No, that was from The Final Reflection by John M. Ford -- the "Researcher's Note" which prefaced the novel-within-the-novel. From p. 16-17:

For clarity's sake, certain klingonaase technical terms have been translated as their Federation standard equivalents: thus warp drive, transporter, disruptor instead of the more literal anticurve rider, particle displacer, vibratory destructor (most literally: the "shake-it-till-it-falls-apart-tool").

We'll have to disagree on the doubtful aspect then. The idea that the Empire isn't poor isn't contradicted by her being the 'good German'. One can believe the party line and still be sympathetic as a character. One can even go along with it, even with misgivings. Rommel certainly did.

 

[Warped9]

I remember David Gerrold in one of his books saying that the word disruptor in Klingon might translate as "shake it till it falls apart weapon."

No, that was from The Final Reflection by John M. Ford -- the "Researcher's Note" which prefaced the novel-within-the-novel. From p. 16-17:

For clarity's sake, certain klingonaase technical terms have been translated as their Federation standard equivalents: thus warp drive, transporter, disruptor instead of the more literal anticurve rider, particle displacer, vibratory destructor (most literally: the "shake-it-till-it-falls-apart-tool").

Oh, right. Now it comes back to me.

 

[Christopher]

We'll have to disagree on the doubtful aspect then. The idea that the Empire isn't poor isn't contradicted by her being the 'good German'. One can believe the party line and still be sympathetic as a character. One can even go along with it, even with misgivings. Rommel certainly did.

But my point is that Mara was symbolic of the intent of the story, which was to reject the idea of pure hate toward an enemy and promote the idea of putting differences aside. So it follows, thematically, that Jerome Bixby intended Mara's description of Klingon conquests being motivated by poverty and hardship to be truthful -- to show that Klingons were not simplistically evil monsters but had understandable motives behind their seeming villainy.

So yes, if this were some sort of documentary, it would certainly be possible based on the facts at hand that Mara was lied to. But in fiction, things exist or occur for reasons, often with the goal of conveying a certain message or theme. Stories have a unifying logic behind them that reality generally lacks. Given the themes that pervaded "Day of the Dove," it would be inconsistent if Mara's description were false. Clinging to the assumption that Klingons were absolutely evil and motivated only by rapacity is missing the thematic point of the episode.

 

[Anwar]

But what about Kor's statement in "Errand of Mercy", where when Kirk accuses the Klingons of openly boasting about conquering half the Galaxy his reply is "And why not?! We're the stronger!"

Sure, he mentions something about the Feds messing up Klingon trade routes but that's BS motivation.

 

[Gov Kodos]

We'll have to disagree on the doubtful aspect then. The idea that the Empire isn't poor isn't contradicted by her being the 'good German'. One can believe the party line and still be sympathetic as a character. One can even go along with it, even with misgivings. Rommel certainly did.

But my point is that Mara was symbolic of the intent of the story, which was to reject the idea of pure hate toward an enemy and promote the idea of putting differences aside. So it follows, thematically, that Jerome Bixby intended Mara's description of Klingon conquests being motivated by poverty and hardship to be truthful -- to show that Klingons were not simplistically evil monsters but had understandable motives behind their seeming villainy.

So yes, if this were some sort of documentary, it would certainly be possible based on the facts at hand that Mara was lied to. But in fiction, things exist or occur for reasons, often with the goal of conveying a certain message or theme. Stories have a unifying logic behind them that reality generally lacks. Given the themes that pervaded "Day of the Dove," it would be inconsistent if Mara's description were false. Clinging to the assumption that Klingons were absolutely evil and motivated only by rapacity is missing the thematic point of the episode.

I'm not convinced as I see them being just as sympathetic even though they can be drawn as following an imperial policy that is acquisitive and expansionist.

 

[Sir Rhosis]

Just dropped in to point out that Gene Coon did no writing on this script. As stated above, Don Ingalls wrote the first draft, Roddenberry rewrote it, and Ingalls, disliking the final script, apparently because his was even more overtly anit-Vietnam War, substitued the pseudonym "Jud Crucis" on his Story By credit. In an old Starlog interview Ingalls said this was a bit of word play to suggest "Jesus Crucified," meaning that he felt he and his script and ideas/ideals had been well, crucified.

Sir Rhosis

 

[toonloon]

That's a good point about Day of the Dove, but as it was written AFTER this episode, you can't really apply it's reasoning retrospectively.

The motivations behind the Klingons aren't apparent because the comlpex real-life theory of 'the domino effect' and spreading communism around the globe. The USSR couldn't engage the US in a direct war so they did it in other people's countries under the guise of helping indigenous populations continue their way of existance. This parallel works in the episode because the title states implicitly that this is a Private Little War (between the Federation and the Klingons). Both parties are battling each other using the tribesmen as 'excuses' for continuing the hostilities that they can't wage out in the open - either because of the vast death and destruction that would be caused by an all out war or because they believe the Organians would step in and stop it.

 

[toonloon]

Just dropped in to point out that Gene Coon did no writing on this script. As stated above, Don Ingalls wrote the first draft, Roddenberry rewrote it, and Ingalls, disliking the final script, apparently because his was even more overtly anit-Vietnam War, substitued the pseudonym "Jud Crucis" on his Story By credit. In an old Starlog interview Ingalls said this was a bit of word play to suggest "Jesus Crucified," meaning that he felt he and his script and ideas/ideals had been well, crucified.

Sir Rhosis

I was hoping you'd pop in! I looked over your superb site but couldn't find anything. Thanks for clarifying that for me and pointing out my error. I thought Jud Crucis WAS Gene Coon, but I concede to your greater knowledge about the scripts and the writing process. (OT - any new additions to the site coming up?)

 

[Christopher]

But what about Kor's statement in "Errand of Mercy", where when Kirk accuses the Klingons of openly boasting about conquering half the Galaxy his reply is "And why not?! We're the stronger!"

Sure, he mentions something about the Feds messing up Klingon trade routes but that's BS motivation.

Well, metatextually, that was an earlier episode by a different writer, so it doesn't apply to my point about Jerome Bixby's intention in writing the script. And textually, Kor was a battle commander and military governor; of course he would be inclined to such an aggressive view. That doesn't mean that one man's viewpoint represents the complete objective truth about an entire civilization. The soldiers could believe their conquest was about glory and strength, while the economists and politicians and rank-and-file subjects could be aware that it was about resource acquisition to deal with their crippling poverty. Heck, for that matter, who's more motivated to boast about strength than those who secretly fear that they're weak?

That's a good point about Day of the Dove, but as it was written AFTER this episode, you can't really apply it's reasoning retrospectively.

Okay, in that case I wasn't speaking metatextually about the intent behind the writing process. An earlier poster asked a question about what the Klingons' in-universe motive for wanting Neural might have been. When addressing such a question in-universe, it's valid to consider anything that's been established about the subject, whether it comes from an earlier or a later episode. If the question had been a metatextual one about what Ingalls and Roddenberry intended the Klingons' motivation to be, then your objection would be valid, but that wasn't the question.

I thought Jud Crucis WAS Gene Coon, but I concede to your greater knowledge about the scripts and the writing process.

Gene Coon's pseudonym was Lee Cronin. Sounds similar enough to "Jud Crusis" that the confusion is understandable.