Music genres you don't 'get'

[PKTrekGirl]

PKTrekGirl,

Ok...here is a list.

22. Saliva
21. Nonpoint
20. Mudvayne
19. Puddle Of Mudd
18. Staind
17. P.O.D.
16. Papa Roach
15. Ill Nino
14. Disturbed
13. Drowning Pool
12. OTEP
11. Incubus
10. Linea 77
09. System Of A Down
08. Slipknot
07. HED P.E.
06. Coal Chamber
05. Soulfly
04. Limp Bizkit
03. Snot
02. Deftones
01. KoRn



Some bands I think you should check out if you haven't heard already...

Static X "Push it"
Trapt "Headstrong"
Machinehead "Now I Lay Thee Down"
Kittie "Cut Throat"
Mushroomhead "Simple Survival
Chevelle "The Red"
American Head Charge "Seamless"
Primer 55 "Loose"
Adema "Giving in"

Thanks Jetfire! You rock!

I especially couldn't read that Ill Nino album cover ( ) but I liked them a lot and have spent the last half hour reading through the comments trying to figure out who the hell they were!

With the exception of the alt rock bands I was already well familiar with (seems I was not alone in that opinion, now that I have read the comments) I will spend some time with each of these bands and see what comes of it. I have heard a few songs by a handful of them, but I can't say that I have given them a really fair listen. And some of them I have not even heard of before now. Plus, I will check out that other video link and the new links you posted. That ought to keep me busy for a while.

I think I have now listened to about every song The Birthday Massacre has put out (plus ordered some of their records - I am totally sold on those guys!) so I should have some free time opening up.

 

[Jetfire]

^
Yeah Some of the bands that were in that video are more alt rock than nu-metal...I may have to make my own list of nu-metal bands.

Glad you liked The Birthday Massacre.

 

[BlobVanDam]

Here are a couple of clips for the non death metallers. There are literally only a couple of death metal bands I can listen to, so I wouldn't call myself a death metal fan, but Arch Enemy are one of my favourite bands.
Much like any other vocals, I'm very pedantic about growled vocals. Usually I'm all for melodies, which is why I like Arch Enemy, because they make up for the lack of sung vocals with strong musical melodies (hence the genre classification of melodic death metal). And unlike most death metal, I can actually understand a vast majority of their lyrics (not that I care about lyrics, but if you're going to be hearing growls, it's nice for them to have some point).
They have strong melodies, energetic drumming, great riffs, and cool choruses. And a female vocalist!

[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=27lMKRPt-9o[/yt]

[yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2PuD3XrF9Hg[/yt]

Anyway, this probably won't change any minds of people who don't "get" death metal, but hopefully some real metal fans will enjoy them.

 

[Bob Morton]

What I don't get is Country Music. I think it's the antithesis to Death Metal - it's all about the lyric and a lesser emphasis, if any at all, on the musicianship.

"If any at all?" Nashville sessions are as selective and demanding as any in LA or NY, only the very best need bother to apply. It may not sound like it to you, but it is not easy to play.

--Justin

Fair enough, I'm sure there are superb musicians in every genre. With Country Music, though, I just don't get it..

 

[Bob Morton]

if you're going to be hearing growls, it's nice for them to have some point

What is the point of a growl in nature? If a wolf or a cougar growls at you in the middle of a dark forest you don't just say "there's no words in that, I don't understand!"

That is the purpose of a Death Metal vocalist; to convery the anger, fear, pain, warning, (or your imminent bloody demise) through the use of extreme vocalizations regardless of the language.

 

[BlobVanDam]

if you're going to be hearing growls, it's nice for them to have some point

What is the point of a growl in nature? If a wolf or a cougar growls at you in the middle of a dark forest you don't just say "there's no words in that, I don't understand!"

That is the purpose of a Death Metal vocalist; to convery the anger, fear, pain, warning, (or your imminent bloody demise) through the use of extreme vocalizations regardless of the language.

I get that (although a nice explanation nonetheless), I just meant that since growling doesn't contribute anything melodically, I at least like them to contribute something lyrically that I can understand.
The sound of the growls alone don't do much for me unless I hear some words too. I like to have something to "sing" along to when I have the music cranked

 

[Shazam!]

PKTrekGirl,

Ok...here is a list.

22. Saliva
21. Nonpoint
20. Mudvayne
19. Puddle Of Mudd
18. Staind
17. P.O.D.
16. Papa Roach
15. Ill Nino
14. Disturbed
13. Drowning Pool
12. OTEP
11. Incubus
10. Linea 77
09. System Of A Down
08. Slipknot
07. HED P.E.
06. Coal Chamber
05. Soulfly
04. Limp Bizkit
03. Snot
02. Deftones
01. KoRn

Is that a list of the worst bands of all time?

 

[Jetfire]

^

 

[PKTrekGirl]

^ I don't think so. True, with the exception of the alt rock bands on the list and maybe Slipknot, LimpBiskit and KoRn, the total extent of my exposure was the 30-second clip on that video...but I think that a few of them have potential. I'm kind of curious in particular about Nonpoint, POD, Ill Nino, Disturbed, Drowning Pool, OTEP, Coal Chamber, and Deftones. But we'll see.

Regardless, you must not be listening to much in the way of current pop music if you think that might be a list of the worst bands of all time. I mean, I'm no metalhead...but I'd rather listen to some of these guys than some of the shit that passes for Top 40 pop these days.

 

[Nerys Ghemor]

See, that doesn't even sound like the same band to me.

Now granted, I only selected 3 songs almost at random from YouTube...and you gave me this one (not sure if this is typical of their early period or an extreme that was presented to illustrate how much they have changed)...but the styles, to me, are completely different. Not a step or two two to one side or the other...but movement several steps in the lighter direction.

The point where I think the transition started happening was their album Vheissu. After that, they have tended much more towards softer music though there is still the occasional screaming.

I can only imagine what their original fan base thought of this drastic re-directioning. I bump into a fair number of Metallica fans & detractors on YouTube (particularly in my Alice In Chains circles) and seems like there is a lot of bitching about them 'selling out' (I wouldn't know - I don't listen to their music, based purely on the fact that Hetfield is a total dickwad ) But I would imagine that if a band like Metallica was taking heat for 'going soft', these guys surely must be as well.

I'm not sure. Thrice's lyrics tend to run towards the religious, so I am not sure if all of the fanbase is as demanding that they must hold to the exact same musical style. I suspect that they would run into more trouble if they were perceived to have crossed the line with their lyrical content. (They do not call themselves a Christian band, but the influence is unmistakable.)

Underoath can be pretty heavy, more screaming as opposed to clean vocals than later Thrice.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r1oedTV7Sbc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TQy5674frWM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TPisHjRRrtU

Yeah...this is pretty intense.

*sigh* Maybe I'm just not meant to like death metal.

I mean, I want to, kinda. And I do try things. I actually was kinda good with that band ISIS that O'Dib posted last night - I listened to that and the roaring didn't seem as bad. Maybe because I felt like it was well placed in the music, and not just roaring for the hell of it. I don't know.....

The vocalists that are capable of switching from one to the other are typically the ones I like the most.

Believe it or not, that middle song helped me in writing a story (along with a few other songs, with wildly different styles). I was trying to write an apocalyptic story and it was a tremendous help.

Someone once summed up the roles sung by mezzos in three words: "witches, bitches, and britches."

Not sure where, but I've heard them too.

In the death metal I've heard it's just "Blagrhghh glahhh woahhh blardgh gah wargh! Wah gargh themig fucking, glarg warh blarghhh!"

Depends on the vocalist--I have heard some capable of enunciating very clearly while growling.

Examples include Opeth, Killswitch Engage (with Howard Jones; Jesse Leach is not easy to understand), and Orphaned Land. I've included videos with lyrics to give you some examples. The trouble here, with Opeth, is not the vocalist's growling--it's his accent, such as when he mispronounces "swathed."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yrBrH5PZtcc

Here's Killswitch Engage.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MiJajHswcgc

Orphaned Land (again, difficulties are due to accent rather than his ability to enunciate while growling...also, some of the lyrics are not in English.)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IBqTUmyAZcw

I liked what I heard of Natacha Atlas when she guest starred in Peter Gabriel's project, Big Blue Ball (she sang "Habibi"). From that, I would definitely be willing to try more of her stuff. Is it easy to find, in the US?

I'm not sure but I would guess so as she was pretty commercial At the very least I imagine she'd be on iTunes or other alternatives.

That's good to know.

 

[Nerys Ghemor]

if you're going to be hearing growls, it's nice for them to have some point

What is the point of a growl in nature? If a wolf or a cougar growls at you in the middle of a dark forest you don't just say "there's no words in that, I don't understand!"

That is the purpose of a Death Metal vocalist; to convery the anger, fear, pain, warning, (or your imminent bloody demise) through the use of extreme vocalizations regardless of the language.

I get that (although a nice explanation nonetheless), I just meant that since growling doesn't contribute anything melodically, I at least like them to contribute something lyrically that I can understand.
The sound of the growls alone don't do much for me unless I hear some words too. I like to have something to "sing" along to when I have the music cranked

Some of the better vocalists enunciate clearly, and since I don't have the right voice for growling (being a soprano with a small voice kind of rules that out), if a band has growls but there is a very good tune, I'll find myself singing in the role of a backup vocalist. Oddly enough, it works out well with the more melodic kinds of songs where there is growling.

 

[Shurik]

Orphaned Land (again, difficulties are due to accent rather than his ability to enunciate while growling)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IBqTUmyAZcw

Mabool is in my top 10 metal albums of all time. It's full of everything interesting you might ever want from metal, any genre ...
I've seen them perform it in its entirety here in Israel, with choir, chelloists and all - an amazing experience. If you get the chance to see them live - do it.

 

[Bob Morton]

What is the point of a growl in nature? If a wolf or a cougar growls at you in the middle of a dark forest you don't just say "there's no words in that, I don't understand!"

That is the purpose of a Death Metal vocalist; to convery the anger, fear, pain, warning, (or your imminent bloody demise) through the use of extreme vocalizations regardless of the language.

I get that (although a nice explanation nonetheless), I just meant that since growling doesn't contribute anything melodically, I at least like them to contribute something lyrically that I can understand.
The sound of the growls alone don't do much for me unless I hear some words too. I like to have something to "sing" along to when I have the music cranked

Some of the better vocalists enunciate clearly, and since I don't have the right voice for growling (being a soprano with a small voice kind of rules that out), if a band has growls but there is a very good tune, I'll find myself singing in the role of a backup vocalist. Oddly enough, it works out well with the more melodic kinds of songs where there is growling.

That's the conceit of most people that listen to music; they must be able to understand the lyrics and that somehow speaks to the quality of the music itself. Enunciation is not necessarily a marker of quality in Death Metal vocals.

In some of the softer bands you mention I admit, the ability to understand the lyrics and sing-along to them is high on the list of things that make it good music.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

I am not unilaterally opposed to unintelligible lyrics. If I were, I wouldn't be a Cocteau Twins fan.

 

[BlobVanDam]

I get that (although a nice explanation nonetheless), I just meant that since growling doesn't contribute anything melodically, I at least like them to contribute something lyrically that I can understand.
The sound of the growls alone don't do much for me unless I hear some words too. I like to have something to "sing" along to when I have the music cranked

Some of the better vocalists enunciate clearly, and since I don't have the right voice for growling (being a soprano with a small voice kind of rules that out), if a band has growls but there is a very good tune, I'll find myself singing in the role of a backup vocalist. Oddly enough, it works out well with the more melodic kinds of songs where there is growling.

That's the conceit of most people that listen to music; they must be able to understand the lyrics and that somehow speaks to the quality of the music itself. Enunciation is not necessarily a marker of quality in Death Metal vocals.

In some of the softer bands you mention I admit, the ability to understand the lyrics and sing-along to them is high on the list of things that make it good music.

I have never put much importance on lyrics, so hearing the words isn't a prerequisite or an indication of quality (otherwise where does that leave instrumental music? :P), but that said I do generally find myself less interested in music if I can't at least understand some lyrics. Doesn't matter what the lyrics are, I just find that knowing the lyrics helps me get into the song, being able to participate in some way as a listener.

 

[Shurik]

Here's another growler whom I find not that difficult to understand - Johan Hegg from Amon Amarth:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3WJX1cIuY4

 

[BlobVanDam]

Here's another growler whom I find not that difficult to understand - Johan Hegg from Amon Amarth:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P3WJX1cIuY4

On first listen I understood the majority of the words.
Never heard these guys before, although I didn't mind it. Might check out some more of their music.

 

[Goliath]

Looking over this thread, I think we can conclude that the farther a musical genre is from from the traditional popular song (melodic singing style, verse-chorus-verse-chorus structure, instrumental accompaniment) the fewer the people who "get" it.

I wonder what it is about the traditional popular song that appeals to so many people?

 

[BlobVanDam]

Looking over this thread, I think we can conclude that the farther a musical genre is from from the traditional popular song--melodic singing style, verse-chorus-verse-chorus structure, instrumental accompaniment--the fewer the people who "get" it.

I wonder what it is about the traditional popular song that appeals to so many people?

I think it's the fact that it's common and familiar, so people are used to that style, and it evolves slowly as a whole, so it never sounds too foreign to people. Whereas the average pop fan doesn't hear death metal every day, so that's going to be jarring to them regardless of whether the music is good or not.

That and the fact that pop music isn't usually written to a niche, so it's pretty safe in terms of song lengths, familiar proven structures and attempting to write catchy melodies.

 

[Bob Morton]

Just for fun here is one of the most extreme vocalist's I've ever heard. I'm not sure there are any lyrics whatsoever.

Wormed - Uncoloured...

There's a bunch of vocals in the first 20 seconds so you don't have to listen to it for the whole thing.