Just re-watched The Valiant. Reminded me of Star Trek 2009...

[infinix]

Kirk and Pike were the only ones to really get a promotion though. Scott was already in Starfleet and received a new job (not really a new rank, unless I'm mistaken), McCoy was a full MD before he joined Starfleet (in the real world, quite a few hospitals have Chiefs that are younger than McCoy -- it's about who can take command most efficiently), and Spock and Sulu were already done with the academy when we got to them. As for ranks while still in the academy, that's already been covered, so Uhura doesn't have much to worry about.

The only two people that seem off are Kirk's rather quick promotion -- and Chekov's newfound Wesley status.

Pike was already the captain and I could understand that this ONE mission was finally the one that pushed his accomplishments over the precipice to Admiraldom...

As far as Kirk was concerned, there were really 3 options.

1. Best Option: Promote everyone on the bridge one rank. (since everyone, except Uhura, participated directly in saving Earth)

2. Middle Ground: Promote everyone on the bridge one rank, but Kirk two ranks because it can be argues that Kirk contributed the most on the missions.

3. Worst Case: Ignore everyone else, promoted Kirk to CAPTAIN.

It doesn't matter that this is a reboot. It doesn't matter that JJ Kirk saved the Earth. Common sense demands that you don't promote an Ensign to Captain, a 7 rank jump, after one mission, after basically 3 days in command.

 

[Hartzilla2007]

Kirk as a lieutenant while still a cadet goes all the way back to TOS. Uhura was also held the rank of lieutenant while still a cadet in STXI.

Kirk wasn't being kicked out of the academy - McCoy said, "the board will rule in your favour, most likely". Recall that Kirk Prime also cheated his third Kobayshi Maru test, and was given a commendation for it. Why assume this Kirk, doing the same thing, would get kicked out?

I'll give you the fact that Kirk Prime also cheated on the Kobayashi Maru test. But the JJ Kirk was at least being suspended from the Academy.

He was on acedemic suspension until the board ruled on what to do with him, you know in the board of inqury that was interrupted by the Vulcan crisis BEFORE KIRK EVEN HAD A CHANCE TO RESPOND TO SPOCK! For all we know he was about launch into the usually Kirkish speech that would rip opposition's (Spock in this case) argument apart there by getting his comendation.

 

[F. King Daniel]

Lets go the other direction. In Enterprises final episode (These Are The Voyages), no one had been promoted in a decade of service.

Worst. Episode. Ever.

The ranks were unchanged because the episode was originally set right after "Demons"/"Terra Prime", and bumped up at the last minute, in a halfheated manner. It was supposed to be the signing of the Coalition, not the Federation in the holoprogram (hence Troi's lines at the end)



Using Data as a promotion yardstick is a rather weak comparison, since he was totally naive at the start of TNG. And, frankly, he's not James Kirk. Nor is Geordi (who was USS Challenger captain in the future of "Timeless") or Harry Kim (USS Rhode Island captain in "Endgame") or Tom Paris, or Wesley Crusher or Will "Comfort Zone" Riker (who ended Nemesis as Titan captain)

The TOS crew are not just another group of people in a spaceship, they're the uber-legends of Star Trek. STXI treated them as such.

 

[BillJ]

The TOS crew are not just another group of people in a spaceship, they're the uber-legends of Star Trek. STXI treated them as such.

And I really think that's where my problems with this film come in. When I watch Star Trek: The Original Series, I don't see a group of uber-legends. I see a group of people together doing a job.

Orci and Kurtzman sitting them up on a pedestal just didn't sit well with this long time fan.

 

[Anwar]

They weren't really legends in their own time, they only became that by the TNG Era and even then they weren't totally overblown hero legend types.

 

[F. King Daniel]

They weren't really legends in their own time, they only became that by the TNG Era and even then they weren't totally overblown hero legend types.

Then how do you explain them getting away with all that happened in STIII? All charges dropped, the whole crew kept together and even gifted with a duplicate USS Enterprise?

 

[The Mirrorball Man]

They weren't really legends in their own time, they only became that by the TNG Era and even then they weren't totally overblown hero legend types.

Then how do you explain them getting away with all that happened in STIII? All charges dropped, the whole crew kept together and even gifted with a duplicate USS Enterprise?

They're just big damn heroes.

 

[BillJ]

They weren't really legends in their own time, they only became that by the TNG Era and even then they weren't totally overblown hero legend types.

Then how do you explain them getting away with all that happened in STIII? All charges dropped, the whole crew kept together and even gifted with a duplicate USS Enterprise?

You know... I think Starfleet did that simply to keep an eye on them. They couldn't drum them out of the service after saving the planet and it was probably easier to keep an eye on all seven together than splitting them up.

 

[Rom's Sehlat]

It's the future, where humanity is perfect! Kirk and Co. obviously did the right thing at the right time, when everyone else was opposed to doing right! So of course they get a ship again, just keep on keeping on until Spock dies for real... which 'happened' when he got sucked into the JJverse!

 

[Anwar]

Kirk an co only got off easy (with Kirk being demoted) because they had just saved Earth from the Whale Probe.

And they probably earned brownie points for saving Earth from V'Ger as well. Same reason Riker wasn't dishonorably discharged after "Pegasus": they couldn't just treat the guy who saved Earth from the Borg THAT badly.

 

[Cyke101]

Kirk and Pike were the only ones to really get a promotion though. Scott was already in Starfleet and received a new job (not really a new rank, unless I'm mistaken), McCoy was a full MD before he joined Starfleet (in the real world, quite a few hospitals have Chiefs that are younger than McCoy -- it's about who can take command most efficiently), and Spock and Sulu were already done with the academy when we got to them. As for ranks while still in the academy, that's already been covered, so Uhura doesn't have much to worry about.

The only two people that seem off are Kirk's rather quick promotion -- and Chekov's newfound Wesley status.

Pike was already the captain and I could understand that this ONE mission was finally the one that pushed his accomplishments over the precipice to Admiraldom...

As far as Kirk was concerned, there were really 3 options.

1. Best Option: Promote everyone on the bridge one rank. (since everyone, except Uhura, participated directly in saving Earth)

2. Middle Ground: Promote everyone on the bridge one rank, but Kirk two ranks because it can be argues that Kirk contributed the most on the missions.

3. Worst Case: Ignore everyone else, promoted Kirk to CAPTAIN.

It doesn't matter that this is a reboot. It doesn't matter that JJ Kirk saved the Earth. Common sense demands that you don't promote an Ensign to Captain, a 7 rank jump, after one mission, after basically 3 days in command.

Why are there only three options? Even #3, the option you want to assign to the film, isn't accurate -- Spock for a time was captain, and Uhura, McCoy, and Scotty got new jobs even if they didn't get rank promotions (Scotty and Uhura helped save the ship from destruction, for one thing); Sulu saved Kirk twice (once while in command of the Enterprise) as well as the final mission and most likely was rewarded for that. The way you're framing the three options seems pretty arbitrary -- for example, everyone can stay the same rank but Kirk is allowed to graduate well ahead of his class and straight onto the Enterprise; or a variation of #2 in that Kirk gets three ranks; or a variation of #1 make Kirk Pike's first officer instead of Spock's, etc. etc.

Does the way Kirk's promotion was handled make much sense? Not really (like I said earlier in the thread, I didn't like it), but I think the way you're arguing for the case is fairly problematic and doesn't acknowledge what really happened in the film. Yes, I would have preferred something like Pike remaining in command for the next film or for Kirk assuming captaincy in a flash-forward of a few years' time before the credits rolled. Or better yet, have the Academy be one act and then Kirk's first mission as captain be the next act set several years later.

But the gap that you paint isn't as large as it really was. Besides, Kirk wasn't an ensign when the crisis started, he was already a lieutenant according to Chekov's computer, which is the same as Cadet Saavik in TWOK and importance to the senior staff; really, Scotty, Uhura, and Sulu didn't seem to mind the emphasis that the Big Three were putting on Saavik over them. No one (of consequence) was really shortchanged when Kirk was promoted, and Spock even wanted to serve under him, rather than bear a grudge. It was a large gap for Kirk to become captain yes, but let's not exaggerate or get the ranks wrong in order to make the gap larger than it is.