Why do People like Ezri?
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Im a big fan of ezri, she was the innocent eyes viewing the whole ds9 arc. I never really liked Jadzia that much.
I really like the way she seemed to trying to explore and try to figure out who she was which is a storyline that continues into the novels and there where some great episodes like field of fire in which she explores who she is seeing as she suddenly has all these lives of experience thrown at her.
I also kind of felt she freshened the show up a little bit, we got new character relationships, i felt she helped give bashir something that he lacked in the previous series.
I really like the way she seemed to trying to explore and try to figure out who she was which is a storyline that continues into the novels and there where some great episodes like field of fire in which she explores who she is seeing as she suddenly has all these lives of experience thrown at her.
I also kind of felt she freshened the show up a little bit, we got new character relationships, i felt she helped give bashir something that he lacked in the previous series.
That's oversimplifying the issue to a ridiculous extent. It's not simply about hologram or not. The type of person Vic was, that he wasn't Starfleet, how he reacted to Nog, these had an intrinsic effect that the others couldn't emulate. If someone actively puts up a barrier against you because you're a counselor, pushing harder won't help.
I have to disagree. She's obviously very confused about the whole affair, and about more than what she talks about. Things she feels, remembers, etc. are all jumbled up, and while she's stable by the end of the show, I don't think it's even rational to assume she has everything completely perfectly sorted out. Again, I think you are really oversimplifying the emotions and thought processes behind the character.
Yes, I do. Field of Fire is, in fact, one of my favorite episodes of DS9. What about it?
^ Agreed. Very cute indeed.
Thank you, mate. I appreciate it. I really needed a good laugh.
"It was fucking good ham."
Nothing against the actress, but Ezri sucked. For half the season we had to listen to her whiny ass going on about how she didn't know who she was, and then they apparently tried to make MU Ezri bad-ass (laughable) and also in the main universe when she actually managed to her damn job and catch a killer (probably my least-hated Ezri episode, though I still think she's laughable in bad-ass mode). I know not everyone like Jadzia, but I'll take her "warrior princess" shtick over Ezri's supposedly adorable confusion any day.
Ezri also sucked as a counselor. I KNEW that Garak was having claustrophia attacks because he was conflicted about helping the Federation, but Ezri didn't get until the end, and only then by accident. She didn't help Nog either. And her relationship with Bashir felt forced, rushed, unnatural, and did him no favors either as it looked like he was settling for Jadzia light. I also heard she becomes a Mary Sue in the books, so that doesn't do much to endear her to me either ...
To be entirely fair, I might have actually grown to like Ezri, if she had been on for more than a season. I mean, season 1 Bashir was no more than an arrogant prick, but he grew into one of my favorite characters. Terry Farrell leaving really put the writers in a difficult position, having to introduce and develop a whole new character with only one season left.
And all that being said, where the heck is Rush Limborg? I may not understand his Ezri love, but I do so enjoy how passionate he is in his opinions and eloquent in his arguments. Rush m'boy, get in here and defend your lady! Bring it on!
Ezri also sucked as a counselor. I KNEW that Garak was having claustrophia attacks because he was conflicted about helping the Federation, but Ezri didn't get until the end, and only then by accident. She didn't help Nog either. And her relationship with Bashir felt forced, rushed, unnatural, and did him no favors either as it looked like he was settling for Jadzia light. I also heard she becomes a Mary Sue in the books, so that doesn't do much to endear her to me either ...
To be entirely fair, I might have actually grown to like Ezri, if she had been on for more than a season. I mean, season 1 Bashir was no more than an arrogant prick, but he grew into one of my favorite characters. Terry Farrell leaving really put the writers in a difficult position, having to introduce and develop a whole new character with only one season left.
And all that being said, where the heck is Rush Limborg? I may not understand his Ezri love, but I do so enjoy how passionate he is in his opinions and eloquent in his arguments. Rush m'boy, get in here and defend your lady! Bring it on!
I wouldnt say she sucked at being a counselor. Its funny really, most people think this job is easy. Its not. To quote kira nerys "you dreamt what? Youre nuts!"
thats not the way it works. Garaks claustrphobia could have been caused by a dozen different things. Helping the feds was only one among many.
Now dont take this personally in any way ds9 gal, but most people dont have a bloody clue what psychology is all about. Frankly, im sick of it. Gotta write if off...
Its not as idiot proof as youd imagine. Now to be fair, its not my specialty, i freely admit that. But she simply has her own way of doing things. Now i doubt ill be having any luck using that technique in my line of psychology but im very fond of her counseling techniques. And i would use it if i could.
There is a saying, in order to make counseling work, you have to want to be counseled. And she has a way of making that happen.
(Forgive the spelling, im on my handheld atm.)
thats not the way it works. Garaks claustrphobia could have been caused by a dozen different things. Helping the feds was only one among many.
Now dont take this personally in any way ds9 gal, but most people dont have a bloody clue what psychology is all about. Frankly, im sick of it. Gotta write if off...
Its not as idiot proof as youd imagine. Now to be fair, its not my specialty, i freely admit that. But she simply has her own way of doing things. Now i doubt ill be having any luck using that technique in my line of psychology but im very fond of her counseling techniques. And i would use it if i could.
There is a saying, in order to make counseling work, you have to want to be counseled. And she has a way of making that happen.
(Forgive the spelling, im on my handheld atm.)
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Ezri seems to be one of those characters people either love or hate. I understand both opinions. Personally, I liked Jadzia more but I liked Ezri too. She's different. I mean, look at the other main characters:
Sisko - Big bad bold bald guy. Eats Klingons for breakfast.
Kira - Tough-as-nails former terrorist. Downright scary when she's angry, tougher than most of the other characters on the show.
Bashir - genetically enhanced intelligence with superhuman reflexes and intelligence. Nice guy, but not to be trifled with.
O'Brien - average all around good guy, tougher than an Algorian mammoth.
Worf - it's Worf. 'Nuff said.
Jadzia - Klingon Party Girl, sweet and flirtatious but also quite capable of going toe-to-toe with most Klingons.
Garak - conniving, hardened, cold, awesome...and many other adjectives.
Ezri can't take on six Klingons at once or calculate the probability of winning the Dominion War in her head. She's not as conniving as Garak, she's not as tough as Kira or Jadzia, and she certainly couldn't hold her own in a fight against the legendary Dahar Master Koloth. She's cute, pretty, and feminine. But don't, under any circumstances, mistake that for weakness. Comparatively speaking, yes, she's far 'weaker' in on sense than the rest of the characters, but another Klingon Party Girl with a chip on her shoulder who's best friend is her Bat'leth would be absolutely pointless. The show had enough 'tough' characters. However, she can be tough when she needs to be as others have mentioned. Ezri's different. She's sweet, gentle, naive, cute, and a little bit neurotic. If you don't like her, that's your choice. But I think she's awesome. Although I admit I see why some find her annoying, and truthfully I didn't like her at first. But she grew on me.
I think it would have been better if she had been introduced BEFORE Jadzia died. That way it would have been a more meaningful character arc for her to get past her neuroses and fear and the shock of having Dax's memories. The way it happened she just got introduced as annoying and quirky. Which is fine, but it would have been more meaningful if introduced earlier.
Sisko - Big bad bold bald guy. Eats Klingons for breakfast.
Kira - Tough-as-nails former terrorist. Downright scary when she's angry, tougher than most of the other characters on the show.
Bashir - genetically enhanced intelligence with superhuman reflexes and intelligence. Nice guy, but not to be trifled with.
O'Brien - average all around good guy, tougher than an Algorian mammoth.
Worf - it's Worf. 'Nuff said.
Jadzia - Klingon Party Girl, sweet and flirtatious but also quite capable of going toe-to-toe with most Klingons.
Garak - conniving, hardened, cold, awesome...and many other adjectives.
Ezri can't take on six Klingons at once or calculate the probability of winning the Dominion War in her head. She's not as conniving as Garak, she's not as tough as Kira or Jadzia, and she certainly couldn't hold her own in a fight against the legendary Dahar Master Koloth. She's cute, pretty, and feminine. But don't, under any circumstances, mistake that for weakness. Comparatively speaking, yes, she's far 'weaker' in on sense than the rest of the characters, but another Klingon Party Girl with a chip on her shoulder who's best friend is her Bat'leth would be absolutely pointless. The show had enough 'tough' characters. However, she can be tough when she needs to be as others have mentioned. Ezri's different. She's sweet, gentle, naive, cute, and a little bit neurotic. If you don't like her, that's your choice. But I think she's awesome. Although I admit I see why some find her annoying, and truthfully I didn't like her at first. But she grew on me.
I think it would have been better if she had been introduced BEFORE Jadzia died. That way it would have been a more meaningful character arc for her to get past her neuroses and fear and the shock of having Dax's memories. The way it happened she just got introduced as annoying and quirky. Which is fine, but it would have been more meaningful if introduced earlier.
I haven't seen the particular episode in a while where Ezri councils Rom, but I gotta agree with you 200% here, ares.
I have a couple of friends who are medical doctors, and they have told me stunning stories involving patients who come in for help, but do not tell them the "whole story" because they figure that there are some details that they will simply keep to themselves. Sometimes they are only coming in to humor a family member or friend. The outcomes were not good.
Getting better via medical or psychological help is a team effort and the patient needs to be a contributing member of that team. If a patient starts the process unwilling to open up and be honest, it is quite a challenge, even for the best of these professionals.
That's reason enough; it's just TV.
Paging Rush Limborg. Rush Limborg please.
Why do I love her? Because she's the polar opposite of Jadzia.
Instead of using and manipulating men, Ezri respects them. Her personality is sweet, innocent and caring - not arrogant, self-absorbed and ball-busting. She cares about the needs of others. She's warm, inviting and, dare I say it, feminine. She's also vulnerable; not all female characters have to be hard-charging, gung-ho, hoorah Amazons.
That and she's one of the most attractive women I've ever seen.
you hit the nail on the head.
MU Ezri was definitely an extension of all that was wrong with DS9's Mirror Universe. (Which wasn't so bad in the first episode, but the disastrous choices with the Intendant led the whole thing down a tawdry rabbit hole.)
As for Ezri herself...I guess I found that I could identify with her more than Jadzia (in fact, I despise Klingon Party Girl Jadzia). I know what it's like to be struggling to find my place, and I remember at one point watching "Afterimage," after she'd screwed up with Garak, and just crying right along with her.
Maybe that means I would be unlikeable to a lot of you, if you met me.
Oh well.
I like Ezri, because she seems the most "human" from all. That she does mistakes and her cute, somewhat clumsy seeming personality makes her sympatic.
Also I think, if we had seen her for more season and she had more time to sort out all the memories of the hosts before her, she would seem wiser as well.
And that she was not such a professiona counsellor..well she was only a counsellor in training, wasn´t she? And it does take time and experience to become a good counsellor. So I found it realistic, that she was not perfect in her job.
And NG, the episode with Garak...oh, that was one of the few time I felt really angry with Garak. That was so mean, honest, but mean.
TerokNor
Also I think, if we had seen her for more season and she had more time to sort out all the memories of the hosts before her, she would seem wiser as well.
And that she was not such a professiona counsellor..well she was only a counsellor in training, wasn´t she? And it does take time and experience to become a good counsellor. So I found it realistic, that she was not perfect in her job.
And NG, the episode with Garak...oh, that was one of the few time I felt really angry with Garak. That was so mean, honest, but mean.
TerokNor
How long has it been since we've had one of these threads? A couple of years? Same old points made.
Why do people like Ezri?
A character Arc, a much better premise for a character then Jadzia, as noted she was a character that many felt they could relate to, an element that shook up that show, a catalyst for other character to change, a chance to learn more about the Trill especially how others react with the change, a competent actress, interest in underdog characters and yes Nicole de Boer is attractive (and how many arguments has that spawned?)
And here's another clip of Nicole in kid in the hall:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=le6oGav2iTo&feature=related
Why do people like Ezri?
A character Arc, a much better premise for a character then Jadzia, as noted she was a character that many felt they could relate to, an element that shook up that show, a catalyst for other character to change, a chance to learn more about the Trill especially how others react with the change, a competent actress, interest in underdog characters and yes Nicole de Boer is attractive (and how many arguments has that spawned?)
And here's another clip of Nicole in kid in the hall:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=le6oGav2iTo&feature=related
I really wish Rush were here. He'd set us all straight on how awesome Ezri is. Even though I'd still disagree with him, it would be fun!
I have no idea where he is, but he's not on MSN either. We need you, mate!I really wish Rush were here. He'd set us all straight on how awesome Ezri is. Even though I'd still disagree with him, it would be fun!
^ this series just cracks me up. is this available on dvd somewhere or is it too old?
oh and while were on the subject. how can some not find her attractive? i sure as hell cant explain it:
http://i452.photobucket.com/albums/qq245/ares9304/dsc07650.jpg
http://i452.photobucket.com/albums/qq245/ares9304/nicole-and-paul.jpg
Saquist
Commodore
Good post.
Ezri should have retired from Star Fleet Immediately, she didn't have what it took to be on DS9. She needed to find herself before she got her self killed.
Thank Goodness Worf can snap necks in a blink of an eye...
MU Ezri was definitely an extension of all that was wrong with DS9's Mirror Universe. (Which wasn't so bad in the first episode, but the disastrous choices with the Intendant led the whole thing down a tawdry rabbit hole.)
As for Ezri herself...I guess I found that I could identify with her more than Jadzia (in fact, I despise Klingon Party Girl Jadzia). I know what it's like to be struggling to find my place, and I remember at one point watching "Afterimage," after she'd screwed up with Garak, and just crying right along with her.
Maybe that means I would be unlikeable to a lot of you, if you met me.
Oh well.
Probably. I don't care for character weakness in my hard military dramas.
Don't like crunchy in my creamy nor creamy in my crunchy either...
Sometimes I think that strength can be made over time, not always there from the beginning. Not every character has to be a Worf, Kira, or Starbuck.
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