The end scene of "Flesh and Stone"

[The]

He already is. The Rory of The Big Bang is, to use a crude term, badass. Unafraid to give the Doctor a wallop or go up against a Dalek, as well as making some very mature decisions, big and little. Sure, in some small ways Amy is still a bit more dominant in the relationship but over the season Rory has grown hugely and is now an equal partner rather than just someone dragged along on her adventures with the Doctor.

Couldn't agree more! I love Rory at the end. There was no hesitation and when Amy looked at him and asked, "Yeah, I'd say it's time for good-bye...wouldn't you?" He was totally on-board. The dude has been around for 2k years! And don't even get me started on kicking the Dalek's ass. I almost wish Rory was still an Auton. How cool would it be to have a "good" Auton on your side? Fun to explore, if nothing else.

Well, just imagine a man acting like Amy in that scene and a woman acting like the Doctor. You'd never get that shown on family television, because it would probably be thought of as attempted rape.

The understood, clear difference is that it is expected for a woman to not be able to physically fend off the advances. Thus, making it rape. Whereas, a male like The Doctor generally has the physical advantage and can shut the moment down by decision. Thus, you have comedy. It's really that simple.

 

[Rowan Sjet]

I think that's the superficial kneejerk reaction as well The. The big bad man forcing himself on the defenceless woman. But if you were to remove gender from the equation, that wouldn't be the case for this scene.

 

[The]

I think that's the superficial kneejerk reaction as well The. The big bad man forcing himself on the defenceless woman. But if you were to remove gender from the equation, that wouldn't be the case for this scene.

I'm not certain what makes it "superficial", other than it's the truth? "The big bad man forcing himself on the defenseless woman" is the exact perception of rape viewers would have of this scene if the genders were reversed. Could some women fend for themselves? Absolutely! But, a large majority could not due to very basic human genetic differences of natural size and strength.

It should be noted that even in the given scene, I'm still not certain Smith is a "strong" enough guy to overpower Gillan's tall frame...

 

[Rowan Sjet]

It's superficial in that viewers would only have those perceptions because of the genders, not because of how the characters are actually acting and reacting.

 

[The]

Sorry, my brain sidetracked and I originally misread your first post...

 

[DWF]

Harry, Adric, Turlough...

None of them are exactly tough guys.

I think as the Doctor has gotten younger he's needed someone to act as his muscle less and less.

That said Jack isn't exactly a wimp!

I can't agree you with about Harry, he was a Navel officer and supposedly a boxer as well. He was originally meant a Ian type companion had the Doctor been cast as older actor, so Harry was meant to the muscle if the Doctor hadn't been so young.

 

[Starkers]

Well, just imagine a man acting like Amy in that scene and a woman acting like the Doctor. You'd never get that shown on family television, because it would probably be thought of as attempted rape.

Nah every time they show a Connery Bond film you'd get something similar. Remember in the sixties it was acceptable to lie on top of a woman until she swooned and gave in!

It wouldn't quite be attempted rape, but it would certainly not be construed as amusing.

Of course Moffat's done it before but that was with two women so I let him off

 

[I am not Spock]

Rory waited with the Pandorica and guarded Amy for 2000 years...seriously that has to be the greatest romantic gesuture ever! Beat that Timelord!

Yes. When I saw this, I thought 'that has to be the most self sacrificing, romantic thing I've ever seen on TV. Waiting 2000 years for the woman you love'. The Doctor can't compete with THAT!

 

[DWF]

Rory waited with the Pandorica and guarded Amy for 2000 years...seriously that has to be the greatest romantic gesuture ever! Beat that Timelord!

Yes. When I saw this, I thought 'that has to be the most self sacrificing, romantic thing I've ever seen on TV. Waiting 2000 years for the woman you love'. The Doctor can't compete with THAT!

In my mind it's hard to compete with the Doctor leaving Susan on earth.

The Doctor: During all the years I've been taking care of you, you in return have been taking care of me. You are still my grandchild and always will be. But now, you're a woman too. I want you to belong somewhere, to have roots of your own. With David you will be able to find those roots and live normally like any woman should do. Believe me my dear, your future lies with David and not with a silly old buffer like me. One day, I shall come back. Yes, I shall come back. Until then, there must be no regrets, no tears, no anxieties. Just go forward in all your beliefs and prove to me that I am not mistaken in mine. Goodbye Susan. Goodbye my dear. [He dematerialises the Tardis, which vanishes, David and Susan, leave, Susan dropping her key onto the floor]

But then destroying his own home planet was a great act of self sacifice.

 

[captcalhoun]

yeah, but he didn't destroy gallifrey for the love of a woman.

 

[I am not Spock]

And here we are still waiting for the Doc to come back and say hi to Susan. Wonder if she'd recognise her grandfather, now he looks like Matt Smith?

 

[Sci]

And here we are still waiting for the Doc to come back and say hi to Susan.

I'm not. I think "The Doctor's Daughter" made it pretty clear that she's dead as a result of the Time War.

Spoiler: The End of Time

(And, frankly, I interpret the Woman in "The End of Time" as having been Susan.)

 

[Guartho]

Spoiler: The End of Time

(And, frankly, I interpret the Woman in "The End of Time" as having been Susan.)

That's what I thought too, though

Spoiler: The End of Time

she and the other dissenter being the Doctor's parents works for me too.

Is it also possible that Susan is still alive somewhere, but not a Time Lady, and so not counted against the doctor being the last of his race? She need only be 1/4 Time Lord after all. If you believe the 96 TV movie, she may only be 1/8th Time Lord!

 

[Bones2]

That woman didn't mean anything anyway. It was pointless with no explanation or payoff. And if they are the Doctor's parents, what does that even mean? We've never heard of them and they have no significance. Makes me all the happier that hack's finally gone.

 

[Captain Pike]

I gotta agree. The woman in white feels to me like some left over element of an excised, defunct sub plot. However, from what I've gathered, that wasn't the case?

 

[The Borgified Corpse]

Well, just imagine a man acting like Amy in that scene and a woman acting like the Doctor. You'd never get that shown on family television, because it would probably be thought of as attempted rape.

Nah every time they show a Connery Bond film you'd get something similar. Remember in the sixties it was acceptable to lie on top of a woman until she swooned and gave in!

It wouldn't quite be attempted rape, but it would certainly not be construed as amusing.

Of course Moffat's done it before but that was with two women so I let him off

When was this and where can I find the video?!?

 

[Starkers]

Well, just imagine a man acting like Amy in that scene and a woman acting like the Doctor. You'd never get that shown on family television, because it would probably be thought of as attempted rape.

Nah every time they show a Connery Bond film you'd get something similar. Remember in the sixties it was acceptable to lie on top of a woman until she swooned and gave in!

It wouldn't quite be attempted rape, but it would certainly not be construed as amusing.

Of course Moffat's done it before but that was with two women so I let him off

When was this and where can I find the video?!?

First episode of season 4 of Coupling

"Oh Jeffrey, did you ever pick the wrong week to leave the country."