O'Brien out, Leno back in?

[Sci]

I'm amazed at the amount of spinning and backpedaling you're doing to try and make Leno look like the innocent just because you like him best.

You'd do the same for Conan, so what's the big deal?

No, I don't think they would. If the situation were reversed -- if Conan had promised Leno The Tonight Show and then joined with NBC to take it back from him, thereby going back on his word -- I'd be condemning Conan just as much as I've been condemning Leno.

This isn't about who I like better as a comedian. I'm a Craig Ferguson sort of fellow anyway. This is about the simple fact that Leno and NBC screwed Conan over and displayed a distinct lack of personal honor and respectability by doing so.

 

[Amaris]

I'm just putting forth my view that Conan's supporters are simply disappointed that he doesn't have Tonight anymore. I suggest that they don't care *why* he doesn't have it, or how he came to lose it. They want him to have the show, and will accept no substitutes. They're jealous of Leno because he got the show back, and thus have conspired to paint Leno as the villain - where, IMHO, he doesn't deserve that.

Sure he does. Leno accepted the Tonight Show while Conan was hosting it, and had only hosted it for 7 months up to that point.

Did I just jump the gun? Probably. But now all of you know how I feel when you paint Leno as some kind of Antichrist or something. Perhaps NBC was too quick to give Leno the show back. But it's strictly business. Things like that happen. I'd wager this isn't the first time that shows have been won and lost for flimsy reasons. It's happened before, and will happen again. Doesn't make it right, but it's just how it works.

You're right, because Jay did it to Letterman, too. So yeah, it's happened before.

I doubt Ferguson would even want to host The Tonight Show anyway. It doesn't seem his style.

Yeah, Ferguson would definitely pass on The Tonight Show.

I seem to remember Ferguson stating he doesn't even have a desire to take over for Letterman.

Yeah, I wish I could remember where, but he did say he had no interest in any other spot.

I'm amazed at the amount of spinning and backpedaling you're doing to try and make Leno look like the innocent just because you like him best.

You'd do the same for Conan, so what's the big deal?

If Conan lacked such ethics, no I know I wouldn't defend him at all. I liked Jay Leno. I no longer like Jay Leno. It has to do with his actions, not Conan's.

 

[Skywalker]

I doubt Ferguson would even want to host The Tonight Show anyway. It doesn't seem his style.

Yeah, Ferguson would definitely pass on The Tonight Show.

I seem to remember Ferguson stating he doesn't even have a desire to take over for Letterman.

Which works for me. I can't really see Ferguson being able to do his thing in the earlier timeslot. 12:30 is perfect for him.

I do wonder who will take over for Letterman once he retires, though...

 

[JacksonArcher]

Maybe CBS will just retire his show as well? Who knows. However, I think Jon Stewart (when his contract expires at The Daily Show) might be a strong candidate.

 

[knine]

^I really don't want to see Jon Stewart leave what he's currently doing right now. He and Colbert are great.

 

[CoveTom]

AND, Leno, also a member of the WGA, may or may not have crossed the strike lines to write his own monologue--it's very murky--so, again, not quite the Everyman he portrays himself to be.

I dunno. Anything that goes against the WGA makes him more respectable in my eyes.

 

[Timby]

I doubt Ferguson would even want to host The Tonight Show anyway. It doesn't seem his style.

Yeah, Ferguson would definitely pass on The Tonight Show.

I seem to remember Ferguson stating he doesn't even have a desire to take over for Letterman.

Correct. Ferguson has said on many, many occasions that he's personally very grateful to Letterman for allowing him the opportunity to host The Late Late Show, and as soon as Letterman decides that it's time to retire, Ferguson will follow suit. He doesn't see himself as a "lifer" in late-night television, unlike Conan, Letterman or Leno.

I would imagine that Jon Stewart had been promised the Late Show gig, though that's probably up in the air ever since the CBS Corporation / Viacom split. I still think Late Show is a much more likely landing spot for Conan, rather than FOX.

 

[CoveTom]

I still think Late Show is a much more likely landing spot for Conan, rather than FOX.

I don't know. The last I heard was that Letterman had either signed or was close to signing a contract extension to stay at CBS through 2012. I don't get the feeling that Letterman is ready to hang it up just quite yet. And I can't see Conan sitting on the sidelines until 2012. And as good as Conan is, I don't see CBS pushing Letterman out to sign the guy that Letterman had been regularly beating in the ratings. Conan could sign a deal now, of course, to take over in 2012, but for some reason I am doubting he wants to go for that sort of deal, given how well it's worked for him in the past.

 

[Timby]

Letterman signed that extension in June of last year, I believe, but that was also before he got dogged with his latest sex scandal and the extortion thing. That, combined with his health problems and his more and more frequent hints on the show that he's going to be retiring soon (he seems to make at least one or two references a week, now), makes me wonder if he might be getting ready to abdicate his throne.

 

[cardinal biggles]

I'm amazed at the amount of spinning and backpedaling you're doing to try and make Leno look like the innocent just because you like him best.

You'd do the same for Conan, so what's the big deal?

No, I wouldn't. If the situation were reversed and Conan had pulled this on Jay, I would have the same feelings of dislike. This isn't about who's funny and who isn't, it's about Leno being a self-serving douchebag not once, not twice, but now three times. Before, while I don't think Jay Leno is funny at all, I at least thought he was a decent guy... I figured he would have learned something from the mess that was made when Johnny Carson retired. Instead, I've lost what respect I still had for the man.

 

[bigdaddy]

I doubt Ferguson would even want to host The Tonight Show anyway. It doesn't seem his style.

Yeah, Ferguson would definitely pass on The Tonight Show.

I seem to remember Ferguson stating he doesn't even have a desire to take over for Letterman.

Craig used to talk about how he didn't even want to do his show after his 6 year contract is up, but that might have changed.

 

[Checkmate]

He says something to that effect practically every episode. Hell, he said he'd leave his own show for $1.50 after learning Conan was getting ~$30,000,000. Course, he also says he's a liar, too, in regards to his puppets.

It's hard to know when he's being serious about anything.

 

[JacksonArcher]

I would love for Conan to take over Letterman's show.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

it's about Leno being a self-serving douchebag not once, not twice, but now three times. Before, while I don't think Jay Leno is funny at all, I at least thought he was a decent guy... I figured he would have learned something from the mess that was made when Johnny Carson retired. Instead, I've lost what respect I still had for the man.

If this was all Jay's idea in the first place, then I might agree. But I place the blame on NBC, not him. They gave him the show back. He didn't ask first.

I realize he could have turned them down, but I don't think anyone would do that. Any comedian would jump at the chance to host The Tonight Show, and I don't think they'd care how they got it.

 

[Sci]

it's about Leno being a self-serving douchebag not once, not twice, but now three times. Before, while I don't think Jay Leno is funny at all, I at least thought he was a decent guy... I figured he would have learned something from the mess that was made when Johnny Carson retired. Instead, I've lost what respect I still had for the man.

If this was all Jay's idea in the first place, then I might agree. But I place the blame on NBC, not him. They gave him the show back. He didn't ask first.

Which doesn't change the fact that he had a moral obligation to turn it down once offered. He'd promised it to another guy.

I realize he could have turned them down, but I don't think anyone would do that. Any comedian would jump at the chance to host The Tonight Show, and I don't think they'd care how they got it.

Which makes a person who does that while screwing over someone else and betraying a promise a bad, immoral person.

You do remember being taught that good people are supposed to keep their promises and not hurt other people as a child, don't you? These are fairly basic moral lessons.

 

[Squiggy]

it's about Leno being a self-serving douchebag not once, not twice, but now three times. Before, while I don't think Jay Leno is funny at all, I at least thought he was a decent guy... I figured he would have learned something from the mess that was made when Johnny Carson retired. Instead, I've lost what respect I still had for the man.

If this was all Jay's idea in the first place, then I might agree. But I place the blame on NBC, not him. They gave him the show back. He didn't ask first.

I realize he could have turned them down, but I don't think anyone would do that. Any comedian would jump at the chance to host The Tonight Show, and I don't think they'd care how they got it.

Except that Jay Leno isn't a comedian.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

^ Yes, he is. Doesn't he still do standup? I know he used to.

 

[Sci]

^ Yes, he is. Doesn't he still do standup? I know he used to.

See, when Squiggy said that Jay Leno isn't a comedian, that was what those of us who enjoy comedy like to call a "joke." Obviously he is a professional comedian, but the humor comes from the implication on Squiggy's part that Leno has become so un-funny that it is as though he has ceased to be a comedian.

And, really, the very fact that you didn't recognize a joke when you read on is strong evidence that the quality of Leno's humor leaves something to be desired.

Though, that, again, is besides the point. Even if Leno were the funniest guy on the planet, he'd still be a douchebag for agreeing to take back The Tonight Show.

 

[Amaris]

If this was all Jay's idea in the first place, then I might agree. But I place the blame on NBC, not him. They gave him the show back. He didn't ask first.

He accepted it immediately, and I have no doubt whatsoever he wanted the show back.
He was reluctant to give it up after 17 years, and jumped at the chance when offered, knowing that Conan had nly had the show 7 months, and had to to be ousted for Jay to get it. Those are the actions of an unethical, self seeking man.

I realize he could have turned them down, but I don't think anyone would do that. Any comedian would jump at the chance to host The Tonight Show, and I don't think they'd care how they got it.

Yeah, any comedian would jump at the chance to host the Tonight Show, you know, like Jay Leno, someone who had already hosted it for 17 years. You know, comedians like Conan O'Brien who had earned that seat and were getting forced out so that someone who had already had the seat could get it back.

Face it, NBC and Jay were completely in the wrong, and what they did was unethical.

 

[Professor Zoom]

Conan is doing the right thing by his crew.

According to sources close to production, Conan's stagehands from "The Tonight Show" were not covered by the NBC severance plan. But we're told Conan is stepping up -- promising to pay his nearly 50 person crew at least six weeks severance out of his own pocket.

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Wow. Good man.
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