How much will Spock Prime tell Starfleet?

[BillJ]

Spock has faith that the universe will unfold as it should. In other words, he's not going to fuck things up.

I'm sure all those people killed by the likes of The Doomsday Machine, V'Ger and the Whale Probe will be plenty grateful.

 

[Ronson2k10]

Everyone dies it's just a question of when.

Spock at the end of the movie says. "There are so few of us left we cannot afford to avoid each other". He also says he has found a suitable place to establish a Vulcan colony. So in one instance he will be "In touch" but most likely from a Vulcan standpoint a strange Obi-Wan Kenobi character. Giving metaphorical advice as he's always done but this time to himself. It was pretty easy for Kirk to accept the elder Spock as being from the future and telling his story confirms that it's him.. To the younger Spock you would think he would be quite troubled by it. Even from a Scientific stand point. How can I be in two universes at the same time and talk to myself.. Pretty fricken weird man...

In "The Alternative Factor" The same person from two different universes couldn't exist in the same universe.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Alternative_Factor

So in this instance they went against cannon and made it possible for same person from two universes to exist in the same universe. Where Spock himself takes on the role of Lazzarus. Matter and Antimatter if they come in contact with each other.. bad things happen. So you better never meld with yourself?

Flirting with time again could get a little hard on the head. So I hope they avoid that in the future.

 

[Photoman15]

The two universes the Lazarii were from, one was matter, one was anti-matter. IF the nuTrek is a parallel universe, they are both matter universes.

 

[EJA]

Bad news: Greg Cox's novel The Hazards of Concealing, which was to have dealt with this very issue, has been cancelled by Pocket at the behest of JJ Abrams and co. "Urge to kill, RISING!!"

 

[Photoman15]

Well, that may mean that the next movie will be covering the same subject as one of the books, perhaps the Hazard one.

 

[M'Sharak]

Bad news: Greg Cox's novel The Hazards of Concealing, which was to have dealt with this very issue, has been cancelled by Pocket at the behest of JJ Abrams and co. "Urge to kill, RISING!!"

Not so. All that is known is that the four novels are on hold indefinitely. Orci has said that he had no involvement in the decision, and I have no reason to doubt his word, nor is there any reason to think that Abrams or any of the other filmmakers were involved, either. This is most likely a call made at Paramount and Simon & Schuster/Pocket Books by marketing types whose names you will never know.

EJA, after seeing comments like the above (and worse) from you on this subject in more than one thread, I strongly suggest that you take your "urge to kill, rising" and soak it thoroughly in cold water until it dissolves. That sort of language is neither necessary nor is it particularly wanted here.

 

[BillJ]

Bad news: Greg Cox's novel The Hazards of Concealing, which was to have dealt with this very issue, has been cancelled by Pocket at the behest of JJ Abrams and co. "Urge to kill, RISING!!"

Not so. All that is known is that the four novels are on hold indefinitely. Orci has said that he had no involvement in the decision, and I have no reason to doubt his word, nor is there any reason to think that Abrams or any of the other filmmakers were involved, either. This is most likely a call made at Paramount and Simon & Schuster/Pocket Books by marketing types whose names you will never know.

EJA, after seeing comments like the above (and worse) from you on this subject in more than one thread, I strongly suggest that you take your "urge to kill, rising" and soak it thoroughly in cold water until it dissolves. That sort of language is neither necessary nor is it particularly wanted here.

"Urge to Kill... Rising!", is from an episode of The Simpsons. One of the early Halloween specials, I believe. Have to say that I actually agree with the sentiment though. And from what I'm seeing on the TrekLit board the decision to cancel came directly from Bad Robot.

 

[M'Sharak]

"Urge to Kill... Rising!", is from an episode of The Simpsons. One of the early Halloween specials, I believe.

Okay. How about "I hope Abrams has a car crash"? Is that also from a Simpsons episode?

And could you find a link to the source for that information about Bad Robot and post it in the thread about the novels being postponed? Appreciate it.

 

[BillJ]

"Urge to Kill... Rising!", is from an episode of The Simpsons. One of the early Halloween specials, I believe.

Okay. How about "I hope Abrams has a car crash"? Is that also from a Simpsons episode?

And could you find a link to the source for that information about Bad Robot and post it in the thread about the novels being postponed? Appreciate it.

You got me! I can't defend the car crash quote.

I have this from Allyn Gibson:

In my opinion, PB's decision doesn't make sense from a business point of view.

No, it doesn't.

I wrote on TrekMovie.com's comment thread that this is clearly an instance of Pocket taking the fall for someone else's decision. It may be someone at CBS Licensing. It may be someone at Bad Robot. This isn't a decision Pocket would have made. They're already out six figures on this quartet of books in time expended and monies paid to writers and copy-editors, and canceling the books won't recoup their investment.

My guess is that the people at Bad Robot changed their minds. Six months ago, they were willing to have books based on the film. Today, not so much, and they had someone at CBS pull the plug. Maybe they saw the first manuscripts and didn't like them. Maybe they didn't like Pocket's marketing plan. I don't know.

But there's no doubt in my mind that Pocket wouldn't have made this decision. There's too much money already spent, and there's a loss to the line in terms of revenue and prestige that may never be able to be recouped entirely from this cancellation.

 

[Therin of Andor]

has been cancelled by Pocket

Postponed does not = Cancelled.

 

[M'Sharak]

And could you find a link to the source for that information about Bad Robot and post it in the thread about the novels being postponed? Appreciate it.

I have this from Allyn Gibson:

In my opinion, PB's decision doesn't make sense from a business point of view.

No, it doesn't.

I wrote on TrekMovie.com's comment thread that this is clearly an instance of Pocket taking the fall for someone else's decision. It may be someone at CBS Licensing. It may be someone at Bad Robot. This isn't a decision Pocket would have made. They're already out six figures on this quartet of books in time expended and monies paid to writers and copy-editors, and canceling the books won't recoup their investment.

My guess is that the people at Bad Robot changed their minds. Six months ago, they were willing to have books based on the film. Today, not so much, and they had someone at CBS pull the plug. Maybe they saw the first manuscripts and didn't like them. Maybe they didn't like Pocket's marketing plan. I don't know.

But there's no doubt in my mind that Pocket wouldn't have made this decision. There's too much money already spent, and there's a loss to the line in terms of revenue and prestige that may never be able to be recouped entirely from this cancellation.

Well, Allyn would certainly have more insight into the way the publishing biz works than most of us, and into the world of Trek books in particular, but that still looks to me like conjecture. [Edit: Indeed, Allyn says so himself in a later post.] There are some facts present, and what look like a couple of reasonable assumptions, but it still adds up at this moment to no more than an educated guess -- some important pieces are missing. With luck, we'll find out at some point what those pieces were and then maybe this will make a lot more sense than what we have to look at today.

 

[Photoman15]

Maybe one of the ideas for the next movie involves telling one of the stories that one of these books is about. To not give it away, they had to hold all of them.

 

[I am not Spock]

Since Spock Prime melded with NuKirk, does that mean NuKirk has knowledge of the V'Ger and whale probes, Khan, the Borg, the Dominion, etc.

 

[I am not Spock]

The two universes the Lazarii were from, one was matter, one was anti-matter. IF the nuTrek is a parallel universe, they are both matter universes.

Exactly. We've seen two versions of a character from different universes interact plenty of times in Trek (Kira Nerys for one). Then there was every single version of the Enterprise D crammed into the one universe in 'Parallels'.

The Mirror Universe and the NuTrek universe are matter universes. The one Lazarus came from was an antimatter universe.

 

[cwnorma]

Since Spock Prime melded with NuKirk, does that mean NuKirk has knowledge of the V'Ger and whale probes, Khan, the Borg, the Dominion, etc.

And if nuSpock melds with nuKirk will he be melding with him self?

 

[SalvorHardin]

Since Spock Prime melded with NuKirk, does that mean NuKirk has knowledge of the V'Ger and whale probes, Khan, the Borg, the Dominion, etc.

No.
Spock shared only the events relevant to Spock, Nero and the events that lead to the destruction of Romulus & Vulcan.
Plus his emotions.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Since Spock Prime melded with NuKirk, does that mean NuKirk has knowledge of the V'Ger and whale probes, Khan, the Borg, the Dominion, etc.

No.
Spock shared only the events relevant to Spock, Nero and the events that lead to the destruction of Romulus & Vulcan.
Plus his emotions.

Of course if he did share all of his life, Kirk probably knows things that Spock would prefer he didn't.

KIRK: "Wow, you wet the bed till you were six?"

 

[SheliakBob]

Interesting.
If it was a case of traditional time travel in the prime timeline--ie: if continuity meant crap to the creators of The Abomination--I would expect that Spock would keep as much of his information as possible to himself, for fear of contaminating the timeline.
But! This timeline is already irretrievably contaminated. It's been dubbed "alternate" so I'm not sure that any of the usual arguments against temporal tampering have any relevance.
If it were my call, I'd say that Starfleet totally and thoroughly debriefed Prime Spock and virtually all the TOS menaces and monsters were promptly dealt with. The Federation has an enormous upper hand in dealing with the Klingons and the Romulans, and the Gorn and a whole lot of other troublesome aliens--so none of the traditional threats have much sting to them anymore.
I'd avoid ANY rehashing of the original TOS episodes--dismissing them all with a quick, "Oh, thanks to Spock, we took care of that."
Then I'd have the writers come up with entirely new threat races, new situations, new worlds all that goes with a reboot and only sparingly draw upon familiar elements for flavor.
So. yah.
Spock should spill the beans.

 

[Allyn Gibson]

Well, Allyn would certainly have more insight into the way the publishing biz works than most of us, and into the world of Trek books in particular, but that still looks to me like conjecture. [Edit: Indeed, Allyn says so himself in a later post.] There are some facts present, and what look like a couple of reasonable assumptions, but it still adds up at this moment to no more than an educated guess -- some important pieces are missing.

I want to confirm that, yes, everything that BillJ quoted was my conjecture as to the book postponements. An educated conjecture based on my knowledge of the people involved, long experience with Pocket and publishing, etc., but still a conjecture nonetheless.

Even the four authors involved don't know the reasons for their books' postponements.

To come back on topic, I tend to think that Spock-Prime would tell Starfleet pretty much everything. (I may have said that upthread, or it may have been in a similar thread elsewhere/when.) It's the logical thing to do. Vulcans are now an endangered species, and protecting the remnant of Vulcan would be of paramount importance. (Pun unintended.) Eliminating certain threats, like the Doomsday Machine, would be wise.

 

[EJA]

This is why I feel it would have been better if Spock Prime had been killed off in XI, then we wouldn't have this problem of him knowing about all the things out there that are coming the Federation's way and getting rid of the mystery of what the future holds.