In Turn Left Ten was killed before he could regenerate, and stayed dead. Ten mentions the possibility of this happening to him in The End of Time, Part 1. But what about Seven regenerating into Eight in the '96 TV movie AFTER he died on the operating table? This is something the writers appear to have a) forgot, or b) just said "f***k it" and ignored it.
The Doctor dying before he can regenerate
- Thread starter EJA
- Start date
I think the TVM is hardly the best thing in the world to point at for canonical precedent.
Seven may have not really been dead, at least by timelord standards. Heck, even with humans there are been some rare case of people thought to be dead ( even having autopsies started on them) that really were not. With Timelords there is that mysterious regeneration energy that just may have been suppressed for a while in sevens case.
Perhaps "dead" means a bit something...else...more...to a Timelord...?
Maybe the 7th Doctor was still "alive" in some way the human Doctors couldn't measure?
(I remember when Martha talked of killing the Master, she made it sound *damn hard* - though that was, in part, a ruse...)
And anyway, remember that in the TVM, the 8th Doctor said that "it took too ling this time" - and something about how the anesthesia "almost destroyed the regenerative process"...
Maybe the 7th Doctor was still "alive" in some way the human Doctors couldn't measure?
(I remember when Martha talked of killing the Master, she made it sound *damn hard* - though that was, in part, a ruse...)
And anyway, remember that in the TVM, the 8th Doctor said that "it took too ling this time" - and something about how the anesthesia "almost destroyed the regenerative process"...
Obviously Seven didn't die before regeneration processes could begin. Those processes simply couldn't be detected as "life" at the hospital.
Yeah, I know that these characters usually regenerate in seconds or minutes, often with flashy lighting effects. Well, that's kind of too bad.
Yeah, I know that these characters usually regenerate in seconds or minutes, often with flashy lighting effects. Well, that's kind of too bad.
It's not as if there had been any kind of consistency in the way regenerations were portrayed in the past. It's always different, they always change the rules, they always contradict themselves. If you want prim and proper continuity, watch Star Trek.
Well, alright. Let's just say that there is such a thing as a Star Trek continuity, and that writers usually try to follow it, while I would say that there is no such thing as a firm, official continuity in Doctor Who.
In Star Trek, if a new story contradicts an old story, most of the time the writers try to find a rationale to explain the discrepancy. In Doctor Who, if a new story contradicts an old story, well, it just does. All in all, I think that's a much better approach.
You're probably right on both counts, and I think that Steven Moffatt would agree with you. I think that there's a video of him on Youtube, where at a convention he expresses an opinion that a show that depicts time travel, changing the past and alternate universes can't actually have a "canonical" timeline.Well, alright. Let's just say that there is such a thing as a Star Trek continuity, and that writers usually try to follow it, while I would say that there is no such thing as a firm, official continuity in Doctor Who.
In Star Trek, if a new story contradicts an old story, most of the time the writers try to find a rationale to explain the discrepancy. In Doctor Who, if a new story contradicts an old story, well, it just does. All in all, I think that's a much better approach.
Sorry, but I just can't agree with this. I like consistency, and whenever people disregard what's gone before it smacks of laziness to me.
It appears to be option b), given the emphasis placed on the danger of having a Time Lord mind in a human body as indicated at the end of the last season. Anyway, the TV movie itself indicated that he can change species when regenerating, so maybe the human maternal DNA thing wasn't something that he actually inherited from a human mother. Alternatively, though, having a human mother would actually fit in with the possibility - put forward in the Sylvester McCoy story Battlefield - of him being Merlin, given that some Arthurian fiction has it that Merlin's father was a mystical being or demon and his mother was human.
You're probably right on both counts, and I think that Steven Moffatt would agree with you. I think that there's a video of him on Youtube, where at a convention he expresses an opinion that a show that depicts time travel, changing the past and alternate universes can't actually have a "canonical" timeline.Well, alright. Let's just say that there is such a thing as a Star Trek continuity, and that writers usually try to follow it, while I would say that there is no such thing as a firm, official continuity in Doctor Who.That's a ripe statement right there!
In Star Trek, if a new story contradicts an old story, most of the time the writers try to find a rationale to explain the discrepancy. In Doctor Who, if a new story contradicts an old story, well, it just does. All in all, I think that's a much better approach.
The Doctors personal timeline (also the Masters and Timelords) is pretty canon and does not change since the story follows the Doctor ( and timelords in the casual nexus) and not us on Earth. Earth's timeline (the the rest of the universe) changes show by show, the Doctors does not. So, in that POV, TPTB are respective to canon. This is why it's very hard for the Doctor to just go back to the 60's or 70's and meet up with the 1st, 2nd or 3rd Doctor, because those adventure in his current timeline has not happened, he has to cross timelines to get to them.
Family of Blood -- the Doctor rewrites his DNA to make himself human.
Fair enough, but I'm pretty sure that what I've described is the way the show has always been written. Continuity is a tool, it's not a law.
What you're saying here makes sense, but in my opinion it's the kind of carefully crafted metafictional rationale that never enters the minds of the people who actually make the show. They're making it all up as they go along, if continuity helps, they use it, and if continuity gets in the way, they forget about it.
