DS9 relaunch - incomplete?

[Arix]

From Avatar to The Soul Key is... what? A year? Very cluttered time frame.

The series should jump forward. It'll avoid the impression that these characters lives are nothing but one crisis after another after another after another after another.

That said, I'm not thrilled with the idea of DS9's pace being dictated by the pace of other series. If they keep making one DS9 for every five or six TNG/Titan books, DS9 will fall behind again, and have to jump forward again, leaving more storylines dangling.

I don't think it was anymore 'cluttered' than a season of the TV series.

As for 'one crisis after another' - its more like, one adventure/event after another, but thats exactly what Star Trek tends to be :P And imo, thats still not a very good reason to jump ahead - they could always write stories that didn't have huge galaxy-changing events or 'crisises'... It might not seem as drastic if they were just skipping ahead a year or two, but a lot can happen in 5 years!

And regarding your last point.. this can only lead me to conclude that we need MORE DS9!

In all seriousness, maybe it seems different looking back (as I wasn't buying Trek books when the first DS9 relaunch books started coming out, I have only been doing so for a few years now) - but it still seems to me that the majority of the relaunch weren't just one-off books... In fact... Avatar had two books, Mission Gamma was four, Worlds of DS9 was three, there was Rising Son and Unity in between - what we seem to be lacking atm is another duology or trilogy - Warpath, Fearful Symmetry and The Soul Key weren't a true trilogy... So I think the least the DS9 relaunch deserves before moving 5 years into the future is one last trilogy!

 

[Therin of Andor]

it still seems to me that the majority of the relaunch weren't just one-off books... In fact... Avatar had two books, Mission Gamma was four, Worlds of DS9 was three

WoDS9 might have been three volumes, but it was six chunky stories.

Fearful Symmetry

Which was, of course, two parallel stories, in a flip book. A duology of its own.

 

[BrotherBenny]

Star Trek: Deep Space Nine: Between the Crises (2376-81), volumes 1-3.

Volume 1 - The Ascendants

Volume 2 - Nothing Happens

Volume 3 - The Borg Kill Billions

How's that?

 

[langdonboom]

I agree this needs to be addressed sooner rather than later, if for no other reason than to not make the post-Destiny DS9 books that are upcoming have to have the characters be overly cagey and/or dense about their own recent past.

One of the things that makes pocket's books great is their consistency and ability to have the characters reflect upon situations that have come before and actually be affected by them -- just when the reader is wondering about something that reminds them of a similar experience -- for instance Riker's reflecting on his horribly stint in captivity on Tezwa when he has to leave his away team behind with the Caeliar, etc. etc, -- this kind of seemless 'world' really makes the books and the characters exponentially more rewarding for a reader such as myself who enjoys every iteration of ST in book form, and to tie DS9's hands in this way by jumping over 5 years is a great disservice to the great work that has gone into writing and leading up to the Ascendants/Iliana/Dominion storylines of the past several years.

Specifically, I need to know:

[spoilers for anyone who hasn't read up to The Soul Key]

-what was the giant changeling planet
-where/what is the Dominion now that so many have left and only Odo is basically in charge?
-What is the ultimate fate of Taran'atar's mission to understand humanity?
-what's going on with the Even Odds in the gamma quadrant after the teaser we had of them?
and of course
-how do the Ascendants deal with the Evoq and how do the Bajorans deal with them both going forward?
-What is the fate of the new baby sisko and how does Benjamin Sisko factor into this coming Ascendants reawakening?
-Ezri Dax's final decision to leave DS9 and be in a position to captain the Aventine
and of course
-how DS9 was affected by the Borg invasion - I'd hate to think they had no response, especially with Sisko's prior experiences...

AT LEAST two novels are called for if this story is to be done justice, and really, I have to wonder (maybe Mr. Bennett has some insight into this): haven't the intelligent folks at Pocket (despite the recent layoffs) planned at least some of the Ascendants storyline out past this point, giving how long ago and how patiently its been set up over the course of several books?

And if not, I can't imagine they'd just let all of those juicy questions go unanswered and then give us the crew of DS9 totally unchanged by whatever might have occurred between then and 2381...

 

[Christopher]

AT LEAST two novels are called for if this story is to be done justice, and really, I have to wonder (maybe Mr. Bennett has some insight into this): haven't the intelligent folks at Pocket (despite the recent layoffs) planned at least some of the Ascendants storyline out past this point, giving how long ago and how patiently its been set up over the course of several books?

I have no specific insights into the DS9 post-finale novels, since I've never been invited to participate in that series. I do know, however, that any plans for the Ascendant storyline were Marco Palmieri's plans, and now that he's not working for Pocket anymore, those plans are no longer relevant. When a new editor takes over, they're in charge and get to make their own decisions rather than being bound by a predecessor's. And that's if they even knew what their predecessor's plans were. The various editors at Pocket have their own responsibilities, their own projects (since Trek is just one of the properties these editors handle). They're busy enough without having to keep track of the long-range plans for each other's series.

Also, the plans were probably fairly loose; in my experience, an editor doesn't plot out a storyline in detail, but just has some general ideas of the direction he or she wants a series to go and commissions the writers to come up with the specifics. And the things the writers come up with affect and modify the plans for the future, suggesting new directions or possibilities.

 

[BrotherBenny]

The Mirror Universe actually took up more books than they initially expected, IIRC, so the Ascendants arc had to be pushed back. Then Marco was laid off and Margaret took over, and sometime during dealing with the Destiny trilogy and Typhon Pact miniseries she decided to bring DS9 in line with the other 24th century lines, but with Margaret gone, any plans she had after that one 2381 DS9 book are out of the window unless she contracted an author to write one before she was also laid off. It is entirely possible that her replacement(s) will continue the pre-81 DS9 stories based on easter eggs in The Rough Beasts of Empire which will likely give us clues as to what happened in the intervening 4-5 years.

 

[William Leisner]

Then Marco was laid off and Margaret took over, and sometime during dealing with the Destiny trilogy and Typhon Pact miniseries she decided to bring DS9 in line with the other 24th century lines

Your timeline is off. Marco was still in place through the entire creation of the Destiny trilogy, and was the only editor on A Singular Destiny, which introduced the Typhon Pact. None of us have any idea how much of DRG3's upcoming DS9 book is/will be based on Marco's initial plans, Margaret's revision of those plans, the new Trek editor's re-revision of those plans, or David's execution of those plans.

 

[Christopher]

^Right. Destiny was jointly edited by Marco and Margaret, since it was a crossover between series they both edited, and because it was so massive a project.

 

[BrotherBenny]

Then Marco was laid off and Margaret took over, and sometime during dealing with the Destiny trilogy and Typhon Pact miniseries she decided to bring DS9 in line with the other 24th century lines

Your timeline is off. Marco was still in place through the entire creation of the Destiny trilogy, and was the only editor on A Singular Destiny, which introduced the Typhon Pact. None of us have any idea how much of DRG3's upcoming DS9 book is/will be based on Marco's initial plans, Margaret's revision of those plans, the new Trek editor's re-revision of those plans, or David's execution of those plans.

^Right. Destiny was jointly edited by Marco and Margaret, since it was a crossover between series they both edited, and because it was so massive a project.

I stand corrected, but the point is still valid.

 

[langdonboom]

I have no specific insights into the DS9 post-finale novels, since I've never been invited to participate in that series. I do know, however, that any plans for the Ascendant storyline were Marco Palmieri's plans, and now that he's not working for Pocket anymore, those plans are no longer relevant. ...

Also, the plans were probably fairly loose; in my experience, an editor doesn't plot out a storyline in detail, but just has some general ideas of the direction he or she wants a series to go and commissions the writers to come up with the specifics. And the things the writers come up with affect and modify the plans for the future, suggesting new directions or possibilities.

Thanks for this! Though its disappointing sometimes to see how the sausage is made, its helpful to know what to expect or not expect in terms of consistency. As a fan of all iterations of 24th century trek I am just incredibly grateful for the level of consistency the various authors, editors, and novels have maintained over the past number of years across the various "relaunches", and if one or two blind alleys have to be there, then so be it -- I've had so many great hours of enjoyment from the great big continuity world of ST that I can hardly get too upset at one or two hiccups having to occur.

Having said that though - there is still so much rich storytelling potential in Mr. Palmieri's unresolved storylines that I'd think any editor would be foolish not to attempt to exploit at least some of it, however much they make it their own.

Thanks again, Mr. Bennett!

 

[JD]

Then Marco was laid off and Margaret took over, and sometime during dealing with the Destiny trilogy and Typhon Pact miniseries she decided to bring DS9 in line with the other 24th century lines

Your timeline is off. Marco was still in place through the entire creation of the Destiny trilogy, and was the only editor on A Singular Destiny, which introduced the Typhon Pact. None of us have any idea how much of DRG3's upcoming DS9 book is/will be based on Marco's initial plans, Margaret's revision of those plans, the new Trek editor's re-revision of those plans, or David's execution of those plans.

I think it's also worth pointing out the DRG3 has already written 2 DS9R stories, including Olympus Descending, which dealt with the Ascendants some. So he is definitely familiar with the DS9R's arcs.

 

[David R. George III]

None of us have any idea how much of DRG3's upcoming DS9 book is/will be based on Marco's initial plans, Margaret's revision of those plans, the new Trek editor's re-revision of those plans, or David's execution of those plans.

Kinda makes your head spin, don't it?

 

[BrotherBenny]

None of us have any idea how much of DRG3's upcoming DS9 book is/will be based on Marco's initial plans, Margaret's revision of those plans, the new Trek editor's re-revision of those plans, or David's execution of those plans.

Kinda makes your head spin, don't it?

Can you tell us anything about the book, David, all kidding aside?

 

[langdonboom]

None of us have any idea how much of DRG3's upcoming DS9 book is/will be based on Marco's initial plans, Margaret's revision of those plans, the new Trek editor's re-revision of those plans, or David's execution of those plans.

Kinda makes your head spin, don't it?

Yes, it does! If only you were in a position to comment.....

Oh wait, you are! But are you at liberty to comment? Are there any plans to address that gap and/or continue with the Ascendants/Dominion storylines? Thanks in any case. So great to be able to converse with my favorite Trek authors here.

 

[David R. George III]

None of us have any idea how much of DRG3's upcoming DS9 book is/will be based on Marco's initial plans, Margaret's revision of those plans, the new Trek editor's re-revision of those plans, or David's execution of those plans.

Kinda makes your head spin, don't it?

Can you tell us anything about the book, David, all kidding aside?

I can tell you many things, but of course, I won't. (You had to see that coming.) With respect to Marco initially heading up the project, and then having Margaret pick up the ball, and now Jaime taking her turn...honestly, little has changed for me (other than my terrible sadness that two very nice people and fine editors lost their jobs).

First, Marco approached me about participating in what he then envisioned as a six-book series involving each member species of the Typhon Pact. Specifically, he wanted me to tackle the Romulan volume. At some point, I agreed.

During the course of conjuring up a story to tell, the Typhon Pact baton passed to Margaret. By that point, the series had become four books instead of six, which allowed me to ask to take on an additional Pact species in my volume. Margaret graciously permitted me to add the Tzenkethi to my tale. She also decided that the series would allow us to bring the ongoing Deep Space Nine story into the "current" state of the Star Trek literary universe. I crafted an outline that got approved by both Pocket Books and CBS Studios.

Now, with Jaime at the helm, I'm still working from that same outline.

If only you were in a position to comment.....

Oh wait, you are! But are you at liberty to comment? Are there any plans to address that gap and/or continue with the Ascendants/Dominion storylines? Thanks in any case. So great to be able to converse with my favorite Trek authors here.

Yes, I'm in a position to comment. And I will...but you won't like what I'm going to say...which of course is this: you'll just have to wait and see.

 

[langdonboom]

you'll just have to wait and see.

Fair enough. Though if you're worried about affecting sales one way or the other -- at least with me you can rest assured I'm in for a penny, in for a pound as far as the Pocket books 24th century Trek books.

It will be disappointing to find out some of those storylines I cited above won't get resolved or only get "Full Circle"'d but regardless I'm excited for the Typhon pact story lines as-is, and I've dealt with worse disappointments in my life (I guess...)

As a reader of most every version of this 24th century Trek I've always thought that Trek's rich history and inter-connectivity has been one of its great emotional and storytelling strengths in the Pocket books run and it would be nice to see that "family feeling" between DS9, TNG, Voyager, Titan and all the others continue... But you probably knew that already!

Thanks for letting me down easy, at least. Consider me waiting and seeing.

 

[Therin of Andor]

Though if you're worried about affecting sales one way or the other .

Huh?

Maybe DRG3 prefers his readers to get their surprises reading the book instead of advance spoilers on a BBS?

 

[Christopher]

^It's not just a matter of the author's choice. Publicity is Pocket's bailiwick, and they're the ones who decide what gets publicized when. Generally we authors aren't supposed to reveal any details about a project until we get the go-ahead from our editors. For one thing, we aren't supposed to talk about anything that hasn't been CBS-approved yet, because it's possible it might be changed.

 

[Newspaper Taxi]

I'm not worried about the five year jump because I remember reading DRG3's books "The 34th Rule" and "Mission Gamma I: Twilight". You can not describe the guy's writing style as 'breif'. Assuming the editors are generous with word limits I could see him telling a coherent story that spans the five years in one book. Really; it's quite the oppourunity -- most Trek books aren't allowed to explore years at a time.

I guess, though, that I haven't really heard anything about the new DS9 book. Is it confined to the post-Borg time period? Even if that were true I'd still put in a vote of confidence that he could weave in alot of information and glimpses into the lost years.

 

[JD]

^Agreed. IMO Pocket would be stupid to just ignore the five years between the stories, or to skip the stories that have been set up before the jump. I know a new editor is taking over, and we are jumping ahead, but that doesn't mean that they are going to ignore what has made DS9 DS9. Sure they might pull Full Circle and tie them all up in one book, but unless someone involved tells me, there is no way I'm going to believe they will ignore all of the ongoing stories.