So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the reboot?
- Thread starter BlastHardcheese
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Re: So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the rebo
That's exactly the way I look at it...
Re: So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the rebo
I agree but I would also be interested to see how Abrams would handle some of the things. I mean he tryed to say that dispite everything that was different the people were still the same. Personally I want to see how this version of Kirk would deal with Khan.
I agree but I would also be interested to see how Abrams would handle some of the things. I mean he tryed to say that dispite everything that was different the people were still the same. Personally I want to see how this version of Kirk would deal with Khan.
Re: So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the rebo
Once again: the explanation from Spock--that they bothered to have an explanation at all--is charity for the canon nazis, nothing more.
Sop fooling yourself. The writers knew exactly what they were doing: they were re-making Star Trek. Maybe YOU are confused about what they actually made, but the production team had an extremely clear idea what this was about. They've stated concisely that it IS an alternate reality and therefore anything can (or can not) happen.
Re: So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the rebo
If the people are the same, then his version of Kirk would--theoretically--deal with Khan the same way.
OTOH, rehashing Khan/Wrath of Khan is only interesting if you actually redo things to make it more interesting. Like, say, having Khan be discovered by another starship, Khan takes over that starship and uses it to conquer another primitive race and having Kirk be responsible for freeing the locals from Earth's most nefarious tyrant.
If the people are the same, then his version of Kirk would--theoretically--deal with Khan the same way.
OTOH, rehashing Khan/Wrath of Khan is only interesting if you actually redo things to make it more interesting. Like, say, having Khan be discovered by another starship, Khan takes over that starship and uses it to conquer another primitive race and having Kirk be responsible for freeing the locals from Earth's most nefarious tyrant.
Re: So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the rebo
So Nero travelled from the prime universe back to a universe that was already alternate and the date just happened to be 120 years previous?
Instead of Nero travelling back to a previous time in the prime universe and altering it?
Despite the fact that the younger Spock even said that Nero changed history coming back and whatever their destinies were before, they were now changed? Thus Young Spock was implying that they WERE in the prime universe that had been altered?
Your belief is an irrational excuse when what you really want to say is that continuity and canon are meaningless to you and you don't care if they are not preserved.
Y'know, despite events like Kirk beating the no win scenario by cheating which was a big piece of canon and continuity that was respected. But at the end of the day, that was included to please the trek fans who remember TWOK.
So Nero travelled from the prime universe back to a universe that was already alternate and the date just happened to be 120 years previous?
Instead of Nero travelling back to a previous time in the prime universe and altering it?
Despite the fact that the younger Spock even said that Nero changed history coming back and whatever their destinies were before, they were now changed? Thus Young Spock was implying that they WERE in the prime universe that had been altered?
Your belief is an irrational excuse when what you really want to say is that continuity and canon are meaningless to you and you don't care if they are not preserved.
Y'know, despite events like Kirk beating the no win scenario by cheating which was a big piece of canon and continuity that was respected. But at the end of the day, that was included to please the trek fans who remember TWOK.
Re: So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the rebo
And we'd still get to see the NuDoomsday Machine, as well as the NuKelvins from Andromeda who are on their way.
And we'd still get to see the NuDoomsday Machine, as well as the NuKelvins from Andromeda who are on their way.
Nowhere Man
Commodore
Re: So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the rebo
Since it's an alternate universe, one could assume that nothing from the prime universe will play out the same. Not to say that it couldn't, but it dosen't have to. What we do know is that the alternate universe began at the very moment that the Kelvin was destroyed, so everything that occured up until that point was part of the prime universe and the people who were alive at that time are still alive. The Botany Bay,the Doomsday Machine, The Gardian or anything else still exists, but dosen't mean Kirk and crew will encounter them. I would argue that the only out of place is prime Spock, who I would think is in violation of the temperal prime directive. I would also argue that Spock prime could convince Kirk and crew to help him restore the timeline and go to the Gardian planet (Spock prime knows where it is) the Gardian is in charge of all time including alternate realities and could send Spock Prime back to the future(not intended).He could prevent the destruction of Romulus which would create an everlasting peace between The Federation and the newly formed Romulan Republic , which is headed by Nero, who is hearalded as the savior of Romulus along with Spock. This would restore and or merge the two universes and no ones the wiser exept Spock, Kirk and Mcoy. This could also be a way that Kirk dosen't end up in the Nexus. How's that for a two part sequel
Since it's an alternate universe, one could assume that nothing from the prime universe will play out the same. Not to say that it couldn't, but it dosen't have to. What we do know is that the alternate universe began at the very moment that the Kelvin was destroyed, so everything that occured up until that point was part of the prime universe and the people who were alive at that time are still alive. The Botany Bay,the Doomsday Machine, The Gardian or anything else still exists, but dosen't mean Kirk and crew will encounter them. I would argue that the only out of place is prime Spock, who I would think is in violation of the temperal prime directive. I would also argue that Spock prime could convince Kirk and crew to help him restore the timeline and go to the Gardian planet (Spock prime knows where it is) the Gardian is in charge of all time including alternate realities and could send Spock Prime back to the future(not intended).He could prevent the destruction of Romulus which would create an everlasting peace between The Federation and the newly formed Romulan Republic , which is headed by Nero, who is hearalded as the savior of Romulus along with Spock. This would restore and or merge the two universes and no ones the wiser exept Spock, Kirk and Mcoy. This could also be a way that Kirk dosen't end up in the Nexus. How's that for a two part sequel
Re: So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the rebo
What Spock was implying is that that Nero's arrival had created an alternate reality -- a separate one which did not lead to the 24th century from which Nero came and in which, therefore, history would not necessarily play out in the same way as the (Prime-timeline) history Nero "knows". Thus, Nero would not be able to predict with any certainty the actions even of those people he had previously studied (i.e., Kirk, Spock) because the future of the alternate timeline and Nero's "known" future are connected only at a point (Narada's arrival via wormhole/white hole) now in the past of both timelines -- timelines which will tend to grow more divergent over time, like two branches growing in different directions from a fork of the same tree.
That bit's been done already, and quite thoroughly. It doesn't need to keep popping up in other threads.
Re: So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the rebo
Despite NuTrek diverging from 2233 from the Prime Universe it makes one wonder how the original trips to the past in the Prime Universe would be different in NuTrek's past, before 2233.
Despite NuTrek diverging from 2233 from the Prime Universe it makes one wonder how the original trips to the past in the Prime Universe would be different in NuTrek's past, before 2233.
Re: So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the rebo
Somewhere along the way they got confused as to whether they were writing a reboot or a prequel and as such the film now occupies some nubulous territory where it isn't quite one or the other.
If you want to play make-believe and pretend that the ENTIRE film is all brand new and has nothing to with existing continuity, then go ahead. Believe me, I'd prefer it to be that way too but I can't ignore what's categorically stated in the film itself and by its creators.
If it's in the film, it's important, it matters. You can't just dismiss what's stated on film (and in interviews for that matter) because it doesn't fit with how you want things to be.
They've stated it's an alternate timeline.
Somewhere along the way they got confused as to whether they were writing a reboot or a prequel and as such the film now occupies some nubulous territory where it isn't quite one or the other.
If you want to play make-believe and pretend that the ENTIRE film is all brand new and has nothing to with existing continuity, then go ahead. Believe me, I'd prefer it to be that way too but I can't ignore what's categorically stated in the film itself and by its creators.
Re: So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the rebo
No, they didn't. They deliberately wrote a film that acted as a genuine sequel to "Nemesis" (and "Unification") and prequel to TOS, but also gelled with TNG's "Parallels". No confusion at all.
No, they didn't. They deliberately wrote a film that acted as a genuine sequel to "Nemesis" (and "Unification") and prequel to TOS, but also gelled with TNG's "Parallels". No confusion at all.
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Re: So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the rebo
That's how I see it too. I just think that the writers either 'ignored' or just plain thought "fuck it" when dealing with certain aspects.
Re: So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the rebo
I started the thread to find out if there are any events that should still technically happen in the new universe despite what the writers decide.
Khan may never be found in the S.S. Botany Bay. Carol Marcus may never create a working Genesis device without the help of a genius son who is never born because she might never have slept with Kirk. The Doomsday machine may never be encountered by Matt Decker and never threaten the Federation. Spock's brain may never get stolen!
But some events are so big that the Enterprise crew have no choice but to get involved. Vger heading to Earth at high warp is such an event.
I started the thread to find out if there are any events that should still technically happen in the new universe despite what the writers decide.
Khan may never be found in the S.S. Botany Bay. Carol Marcus may never create a working Genesis device without the help of a genius son who is never born because she might never have slept with Kirk. The Doomsday machine may never be encountered by Matt Decker and never threaten the Federation. Spock's brain may never get stolen!
But some events are so big that the Enterprise crew have no choice but to get involved. Vger heading to Earth at high warp is such an event.
Re: So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the rebo
I guess you could say that 3000 years into the future of the nu-timeline, someone goes back in time and prevents the Voyager probe from being launched.
But then, would that create another alternate timeline and thus have no effect on the nu-timeline? Or does a new timeline only occur when red matter is used?
I guess you could say that 3000 years into the future of the nu-timeline, someone goes back in time and prevents the Voyager probe from being launched.
But then, would that create another alternate timeline and thus have no effect on the nu-timeline? Or does a new timeline only occur when red matter is used?
Re: So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the rebo
Or the writers will refuse to acknowledge the event at all and screw up the continuity they have tried to respect.
Or the writers will refuse to acknowledge the event at all and screw up the continuity they have tried to respect.
Re: So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the rebo
We know this to be an entirely different universe where time is not synced up to the Prime universe because Nokia and the Beastie Boys did not exist in the Prime universe. Also, the prime universe had some sort of Eugenics Wars going on in the late 1990's that I can't recall at all.
We know this to be an entirely different universe where time is not synced up to the Prime universe because Nokia and the Beastie Boys did not exist in the Prime universe. Also, the prime universe had some sort of Eugenics Wars going on in the late 1990's that I can't recall at all.
Re: So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the rebo
There might have been Nokia and the Beastie Boys in the prime universe which survived the Eugenics wars.
There might have been Nokia and the Beastie Boys in the prime universe which survived the Eugenics wars.
Re: So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the rebo
Me too. The black hole is the key.
Me too. The black hole is the key.
Re: So what events from the prime trekverse are unaffected by the rebo
I don't think we have to worry about V'ger for awhile anyways. If the new movie takes place in 2258, and TMP takes place in 2271, then that means that the the new universes timeline won't catch up to the events of TMP until 2022 (assuming the passage of time in the movies follows a 1:1 ratio with real life).
If new Trek movies are still being made in or around 2022, I think all they would have to do is reference V'ger and not show it.
I don't think we have to worry about V'ger for awhile anyways. If the new movie takes place in 2258, and TMP takes place in 2271, then that means that the the new universes timeline won't catch up to the events of TMP until 2022 (assuming the passage of time in the movies follows a 1:1 ratio with real life).
If new Trek movies are still being made in or around 2022, I think all they would have to do is reference V'ger and not show it.
