Was Tennant *Your* Doctor?

[The]

He's a Prydonian you don't become one without some kind of connections.

Says who? None of this was ever explored in the series, except for one, single episode. Everything else has been Fannon created around it...

Unless you the four parter The Deadly Assassin, that was hardly one single ep.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/doctorwho/classic/episodeguide/deadlyassassin/detail.shtml

Oh dear, how pedantic. Semantics, now?

Fine. The entirety of his class was explored in one, single story. And never again. My point still stands...

Time Lord chapters include the Prydonians (the 'notoriously devious' sect to whom the Doctor belongs, colour coded scarlet and orange), Arcalians (green) and Patrexes (heliotrope). Spandrell makes a derogatory remark about Sheboogans [who appear to be the Gallifreyan equivalent of hooligans. They are not the Outsiders seen in The Invasion of Time.] Engin gives Earth its Gallifreyan name ('Sol 3 in Mutter's Spiral'), which is described as 'an interesting little planet'.

I'm not the one making up things about the Doctor's past that run contrary to what we know happened in the past.

DWF, what does any of that have to do with my points? What are you trying to prove here? It's eluding me.

 

[Sci]

He was a man, he was a father, grandfather

Pardon me, but are you trying to say that people from the working class are not men, fathers, and grandfathers? Because if you're not, I'm not sure why you would mention this as though to contrast your idea of his background with the "working class boy makes good" idea of his background.

and he had a family that didn't throw him out,

Wrong. "The Empty Child" is very clear on this: At some point in his childhood, the Doctor was the only child left out in the cold. At some point in his childhood, the Doctor was abandoned.

he joined the academy and later left Gallifrey for a variety of reasons.

He joined the Academy, graduated, became a part of its faculty, and then at some point suffered some sort of scandal that prompted him to steal the TARDIS and run away from Gallifrey with his granddaughter.

And nothing about that implies that he can't have come from a poor background.

The first Doctor referred to himself as citizen of the universe and a gentlemen to boot. I'm not even sure the Time Lords have a working class since they didn't do much of anything.

Of course they have a working class. Any society as fundamentally corrupt as the Time Lords would have a working class. And, frankly, the Time Lords are essentially a mirror of British society.

 

[Chaos Descending]

If the Time Lords have no working class, what's Drax?

 

[Starkers]

Of course they have a working class. Any society as fundamentally corrupt as the Time Lords would have a working class. And, frankly, the Time Lords are essentially a mirror of British society.

Oi what are you saying about British society

To me the Doctor has always been the architypal rich well connected kid who went a bit hippy, dropped out tuned in etc...

Possibly the great thing about Who is that either possibility is probably just as valid, and seriously just is matter a jot he he was a pauper or a king? Surely what matters is that he's a good man who fights evil and does a lot of running...

 

[Sci]

Of course they have a working class. Any society as fundamentally corrupt as the Time Lords would have a working class. And, frankly, the Time Lords are essentially a mirror of British society.

Oi what are you saying about British society

Pardon me -- a dark mirror of British society. Better?

 

[Cutter John]

There was Drax, as mentioned above. Also the Chancellory Guard has to come from somewhere. So obviously there are 'classes' of Gallifreyans. Though its hard to imagine a civilazation like theirs having an actual 'working class'.

 

[Starkers]

Of course they have a working class. Any society as fundamentally corrupt as the Time Lords would have a working class. And, frankly, the Time Lords are essentially a mirror of British society.

Oi what are you saying about British society

Pardon me -- a dark mirror of British society. Better?

Hmm...getting there

 

[DWF]

There was Drax, as mentioned above. Also the Chancellory Guard has to come from somewhere. So obviously there are 'classes' of Gallifreyans. Though its hard to imagine a civilazation like theirs having an actual 'working class'.

Drax gained his accent by going to prison and he really wasn't that good of a repairman, plus he had his own TARDIS. It's possible that not all Gallifreyans are Time Lords, but I don't think there's a working class among them, just a well adjusted middle class. There's no proof they had money on Gallifrey.

 

[DWF]

He was a man, he was a father, grandfather

Pardon me, but are you trying to say that people from the working class are not men, fathers, and grandfathers? Because if you're not, I'm not sure why you would mention this as though to contrast your idea of his background with the "working class boy makes good" idea of his background.

and he had a family that didn't throw him out,

Wrong. "The Empty Child" is very clear on this: At some point in his childhood, the Doctor was the only child left out in the cold. At some point in his childhood, the Doctor was abandoned.

he joined the academy and later left Gallifrey for a variety of reasons.

He joined the Academy, graduated, became a part of its faculty, and then at some point suffered some sort of scandal that prompted him to steal the TARDIS and run away from Gallifrey with his granddaughter.

And nothing about that implies that he can't have come from a poor background.

The first Doctor referred to himself as citizen of the universe and a gentlemen to boot. I'm not even sure the Time Lords have a working class since they didn't do much of anything.

Of course they have a working class. Any society as fundamentally corrupt as the Time Lords would have a working class. And, frankly, the Time Lords are essentially a mirror of British society.

Where's the proof that the Doctor was on the faculity at the Time Lord Academy? And he also said in The Empty Child that he'd been travelling for 900 years, yet in Voage Of The Damned he gave his age as 902 years old, did he start travelling when he was 2 years old?

 

[Cutter John]

Drax gained his accent by going to prison and he really wasn't that good of a repairman, plus he had his own TARDIS. It's possible that not all Gallifreyans are Time Lords, but I don't think there's a working class among them, just a well adjusted middle class. There's no proof they had money on Gallifrey.

Having thought about it a bit, they must have at least two classes. The average citizens who maintain the technology, keep the Tardises working, guard the Citidel, etc. And the ruling Time Lords, who dedicate themselves to a 'higher calling'.

Where's the proof that the Doctor was on the faculity at the Time Lord Academy? And he also said in The Empty Child that he'd been travelling for 900 years, yet in Voage Of The Damned he gave his age as 902 years old, did he start travelling when he was 2 years old?

Just more proof that the Doctor lies about his age (can't keep his figures straight). Sylvester McCoys Doctor came right out once and said he was 953. Maybe Time Lords reach maturity at 1000 and the Doc just doesn't want to admit he's not a kid anymore.

 

[DWF]

Where's the proof that the Doctor was on the faculity at the Time Lord Academy? And he also said in The Empty Child that he'd been travelling for 900 years, yet in Voage Of The Damned he gave his age as 902 years old, did he start travelling when he was 2 years old?

Just more proof that the Doctor lies about his age (can't keep his figures straight). Silvester McCoys Doctor came right out once and said he was 953. Maybe Time Lords reach maturity at 1000 and the Doc just doesn't want to admit he's not a kid anymore.

I know I loved how RTD thought people would've forgotten that the Doctor said was 953 in Time And The Rani.

 

[sidious618]

The first Doctor I watched was Davison so I guess he's my Doctor.

 

[wamdue]

I know I loved how RTD thought people would've forgotten that the Doctor said was 953 in Time And The Rani.

that was pretty foolish of him, sometimes I think the Rani episodes are the only ones the Classic Series fans have seen, given their constant calls for the return of theRani.

The Doctor should just say his age in TimeLord language whenever he is asked.

 

[DWF]

I first saw Robot in 1978 and thanks to PBS we saw Tom Baker's first four years several times over. Thanks to articles in Famous Monsters and Starlong I knew about the other Doctors but Tom Baker's Doctor was The Doctor for me, he enbodied all that there was about the character, he was a rogue and rebel, a scientist, a clown and a hero among other things. He also stood up for the underdog and he was mysterious brooder as well.

 

[Sci]

Where's the proof that the Doctor was on the faculity at the Time Lord Academy?

I got that from this compilation of TOS and nuWho episodes, but I'll concede that I may have misremembered or misunderstood something from it. Looking at it again, I think I got that notion from the seeming contradiction between the idea that he qualified after scrapping by with 51% on the second attempt and the idea that he was expelled from the Academy.

And he also said in The Empty Child that he'd been travelling for 900 years, yet in Voage Of The Damned he gave his age as 902 years old, did he start travelling when he was 2 years old?

So what? The Doctor either lies about his age or doesn't know it. That doesn't change the fact that he was abandoned as a child and knows what it's like to be the only one left out in the cold.

And, yes, the Time Lords have to have a working class and money. 1) Every society has to; this isn't Star Trek. 2) Middle class and rich people don't leave children out in the cold; poverty causes that.

 

[DWF]

Where's the proof that the Doctor was on the faculity at the Time Lord Academy?

I got that from this compilation of TOS and nuWho episodes, but I'll concede that I may have misremembered or misunderstood something from it. Looking at it again, I think I got that notion from the seeming contradiction between the idea that he qualified after scrapping by with 51% on the second attempt and the idea that he was expelled from the Academy.

And he also said in The Empty Child that he'd been travelling for 900 years, yet in Voage Of The Damned he gave his age as 902 years old, did he start travelling when he was 2 years old?

So what? The Doctor either lies about his age or doesn't know it. That doesn't change the fact that he was abandoned as a child and knows what it's like to be the only one left out in the cold.

And, yes, the Time Lords have to have a working class and money. 1) Every society has to; this isn't Star Trek. 2) Middle class and rich people don't leave children out in the cold; poverty causes that.

Again you're speaking without any real proof, we've never seen any Gallifreyan money on the show. Nor anything beyond the idea of Gallifreyan TIme Lords and non Time Lord Gallifreayans. And seeing as how they had access to technologies beyond imagning I can't see the use of a working class.

 

[Jim Steele]

And seeing as how they had access to technologies beyond imagning I can't see the use of a working class.

You're kidding, right?

Compared to 16th century England, we have an abundance of technology beyond their imagination. Even robots that perform manual labour!

Guess what? There's still a working class. I don't think that argument stands up to scrutiny.

"But they can go anywhere in time and space!"

"Yeah, but someone has to cook the chips in the canteen..."

 

[Starkers]

And, yes, the Time Lords have to have a working class and money. 1) Every society has to; this isn't Star Trek. 2) Middle class and rich people don't leave children out in the cold; poverty causes that.

WTF? Only poor people abandon kids, and its only ever because of poverty? That seems somewhat simplistic. There are whole heaps of reasons parents abandon their children. Shame and embaressment, fear, accident, because they simply don't care, the thought that they will actually have a better life elsewhere, war...remember Nancy and her son weren't on the streets due to poverty but due to war and social embaressment. Heck how do we know Timelords aren't like Spartons? These are a people who stick small kids in front of infinity and wait to see how many go mad after all!

Point is there are whole heaps of reasons the Doctor might have been abandoned as a child--it might have been a metaphotical abandonment. Perhaps his parents abandoned him to their nanny? Perhaps it was emotional abandonment??

And of course this is a man who never tells people his real name, who either can't remember how old he is or actively lies about his age. Should we really take anything he says as gospel?

 

[The Nth Doctor]

Where's the proof that the Doctor was on the faculity at the Time Lord Academy? And he also said in The Empty Child that he'd been travelling for 900 years, yet in Voage Of The Damned he gave his age as 902 years old, did he start travelling when he was 2 years old?

Just more proof that the Doctor lies about his age (can't keep his figures straight). Sylvester McCoys Doctor came right out once and said he was 953. Maybe Time Lords reach maturity at 1000 and the Doc just doesn't want to admit he's not a kid anymore.

In "The Empty Child," The Ninth Doctor said "[...]Nine hundred years of phone box travel[...]" I've always taken this to mean that he has had the TARDIS for 900 years. In The Ribos Operation, Romana said The Doctor was 759 years at the time and had been piloting the TARDIS for 523 years, meaning he was 236 years old at the time he stole it. Assuming The Ninth Doctor and Romana were speaking the truth at those particular times (and Romana has been known to lie about her own age), then I believe that The Doctor is 1136 years old as of "The Empty Child" and has lied about his age since then.

But no matter how you look at it, The Doctor has lied about his age on a number of occasions. This is merely how I choose to look at the "truth."

 

[DWF]

And seeing as how they had access to technologies beyond imagning I can't see the use of a working class.

You're kidding, right?

Compared to 16th century England, we have an abundance of technology beyond their imagination. Even robots that perform manual labour!

Guess what? There's still a working class. I don't think that argument stands up to scrutiny.

"But they can go anywhere in time and space!"

"Yeah, but someone has to cook the chips in the canteen..."

Given what Time Lords eat I don't think they fix very many meals nor do they eat all that often to begin with. Even the TARDIS had a food machine that gave out only food flavored pills.