I liked everything except Enterprise. It would have worked for me if it was set in an alternate timeline, but considering they were trying to make the "Akiraprise" set in the same timeline as Kirk, it totally was screwed up.
How can you praise this movie and bash VOY, ENT and Nemesis?
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Again, I wouldn't debate the quality of such scenes and how they're written and filmed. As i said, if you think the humor is clunky that's one thing. But hardly comparable? I'm arguing that humor and serious aren't mutually exclusive.
It's also fiction. For one thing, dramatic interpretation is what helps us believe that a captain with a British accent is from France, and that futuristic starships, for some odd reason, still do battle like old 17th century sailing ships.
Well, i say it says more about the public than about SW or ST.Plus, again, what exactly did we know about Alderaan? It surely wasn't Vulcan.
Of course, the next movie could remedy this somewhat, but again, I don't like to rely on promises for the future.
Well, hoping isn't the same as ensuring a promise, either. But so far, I do hope they expand upon Vulcan. The writers have a massive war-induced diaspora on their hands and that would be an excellent and rather timely social topic for modern Trek to tackle.
I have a nagging feeling that had B&B really put it in an alternate timeline many people would have accused them of being lazy and trying to avoid respecting canon. Of course, i could be wrong.
I agree they are not mutually exclusive. It's just that the quality IS important because how you combine these two opposite things determines how succesful your end result will be. That scene with the helmet is a few seconds of something mildly funny that could happen in battle but still surrounded by darkness and suffering. You see how he immediately shoots the German after it; you're immediately reminded it's war. In ST09 the scene with the tubes is completely unconnected and unnessecary. The problem is they diverted more time from action for silly things like that than for showing the sadness and shock of a genocide.
Here's hoping they really go that way.
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I have a nagging feeling that had B&B really put it in an alternate timeline many people would have accused them of being lazy and trying to avoid respecting canon. Of course, i could be wrong.
Welll... to be fair to one B(raga) and his fans, Parallels and All Good Things were pretty brilliant.
Now, for Berman... WOOOF! Don't get me started
No this movie really didn't need more sadness.
I'm really tired of sad movies.
There was an aknowledgement of what happened from Spock, from Uhura, from Sarek.
I really didn't need a 30 minute funeral scene to get what happened.
The movie was good. Changing it likely would have made it less good.
I'm really tired of sad movies.
There was an aknowledgement of what happened from Spock, from Uhura, from Sarek.
I really didn't need a 30 minute funeral scene to get what happened.
The movie was good. Changing it likely would have made it less good.
How can I like this movie and bash Voyager, Enterprise and Nemesis? Easy. IN fact, I'll do one better and throw TNG into the mix as well.
How?? Because THIS movie is back to basics. It's TOS in both concept and execution. TNG and the spin-offs were totally different animals and ran as far away from TOS as they could, utimately paying the price. This movie is just the opposite. It's incredibly fun. It understands TOS, it embraces TOS and the respect and undestanding that it gave to TOS has brought the movie rich rewards, which it so rightly deserves. This IS Star Trek. After 20 years of talkity talk Snore Trek, it's FINALLY back and I couldn't be happier to herald it's return.
How?? Because THIS movie is back to basics. It's TOS in both concept and execution. TNG and the spin-offs were totally different animals and ran as far away from TOS as they could, utimately paying the price. This movie is just the opposite. It's incredibly fun. It understands TOS, it embraces TOS and the respect and undestanding that it gave to TOS has brought the movie rich rewards, which it so rightly deserves. This IS Star Trek. After 20 years of talkity talk Snore Trek, it's FINALLY back and I couldn't be happier to herald it's return.
I can like or dislike anything I want, that's how :P
For me it's not about premise, it's about execution. VOY and ENT both had interesting premises with lots of potential, but ultimately they both failed (for me) in the execution. NEM especially stunk up the joint. For all three the writing was flat, the characterizations two dimensional and sometimes inconsistent. VOY especially fails because it so quickly abandoned all the things about its core premise that made it interesting. (There was never any real sense of jeopardy due to the ship's isolation from the Federation.)
The new movie has a concept that I liked and they executed it well, and most importantly they brought back a sense of fun to a franchise that was sorely lacking in that department. Was Trek XI perfect? No. But it is an enjoyable and effective restart of a franchise that (IMHO) was in desperate need of just that, thanks in large part to the likes of Voyager, Enterprise, and especially Nemesis.
The new movie has a concept that I liked and they executed it well, and most importantly they brought back a sense of fun to a franchise that was sorely lacking in that department. Was Trek XI perfect? No. But it is an enjoyable and effective restart of a franchise that (IMHO) was in desperate need of just that, thanks in large part to the likes of Voyager, Enterprise, and especially Nemesis.
Yeah, well, genocide is a pretty sad thing, wouldn't you say?
Strong, convincing arguments. I'm beaten!
Some of us really liked that 'talkity talk Snore Trek', you know? I know i liked it better than TOS (*evades flying objects*
of course, i like TOS as well) Why should we belittle other series in order to propell this movie?It really isn't fair to compare one two hour film to an entire series. Afterall, both VOY and ENT had what I would call solid starts with their pilots.
But if you want to judge XI with something more comparable like the pilots of those shows I would argue "Caretaker" was better and "Broken Bow" was a tad bit better than XI. I'd also say that "Scorpion" was better as a two hour film.
Even ENT's "The Council/Countdown/Zero Hour" trilogy at the end of the third season could be considered a three act two hour film that was better than XI. It had outstanding effects, battle sequences, a sense of scope, Earth in jeopardy, great production, costuming, lots of locales(the interior of the superweapon, the avian stronghold, several different bridges, a transdimensional realm, the Federation ceremony in 2161), a large cast of characters, stronger character scenes and Reed's discussion with T'Pol over the loss of one redshirt was better executed in tone than some in XI.
But if you want to judge XI with something more comparable like the pilots of those shows I would argue "Caretaker" was better and "Broken Bow" was a tad bit better than XI. I'd also say that "Scorpion" was better as a two hour film.
Even ENT's "The Council/Countdown/Zero Hour" trilogy at the end of the third season could be considered a three act two hour film that was better than XI. It had outstanding effects, battle sequences, a sense of scope, Earth in jeopardy, great production, costuming, lots of locales(the interior of the superweapon, the avian stronghold, several different bridges, a transdimensional realm, the Federation ceremony in 2161), a large cast of characters, stronger character scenes and Reed's discussion with T'Pol over the loss of one redshirt was better executed in tone than some in XI.
I would also add the Vulcan trilogy of ENT's fourth season.
Yes as would I. It had more of a feel for TOS and especially of a TOS film than XI. It also demonstrated how a writer could effectively utilize elements that other series had introduced and put them to great effect in a new interesting story rather than feeling like gratuitous namedropping.
Yeah, well, genocide is a pretty sad thing, wouldn't you say?
Bad things happen in movies all the time. I am sure there was a ton of grieving, memorial services and such in the Federation after the events of the movie.
It doesn't need to be shown on screen.
How many people do you think were killed by collateral damage in Transformers? Why didn't we see memorial services?
How about all colonists killed in Aliens. And the dead soldiers for that matter.
How DARE that movie end in TRIUMPH!
No- this movie really didn't need to dwell on showing us a full-blown memorial service.
We saw some sadness through several of the characters (at least three spring to mind).
And really that was what mattered. I don't really care how the entire federation feels. I care about the characters the movie was actually ABOUT.
I'd also point out that TOS would frequently show very tragic events in the context of THE SHOW and not "oh god how will our characters react to this".
It's pulpy space opera adventures. It's a space western.
Not necessarily. For all we know, Kirk and Spock met this way in the prime timeline as well.
The doomsday machine.
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