The Prime Universe....no more.

[Zeppster]

There is also dialog between Spock, Uhura, and McCoy that basically says there are parallel universes.

 

[Shaw]

Ah? You responded to my original post where I used the term 'haters' first. WTF? If you're not a self-professed hater, then you must be one of those do gooders who like to think they're above the fray..that is until they join in. Again, WTF? Please take your Psych 101 elsewhere.

Well, from my point of view, it looks like the only reason you even joined TrekBBS was to share your anger. Seems like you have less positive to add to this discussion than I... though it would be nice if you could prove me wrong on that.

Don't worry, I don't actually expect anything positive from you. You seem to define yourself by labeling others around here. I was just pointing out that a healthier position would be to just enjoy what you enjoy and not worry about others. But you are obviously one of those few who get some sort of perverse pleasure out of it.

Fair enough... just don't kid yourself while doing what makes you happy.

 

[Stone_Cold_Sisko]

You can try and twist it anyway you want but the prime universe is dead. The movie clearly demonstrates this. Please include any information from the movie that suggests otherwise!

If there's no prime universe, where the hell did Nero and Prime Spock come from?

new universe never gets created without the Prime Universe in parallel.

 

[cmdrbolly]

Ah? You responded to my original post where I used the term 'haters' first. WTF? If you're not a self-professed hater, then you must be one of those do gooders who like to think they're above the fray..that is until they join in. Again, WTF? Please take your Psych 101 elsewhere.

Well, from my point of view, it looks like the only reason you even joined TrekBBS was to share your anger. Seems like you have less positive to add to this discussion than I... though it would be nice if you could prove me wrong on that.

Don't worry, I don't actually expect anything positive from you. You seem to define yourself by labeling others around here. I was just pointing out that a healthier position would be to just enjoy what you enjoy and not worry about others. But you are obviously one of those few who get some sort of perverse pleasure out of it.

Fair enough... just don't kid yourself while doing what makes you happy.

Gawd, do you ever read yourself? How did the broom handle get wedged so deeply up there?

 

[Zeppster]

Prime Universe exists in parallel to the new one. It is that simple folks.


There is nothing in the movie to suggest this. There is sufficient dialogue to suggest otherwise. The prime universe is dead. Why else did Spock not go back to his "universe" if it was not dead?

So when the back door of my place of work closes behind me and I can't go back in and get my sunglasses 'cuz it locks automatically, does that mean the whole library ceases to exist because I can't get back in?

You can try and twist it anyway you want but the prime universe is dead. The movie clearly demonstrates this. Please include any information from the movie that suggests otherwise!

If you are right then since the prime universe no longer existed Spock and Nero both should have disappeared after either one changed history some how. So in other words, Nero and his crew disappear along with Spock right after George Kirk rams into his ship.

 

[perigee]

I'm ...amused? that you guys are still playing punch and judy on this particular topic; at best the whole thing is irrelevant, and at worst, troll bait.

Rupture - I'll tell you a secret: you're right. The entirety of your whole fanboy childhood is wiped off the face of the earth. The Next Generation, with its sissy captain, corporate, boardroom smug solutions, Klingon pimples and xerox-Spock are gone for good, never happened... Kaput. Nobody is going to be manning that gas station over by Bajor, not the playdough guy, not the unmonkey-fied Ferengi bartender, and not Hawk without cojones. And most thankfully of all, that ship full of manniquins called Voyager won't depend on a Borg and a Holographic program to provide the majority of human interest.

So.. whatcha gonna do? Your fussing isn't going to change things one iota; hell, if everybody stood behind you on this board and reinacted the barracade scene from Le Miserables, things still wouldn't change. It is what it is, and it aint gonna change, so there you go. Light a candle - have a good weep. Cut off the world, buy a bomb shelter and live out 1990 for the rest of your days. The next Trek is still gonna happen exactly as JJ and Orci want it to; you are not, and will not ever be in a position to make the future of the series whatever it is you personally want it to be.

But here's the thing.

To my eyes, TNG was tedious, talky, yammering smug crap 90% of the time, and the series that came after became worse and worse in half-life steps. However, I'm not over in the TNG section bringing up how a 90-pound pipsqueek like Picard was never going to do anything but hide under the table when three Nauusicans wandered into a bar. That's one of my many, many Opinions - opinions being something you treasure - but what would be the point of bringing that up where people think the little old fart can bend steel in his scrawny, gnarled bare hands and change the course of mighty rivers?

Why would I do that?

Maybe I'd be starved for attention - maybe I just wanted to poke at the TNG monkeys through the bars, just to watch'em scream for my jollys. I am, after all, entitled to all my opinions, and equally entitled to piss on the commbadge's cornflakes.

But hey - TNG was their thing. They have their good things, and I have mine - we both have our bad things, too, which we politely ignore in each others presence, and they have helpfully set up special little pens here on TBBS for each show. Some go one place and avoid talking about Spock's Brain, others go to another and avoid talking about the wish-granting space jellyfish. I think the guy with the earthworm stuck in his neck called it "Peaceful Coexistence."

We could all talk about how a new Star Trek raped our childhoods, starting with my generation - I now have seven targets I can cry about, several of which are like shooting dead fish in a barrel. But, after being out in the world and socializing with real, live people for a while, I learned that it's generally bad form to wander into a group of any kind of pro- people just so I can shove my anti- in their faces, because it's my opinion, and I'm allowed to. I'd come off looking like some sort of weird, bitter loudmouthed intolerant and unsocialized douchebag.

So.. that's why I don't.

Why do you?

 

[Shaw]

Gawd, do you ever read yourself? How did the broom handle get wedged so deeply up there?

Oh, sorry, I didn't see that you had added something to your previous post...

My initial post was directed at people who hate the film. People who don't are excluded. If you don't hate the film, bully for you. Dennis got the joke.

See, I didn't realize that you had a crush on Dennis.

Best of luck trying to impress him.

 

[theFirebottle]

The filmmakers are trying to wipe out an outdated idea about how time travel might work. Linear time comes with too many unsolvable problems, such as the Grandfather Paradox. By using a paradigm of branching universes and timelines, the new creators of Trek have eliminated a component of the worldbuilding that was becoming increasingly untenable, belief-stretching, and unwieldy.

I, for one, welcome our new non-linear overlords.

The rapture: I was actually attempting to untwist your tormented and faulty argument, but I see now the error of my ways. As I've said in another thread, I can't reason a person out of a position they didn't reason themselves into. Trying to unjerk your knee is essentially futile.

 

[cmdrbolly]

Gawd, do you ever read yourself? How did the broom handle get wedged so deeply up there?

Oh, sorry, I didn't see that you had added something to your previous post...

My initial post was directed at people who hate the film. People who don't are excluded. If you don't hate the film, bully for you. Dennis got the joke.

See, I didn't realize that you had a crush on Dennis.

Best of luck trying to impress him.

So you're a Hater then?

 

[cmdrbolly]

I'm ...amused? that you guys are still playing punch and judy on this particular topic; at best the whole thing is irrelevant, and at worst, troll bait.

Rupture - I'll tell you a secret: you're right. The entirety of your whole fanboy childhood is wiped off the face of the earth. The Next Generation, with its sissy captain, corporate, boardroom smug solutions, Klingon pimples and xerox-Spock are gone for good, never happened... Kaput. Nobody is going to be manning that gas station over by Bajor, not the playdough guy, not the unmonkey-fied Ferengi bartender, and not Hawk without cojones. And most thankfully of all, that ship full of manniquins called Voyager won't depend on a Borg and a Holographic program to provide the majority of human interest.

So.. whatcha gonna do? Your fussing isn't going to change things one iota; hell, if everybody stood behind you on this board and reinacted the barracade scene from Le Miserables, things still wouldn't change. It is what it is, and it aint gonna change, so there you go. Light a candle - have a good weep. Cut off the world, buy a bomb shelter and live out 1990 for the rest of your days. The next Trek is still gonna happen exactly as JJ and Orci want it to; you are not, and will not ever be in a position to make the future of the series whatever it is you personally want it to be.

But here's the thing.

To my eyes, TNG was tedious, talky, yammering smug crap 90% of the time, and the series that came after became worse and worse in half-life steps. However, I'm not over in the TNG section bringing up how a 90-pound pipsqueek like Picard was never going to do anything but hide under the table when three Nauusicans wandered into a bar. That's one of my many, many Opinions - opinions being something you treasure - but what would be the point of bringing that up where people think the little old fart can bend steel in his scrawny, gnarled bare hands and change the course of mighty rivers?

Why would I do that?

Maybe I'd be starved for attention - maybe I just wanted to poke at the TNG monkeys through the bars, just to watch'em scream for my jollys. I am, after all, entitled to all my opinions, and equally entitled to piss on the commbadge's cornflakes.

But hey - TNG was their thing. They have their good things, and I have mine - we both have our bad things, too, which we politely ignore in each others presence, and they have helpfully set up special little pens here on TBBS for each show. Some go one place and avoid talking about Spock's Brain, others go to another and avoid talking about the wish-granting space jellyfish. I think the guy with the earthworm stuck in his neck called it "Peaceful Coexistence."

We could all talk about how a new Star Trek raped our childhoods, starting with my generation - I now have seven targets I can cry about, several of which are like shooting dead fish in a barrel. But, after being out in the world and socializing with real, live people for a while, I learned that it's generally bad form to wander into a group of any kind of pro- people just so I can shove my anti- in their faces, because it's my opinion, and I'm allowed to. I'd come off looking like some sort of weird, bitter loudmouthed intolerant and unsocialized douchebag.

So.. that's why I don't.

Why do you?

This is now the BEST POST EVER.

 

[Shaw]

So you're a Hater then?

I don't hate your feelings for Dennis... to each their own.

 

[cmdrbolly]

So you're a Hater then?

I don't hate your feelings for Dennis... to each their own.

In other words, a Hater.

 

[XXXTC]

Abrams has wiped away all of TOS, TNG, DS9 and VOY.

Not necessarily. In the movie DESTINY was mentioned. It is entirely possible that Kirk, Spock and friends are destined to play out their various adventures together in this new time line. For example its entirely possible that Kirk and Spock are destined to battle ala "Amok Time" albeit on nu-vulcan. The key word here is destiny and whether in the prime time line or the one we more commonly know from the original episodes I think open minded people can accept that these adventures will play out as we know them - plus we can even get new ones from abrams and crew.

Once we figure destiny into the new time line I think we can be confident that TOS, TNG, DS9 and VOY remain quite intact.

 

[Shaw]

So you're a Hater then?

I don't hate your feelings for Dennis... to each their own.

In other words, a Hater.

Hey, if calling me or anyone else a Hater is what you think will get you in Dennis' good graces, more power to ya!

Sadly, you've proven that rationality isn't one of your fortes... nor is arguing in a forum.

 

[The rapture]

I'm ...amused? that you guys are still playing punch and judy on this particular topic; at best the whole thing is irrelevant, and at worst, troll bait.

Rupture - I'll tell you a secret: you're right. The entirety of your whole fanboy childhood is wiped off the face of the earth. The Next Generation, with its sissy captain, corporate, boardroom smug solutions, Klingon pimples and xerox-Spock are gone for good, never happened... Kaput. Nobody is going to be manning that gas station over by Bajor, not the playdough guy, not the unmonkey-fied Ferengi bartender, and not Hawk without cojones. And most thankfully of all, that ship full of manniquins called Voyager won't depend on a Borg and a Holographic program to provide the majority of human interest.

So.. whatcha gonna do? Your fussing isn't going to change things one iota; hell, if everybody stood behind you on this board and reinacted the barracade scene from Le Miserables, things still wouldn't change. It is what it is, and it aint gonna change, so there you go. Light a candle - have a good weep. Cut off the world, buy a bomb shelter and live out 1990 for the rest of your days. The next Trek is still gonna happen exactly as JJ and Orci want it to; you are not, and will not ever be in a position to make the future of the series whatever it is you personally want it to be.

But here's the thing.

To my eyes, TNG was tedious, talky, yammering smug crap 90% of the time, and the series that came after became worse and worse in half-life steps. However, I'm not over in the TNG section bringing up how a 90-pound pipsqueek like Picard was never going to do anything but hide under the table when three Nauusicans wandered into a bar. That's one of my many, many Opinions - opinions being something you treasure - but what would be the point of bringing that up where people think the little old fart can bend steel in his scrawny, gnarled bare hands and change the course of mighty rivers?

Why would I do that?

Maybe I'd be starved for attention - maybe I just wanted to poke at the TNG monkeys through the bars, just to watch'em scream for my jollys. I am, after all, entitled to all my opinions, and equally entitled to piss on the commbadge's cornflakes.

But hey - TNG was their thing. They have their good things, and I have mine - we both have our bad things, too, which we politely ignore in each others presence, and they have helpfully set up special little pens here on TBBS for each show. Some go one place and avoid talking about Spock's Brain, others go to another and avoid talking about the wish-granting space jellyfish. I think the guy with the earthworm stuck in his neck called it "Peaceful Coexistence."

We could all talk about how a new Star Trek raped our childhoods, starting with my generation - I now have seven targets I can cry about, several of which are like shooting dead fish in a barrel. But, after being out in the world and socializing with real, live people for a while, I learned that it's generally bad form to wander into a group of any kind of pro- people just so I can shove my anti- in their faces, because it's my opinion, and I'm allowed to. I'd come off looking like some sort of weird, bitter loudmouthed intolerant and unsocialized douchebag.

So.. that's why I don't.

Why do you?

Dude your a total troll. It is quite clear you can't negate a thing I said. You are left with a word twisting approach with the attempt at trying to look smart. Good luck on that one! Of course you slam TNG but you failed to tell us that they too watched TNG and saw all the movies. My point was not to pro-TNG. So you need to "read" the posts and stop giving us what you "think" instead of what has been said. So if anything sit down and the let the grown up talks.

 

[Peter the Younger]

I'm ...amused? that you guys are still playing punch and judy on this particular topic; at best the whole thing is irrelevant, and at worst, troll bait.

Rupture - I'll tell you a secret: you're right. The entirety of your whole fanboy childhood is wiped off the face of the earth. The Next Generation, with its sissy captain, corporate, boardroom smug solutions, Klingon pimples and xerox-Spock are gone for good, never happened... Kaput. Nobody is going to be manning that gas station over by Bajor, not the playdough guy, not the unmonkey-fied Ferengi bartender, and not Hawk without cojones. And most thankfully of all, that ship full of manniquins called Voyager won't depend on a Borg and a Holographic program to provide the majority of human interest.

So.. whatcha gonna do? Your fussing isn't going to change things one iota; hell, if everybody stood behind you on this board and reinacted the barracade scene from Le Miserables, things still wouldn't change. It is what it is, and it aint gonna change, so there you go. Light a candle - have a good weep. Cut off the world, buy a bomb shelter and live out 1990 for the rest of your days. The next Trek is still gonna happen exactly as JJ and Orci want it to; you are not, and will not ever be in a position to make the future of the series whatever it is you personally want it to be.

But here's the thing.

To my eyes, TNG was tedious, talky, yammering smug crap 90% of the time, and the series that came after became worse and worse in half-life steps. However, I'm not over in the TNG section bringing up how a 90-pound pipsqueek like Picard was never going to do anything but hide under the table when three Nauusicans wandered into a bar. That's one of my many, many Opinions - opinions being something you treasure - but what would be the point of bringing that up where people think the little old fart can bend steel in his scrawny, gnarled bare hands and change the course of mighty rivers?

Why would I do that?

Maybe I'd be starved for attention - maybe I just wanted to poke at the TNG monkeys through the bars, just to watch'em scream for my jollys. I am, after all, entitled to all my opinions, and equally entitled to piss on the commbadge's cornflakes.

But hey - TNG was their thing. They have their good things, and I have mine - we both have our bad things, too, which we politely ignore in each others presence, and they have helpfully set up special little pens here on TBBS for each show. Some go one place and avoid talking about Spock's Brain, others go to another and avoid talking about the wish-granting space jellyfish. I think the guy with the earthworm stuck in his neck called it "Peaceful Coexistence."

We could all talk about how a new Star Trek raped our childhoods, starting with my generation - I now have seven targets I can cry about, several of which are like shooting dead fish in a barrel. But, after being out in the world and socializing with real, live people for a while, I learned that it's generally bad form to wander into a group of any kind of pro- people just so I can shove my anti- in their faces, because it's my opinion, and I'm allowed to. I'd come off looking like some sort of weird, bitter loudmouthed intolerant and unsocialized douchebag.

So.. that's why I don't.

Why do you?

I love you, Perigee.

Squirrel!

 

[The rapture]

The rapture: I was actually attempting to untwist your tormented and faulty argument, but I see now the error of my ways. As I've said in another thread, I can't reason a person out of a position they didn't reason themselves into. Trying to unjerk your knee is essentially futile.

Translation: I can't negate a thing you said so I will try and get off topic with the hopes of not showing my lack of content.

Sigh!

 

[JustKate]

You guys honestly think that if they thought it would make a good movie or whatever, TPTB wouldn't resurrect the old timeline just :: snap :: like that? Or parts of the old timeline? No matter what anybody else has said or not said to the contrary? That they wouldn't come up with some kind of Trekkish explanation that allows them to do anything they want?

The plain fact is that TPTB will use as many or as few of the elements of older Trek as they want to - and that includes alternate universes and parallel universes, those that resemble the old timeline and those that don't.

Just as they've always done with Trek. Always. Well, since 1966, anyway.

So anybody who thinks he has the definitive answer is just kidding himself.

 

[perigee]

Don't get your panties in a twist... cupcake.

I didn't say you were fronting TNG - I said that my negative opinions about TNG were my own and valid for me, but I wasn't going to pester people who liked the show about how crappy I thought it was, just because I had the right to.

You realize reading comprehension is part of your SATs, right? Better work on that... Dude.

 

[AlphaMan]

I have seen on several fan sites the idea that the "prime universe" is not gone and that this is an alternate universe etc. I am sorry but I am not buying that.

I just ran to my DVD collection and checked it out... i'm glad to report that you are wrong. The Prime Universe still exist and can be viewed anytime you want via a new technology called "DVD."