The Official STAR TREK Grading & Discussion Thread [SPOILERS]

[lawman]

This movie was supposed to be the story of the original Enterprise crew coming together. But since it's an alternate reality, at an emotional level the connection with "my" Star Trek was tenuous at best. This was no longer a history I cared about.

I agree. This is admittedly and unavoidably a subjective matter, but the fact that it's an alternate reality—which many defenders seem to be invoking as a reason to like it more—just makes it harder for me to feel any connection to it.

I can enjoy such a thing for the space of a single story—"Mirror Mirror," "Yesterday's Enterprise"—but to say that this variant version is what Trek will be from here on out is another matter.

Does the novel contain more information on why certain aspects of the time line changed? For example, Enterprise not launching until 2258 instead of 2245. Chekov's birth is 4 yrs earlier.

I think any continuity issues should be chalked up to changes the writers wanted. I wouldn't overthink it.

Yeah, that's good advice for pretty much the entire movie.

For me, Star Trek has always been about ideas, character, conflict, and what it means to be human. It was never about war, for me (again for me) Star Trek was a show about peace, and intellectual curiosity.

For me, this movie was about gunfights, and blowing up planets, and anger. Even Spock seemed angry, and bitter, and even kind of mean.

...I didn't see that in this movie. I'm glad people enjoyed it, but I did not. I just didn't. I'm sorry, but it is how I feel.

Hey, you're not alone. (In a minority, yeah, but not alone.)

I can easily enjoy a rip-roaring action adventure film replete with all variety of explosions and battles. However, I prefer the plot to hold together. ... Having the plot make sense or providing the villian with plausible understandable motivations isn't being nitpicky.

...It's entertaining on a superficial level but it has its issues.

I think once all this initial excitement dies down I think you'll start hearing fans altering their tune with regards to the praise that they are currently heaping on it because it is far from perfect and from "excellent".

Absolutely. Even I would agree that it's "entertaining on a superficial level." That's just so much less than I was hoping for.

The Kelvin incident would've changed everything that Starfleet did. They thoroughly got their asses kicked and would need to be better prepared for the dangers of space than they thought they were...

You're making an awful lot of excuses for lazy writing here. You and I both know that the writers' attitude was "after the opening scene, we can make anything we want different without having to explain it." And honestly, this was hardly the first or last time Starfleet lost a ship under mysterious circumstances... so effects that radical seem way out of proportion.

You know lawman, as time passes more and more people seem to be having problems with these glaring errors and I predict as time goes on the gushers will reduce and the criticism will grow until this movie takes its place in Trek history as a pretty average flick with fancy special affects....but a bloody awful script.

I entirely agree. In fact, as a number of posts in this thread indicate (some quoted above), it's already happening for some people.

It's different from what B&B were giving us, and I can understand why people like the novelty of that. It's not bad in the same way that stuff was. It's bad in a whole different way.

 

[ST-One]

And I'd add to that that apparently Earth has no planetary defenses either. Not so much as a missile or an armed shuttle.

Just like TMP.

 

[El Chupacabra]

And I'd add to that that apparently Earth has no planetary defenses either. Not so much as a missile or an armed shuttle.

Just like TMP.

Actually, if iirc there is a line in TMP about V'Ger having taken out Earth planetary defence grid.

 

[Roald]

I'm glad the poll reflects the fact that most people think this was an excellent film. There is always a critical, very vocal minority that kinda make you feel like a retarded loser for liking this film. I loved the film, and perhaps even more important: I LOVED LOVING THE FILM..!
Life can be so good, and watching the film last night made me feel so good..! Coming back here inside the forum and reading allthe nitpicking negativity is kind of a bummer I guess, but on the other hand: it doesn't influence my love for the film at all.

 

[jamestyler]

Coming back here inside the forum and reading allthe nitpicking negativity is kind of a bummer I guess, but on the other hand: it doesn't influence my love for the film at all.

That can be a downer, but for every Jim Steele giving balanced and honest opinions showing that not everyones going to like it, there are a dozen people militantly demanding you hate the film and insulting you if you don't.

One of the reasons I stopped entering this forum until I saw the film on TBBS was due to those types. A lot of people made their mind up already, a lot of people take things too seriously. I just dismiss an opinion if it's backed up with only spite.

 

[ST-One]

And I'd add to that that apparently Earth has no planetary defenses either. Not so much as a missile or an armed shuttle.

Just like TMP.

Actually, if iirc there is a line in TMP about V'Ger having taken out Earth planetary defence grid.

And 'not so much as a missile or an armed shuttle' left functioning?

Remember that Nero is torturing Captain Pike to get the details about Starfleet's defenses?

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Yep, the whole point of taking Pike hostage is to get Earth's defense information from him.

It's a little lame, but it's Star Trek lame.

 

[ConRefit79]

I should just stop thinking about this film. The more I do, the more holes I find. Has anyone discussed the Super Nova plot hole? Super Nova's travel at sublight. So if Romulus was threatened by one from another star system, they would have years to before it reached Romulus. If it is Romulus' star, they're screwed no matter what.
Where does Hollywood get its scientific consultants?

 

[Australis]

Actually, Pike must have given Nero the way through Earth's defences. That was why there was no response. Wasn't as though he had a choice.

I don't have a problem with people not liking the film. As mentioned above, Jim Steele says he doesn't like it and explains why, and that's cool.

It's the others (I name no names) who don't like it and say, either directly or by implication, "and anyone that does is an idiot/traitor/noob (in a perjorative way)/ADHD sufferer". That's what gets my back up, though I try to temper my responses. Because it could so easy go the other way, and that's really stupid, flaming back and forth.

So if you don't like it, that's fine. Just don't think those who do are idiots. Okay?

 

[Trekker4747]

Jim Steele, I think among all those people who disliked the movie, you're the only one who came here to express your opinion but DID NOT engage in a pissing contest like 99.9% of the naysayers. I greatly respect your opinion (always had AAMOF), it's refreshing.

Nobody got upset over my review a few pages back. It think its possible to dislike the movie without getting having to fire shots at people.

Back on topic, I think its really quite refreshing the amount of people who dislike this movie. I was concerned that I was the only one to have had some problems with it, but that other people do, and many of them the same, I feel quite pleased that I am not alone.

Indeed.

There are reviews like yours, and then there's reviews like CRA's which just sing with arrogance and insult.

 

[Garibaldi O'brien]

I should just stop thinking about this film. The more I do, the more holes I find. Has anyone discussed the Super Nova plot hole? Super Nova's travel at sublight. So if Romulus was threatened by one from another star system, they would have years to before it reached Romulus. If it is Romulus' star, they're screwed no matter what.
Where does Hollywood get its scientific consultants?

From a place where you can do the 18-parsec Kessel run in under 12, and a supernova can threaten an entire galaxy of course.

/I just voted excellent for the movie, but I'm giving myself at least 60 days of childhood pleasure before I allow my nitpicking higher-brain to take over.

 

[Bob The Skutter]

Coming back here inside the forum and reading allthe nitpicking negativity is kind of a bummer I guess, but on the other hand: it doesn't influence my love for the film at all.

That can be a downer, but for every Jim Steele giving balanced and honest opinions showing that not everyones going to like it, there are a dozen people militantly demanding you hate the film and insulting you if you don't.

Jim Steele? Balanced? Do those words really belong in the same sentence?

Just kidding, Jim. You know I love ya.

 

[Trek Bob]

Im gonna have to agree strongly with the story line holes in this one. I loved the action, the space scenes, no reset button, etc. but the writers obviously didnt do their homework. If there is one thing that anyone knows about Trek lovers is that we like to research the details of the Trek universe to see if it's "possible".
I agree that you need to excite new, younger viewers into the Trek franchise, but common! What about the loyal old-timers? We made the franchise and this was supposed to be a movie to clear up a lot of our curiosities about the back-story. Instead, we got a completely new story with more holes in it than swiss cheese. I didnt start off wanting to complain about this movie but as I started writing and thinking of the things that I liked and disliked I began to see that there WERE a lot of basic truths from TOS that were simply thrown out in order to make THIS film work to their needs.
It was obvious that Kirk was going to end up the captain, but you DONT make it to captain from cadet. We knew that the crew had to try to save the Earth, but it was no majestic task to shoot down the drill, something that a simple missle couldve done from earth. Finally, does the fact that old Spock come back in time not give Starfleet access to a virtual encyclopedia of knowledge that they have not discovered yet? Hell, he even knows how to go back in time if he wanted to like he did THE VOYAGE HOME. So even if they didnt use the reset button, they definitely left it open to possibility.

 

[El Chupacabra]

Im gonna have to agree strongly with the story line holes in this one. I loved the action, the space scenes, no reset button, etc. but the writers obviously didnt do their homework. If there is one thing that anyone knows about Trek lovers is that we like to research the details of the Trek universe to see if it's "possible".
I agree that you need to excite new, younger viewers into the Trek franchise, but common! What about the loyal old-timers? We made the franchise and this was supposed to be a movie to clear up a lot of our curiosities about the back-story. Instead, we got a completely new story with more holes in it than swiss cheese. I didnt start off wanting to complain about this movie but as I started writing and thinking of the things that I liked and disliked I began to see that there WERE a lot of basic truths from TOS that were simply thrown out in order to make THIS film work to their needs.
It was obvious that Kirk was going to end up the captain, but you DONT make it to captain from cadet. We knew that the crew had to try to save the Earth, but it was no majestic task to shoot down the drill, something that a simple missle couldve done from earth. Finally, does the fact that old Spock come back in time not give Starfleet access to a virtual encyclopedia of knowledge that they have not discovered yet? Hell, he even knows how to go back in time if he wanted to like he did THE VOYAGE HOME. So even if they didnt use the reset button, they definitely left it open to possibility.

Hear, hear!

 

[indranee]

Im gonna have to agree strongly with the story line holes in this one. I loved the action, the space scenes, no reset button, etc. but the writers obviously didnt do their homework. If there is one thing that anyone knows about Trek lovers is that we like to research the details of the Trek universe to see if it's "possible".
I agree that you need to excite new, younger viewers into the Trek franchise, but common! What about the loyal old-timers? We made the franchise and this was supposed to be a movie to clear up a lot of our curiosities about the back-story. Instead, we got a completely new story with more holes in it than swiss cheese. I didnt start off wanting to complain about this movie but as I started writing and thinking of the things that I liked and disliked I began to see that there WERE a lot of basic truths from TOS that were simply thrown out in order to make THIS film work to their needs.
It was obvious that Kirk was going to end up the captain, but you DONT make it to captain from cadet. We knew that the crew had to try to save the Earth, but it was no majestic task to shoot down the drill, something that a simple missle couldve done from earth. Finally, does the fact that old Spock come back in time not give Starfleet access to a virtual encyclopedia of knowledge that they have not discovered yet? Hell, he even knows how to go back in time if he wanted to like he did THE VOYAGE HOME. So even if they didnt use the reset button, they definitely left it open to possibility.

Kirk was NOT a cadet through most of the film.

 

[Jim Steele]

Coming back here inside the forum and reading allthe nitpicking negativity is kind of a bummer I guess, but on the other hand: it doesn't influence my love for the film at all.

That can be a downer, but for every Jim Steele giving balanced and honest opinions showing that not everyones going to like it, there are a dozen people militantly demanding you hate the film and insulting you if you don't.

Jim Steele? Balanced? Do those words really belong in the same sentence?

Just kidding, Jim. You know I love ya.

Is this a good time to point out that I'm posting from a tent in Abrams' garden? Wamdue forgot the fucking kerosene. And pitchforks.

 

[Garak]

Well after seeing it twice now I can safely say that movie was a great time and a pleasure to watch.

Couple of observations:

Karl Urban is simply awesome in this movie, my favorite character by far.

I'm probably going to stalk Zoe Saldana pretty aggressively.

Chris Pine really grew on me in the movie, and by the end I was really enjoying him.

I just loved it when the Enterprise (and other ships) went to warp. Great effects and sound.

Actually the special effects overall were outstanding. I don't know how they can get any better than that.

I enjoyed Eric Bana and his quest of revenge. Destroying Vulcan was simply awesome, and I'm glad that his attempt to destroy earth didn't turn out to be one of those "save it at the last possible second" things. I enjoyed what ended up being his fate and how he was bitter and adamant right to the end.

I thought the Enterprise was awesome, both inside and out. It felt HUGE from the shots inside.

Some surprisingly good humor, I felt that oldTrek humor really fell flat on its face most of the time.

Basically the only problems I had with the movie was that I found Chekov annoying, I didn't like how Kirk just stumbled upon Spock on Delta Viga (sp?) and the ending was wrapped up a bit too cleanly and nicely for me. But in no way did those minor nitpicks get in the way of a stellar time at the movies.

Can't wait for the effing sequel.

 

[Pindar]

Well at page 70 I guess I am late to the party.

I had high hopes for the film and while I enjoyed it - I saw it 3 times with different folk over the weekend - I can't give it more than 7.5 out of 10.

I liked the characters, I liked the emotion of the film but the story was pretty weak.

It was a nice setup to something else.

 

[astrodeb]

I had been looking forward to this movie literally for years, given that I know some of the folks who worked on the film. All I asked was that it be less idiotic than the last Indiana Jones flick. Unfortunately, yesterday I was completely disappointed. Trash on steroids is still trash. I'm sorry that a fine cast was wasted on a badly directed, half-baked story essentially aimed at symbolically (very) deep-sixing intelligent Trek fans. Someone please tell the writers that the chain of command on a military vessel is not the same as choosing players for dodge ball or pickup football. From the first 5 minutes which appeared to be copying the emotional climax of "Deep Impact" (albeit shot in a brewery with a camcorder) to the final hokey exhortation to do what feels right rather than what makes sense, this film was off course. Move over, "Crystal Skull". I left the cinema feeling ill.

 

[Jim Steele]

Well at page 70 I guess I am late to the party.

I had high hopes for the film and while I enjoyed it - I saw it 3 times with different folk over the weekend - I can't give it more than 7.5 out of 10.

I liked the characters, I liked the emotion of the film but the story was pretty weak.

It was a nice setup to something else.

You didn't perchance fire up to Cineworld on saturday only to discover that the whole complex was closed due to "technical issues"? What the hell was that about?

"Cineworld has decided to close for fear of possible fanboy backlash"