ST09 USS Enterprise vs ISS Enterprise

[Richard Baker]

The trouble with reverse engineering is that you need a tech base close to what you are duplicating. Imagine sending a small pocket calculator to 1955. They could use it and replace the batteries, but when they opened it up the integrated circuits would just be a magic black squares. Doc Brown is on vacation.
Send the same device to 1970 and they would recognize the parts but still could not reverse engineer the actual chip but could match it's function with equivalants.
Send it to 1990 and they could tear it apart and reverse engineer the ICs, though it would be a while before they could develop the means to manufacture them to that degree of scale.
I do not think the Defiant could be duplicated but it could provide engineering insites which tould greatly advance the current designs. In theroy the Consitution class TOS ships could make replacement parts, but not enough to actually build a second vessel. The Defiant would be best served as an engineering guide but used as an ultimate weapon. The library computers could provide tech data for a new industrial base for components for future ships but it would be a while before they could be built IMO.

 

[Augustus]

That's why I voted for ISS Enterprise. The sheer duplicity will carry them to victory.

Only in a The Wrath of Khan-style ambush, never in a classic broadside-against-broadside slugfest... just remember the nuEnterprise's swift reactions after entering the debris field over Vulcan!

P.S.
We should also issue a joint statement that this thread is simply for the fun of it and that we are not in any way affiliated with the likes of The Simpsons' Comic Book Guy!

Actually I think the crew of the ISS would lose on purpose allow themselves to get captured to get on the nuEnterprise and then beat the crap out of the crew with their duplicity and double crossing ways..

 

[section9]

I always assumed the Empress's reign would have been a rather short one, and the Defiant's life in the mirror universe rather short as well. Too many people fighting over it to live very long.

I disagree. Mirror Hoshi was always clever enough to dispose of those opponents in her way. She would have held on to Defiant and disposed of the present Imperial leadership which was, at that point, losing the insurgency to the Rebel Alliance. In that timeline, it was the presence of the Defiant, and, apparently, Sato's coopting of the the Rebels, that brought peace to the Empire. She gave them a stake in her rule by getting rid of the corruption of the previous regime and, in general, leaving their worlds alone while letting each planet's ruling class share in the spoils. Divide and rule.

Behind her rule was the mailed fist: Defiant.

 

[section9]

The trouble with reverse engineering is that you need a tech base close to what you are duplicating. Imagine sending a small pocket calculator to 1955. They could use it and replace the batteries, but when they opened it up the integrated circuits would just be a magic black squares. Doc Brown is on vacation.
Send the same device to 1970 and they would recognize the parts but still could not reverse engineer the actual chip but could match it's function with equivalants.
Send it to 1990 and they could tear it apart and reverse engineer the ICs, though it would be a while before they could develop the means to manufacture them to that degree of scale.
I do not think the Defiant could be duplicated but it could provide engineering insites which tould greatly advance the current designs. In theroy the Consitution class TOS ships could make replacement parts, but not enough to actually build a second vessel. The Defiant would be best served as an engineering guide but used as an ultimate weapon. The library computers could provide tech data for a new industrial base for components for future ships but it would be a while before they could be built IMO.

My point was the Empress Sato would have proceeded as you suggest, allowing the Imperial Starfleet to download the Library Computer to improve Stardrive, Weapons, food replication, life support, and general ship design and construction. This would have been a process of several decades, or less for a militaristic society like the Empire.

 

[Praetor]

And yet the mirror 1701 looked more or less just like her counterpart - in fact, less advanced, since she looked like the pilot version of the Enterprise. Engine performance or weapons power may have been greater, but there was no great revolution of appearance that one might have expected.

I'd argue that if they reverse-engineered the Defiant as you suggest that the 2260s mirror Enterprise would have appeared more advanced, therefore, Sato's reign lasting a long time or not, the Defiant didn't make much of an alternate 'ripple.'

Alternatively, perhaps the technology of the Terran Empire stagnated or began to stagnate soon after the period we saw in 'IaMD' if there was no Romulan War or no Federation and ensuing cooperation. The Defiant's advanced tech might have served as a boost to get the Terran Empire technological level caught up on a relative par with our universe.

 

[Richard Baker]

If they just imitated/copied the hardware without the environment which created it then all they would have would be static. Federation science and technology came from the minds of many different cultures and evolved through cooperation. Taking the fruits of those labors without the thought progress with brought it to that point- it would be difficult to take that same tech and evolve it into the next level (Refit-Movie era).

 

[USS Triumphant]

If they just imitated/copied the hardware without the environment which created it then all they would have would be static.

Which they could have done, despite what would ordinarily be an excellent argument in your earlier post. They may not have had them small enough to be in wall consoles all over ships, but if you have transporter technology, you have replicators.

But that wouldn't have helped them get beyond that tech. In fact, it might act as a crutch that would impede further development.

BTW, are you this Richard Baker? And whether you are or not, welcome to the board.

 

[Praetor]

Richard, Triumphant, taken collectively that was actually more or less my point a couple posts back.

 

[Richard Baker]

this Richard Baker[/url]? And whether you are or not, welcome to the board.

I wish I was- it was a shock to find those in my local bookstore. My name also shows up in some Monty Python skits and books.

www.TheShipyards.net


.

 

[Lyon_Wonder]

The trouble with reverse engineering is that you need a tech base close to what you are duplicating. Imagine sending a small pocket calculator to 1955. They could use it and replace the batteries, but when they opened it up the integrated circuits would just be a magic black squares. Doc Brown is on vacation.
Send the same device to 1970 and they would recognize the parts but still could not reverse engineer the actual chip but could match it's function with equivalants.
Send it to 1990 and they could tear it apart and reverse engineer the ICs, though it would be a while before they could develop the means to manufacture them to that degree of scale.
I do not think the Defiant could be duplicated but it could provide engineering insites which tould greatly advance the current designs. In theroy the Consitution class TOS ships could make replacement parts, but not enough to actually build a second vessel. The Defiant would be best served as an engineering guide but used as an ultimate weapon. The library computers could provide tech data for a new industrial base for components for future ships but it would be a while before they could be built IMO.

The Trek XI/alternate timeline Enterprise might be the result of reverse-engineered TNG-era technology too, though I haven’t read any spoilers and don’t intend to until after I see the film in May.

 

[Klingon Empire]

Perhaps I should change my vote. I think, despite my vote, the NuEterprise is too cool not to win against the ISS.

 

[Richard Baker]

Unless the ISS 'cheat' by beaming armed photorps into Engineering...

.

 

[DaveyNY]

Unless the ISS 'chest' by beaming armed photorps into Engineering...

If they beam Uhura or Hoshi's 'Chest' in, they'll win by at least a Nipple...


...if they beam both sets in..., they'll win with Two Pair...

​

 

[chardman]

Excuse me, but this is about the hundredth post I've seen referring to Abram's Star Trek movie as Star Trek 9, and it's driving me batty.

Are those of you who call it that from countries that count different? Or from somewhere where two of the films were banned and never shown? Or just confused by Roman Numerals? Because ST09 was "Insurrection, while this new Trek film is "Star Trek XI", the eleventh Star Trek Film.

Rant over.

 

[DaveyNY]

Excuse me, but this is about the hundredth post I've seen referring to Abram's Star Trek movie as Star Trek 9, and it's driving me batty.

Are those of you who call it that from countries that count different? Or from somewhere where two of the films were banned and never shown? Or just confused by Roman Numerals? Because "Star Trek XI" is the eleventh Star Trek Film.

Rant over.

If you're not being sarcastic...

... they are referencing it by the year... as in ...Trek '09..., not the numerical order.

 

[Richard Baker]

Stupid typo (above) fixed.


Aside from most people having problems with Roman Numerals *except when it comes to the superbowl) I always get confused as to how many movies there were since they stopped numbering them with TNG ones.

 

[chardman]

[emilylatilla]Oh, well that's completely different. Nevermind.[/emilylatilla]

 

[DaveyNY]

Stupid typo (above) fixed.


Aside from most people having problems with Roman Numerals *except when it comes to the super bowl) I always get confused as to how many movies there were since they stopped numbering them with TNG ones.

Not stupid... just unintentionally creative...

And funny as Hell...

Some Folks around here stopped counting, Period... at about the same time.

 

[Richard Baker]

Well I do try to keep abreast of things...

 

[Sector 7]

I voted for ST09, because it is totally rad, gnarly and just plain badass! (and any other fanboy euphemisms I may have missed)
As for the ST09 designation: "Young minds, fresh ideas. Be patient." -James T. Kirk