Trying to find more examples of Roddenberry's thinking

[Captain Martin]

I was watching TNG today on TV and I've realized since I was a little kid that the show used futuristic scenarios to "deal" with today's problems like racism, sexism, etc and I always liked that.

I remember Majel Barret saying in an interview that back when TOS was being aired, roddenberry thought racism was silly so he made a silly episode where there was a planet with two races ... one side white one side black and the other was opposite sides ... and they fought each other to extinction.

That being said ... TNG was what I grew up watching. and it seems to me like roddenberry took many opportunities to fly in the face of society's old thinking ... let the blind guy fly the ship.. make the black guy best friends with the whitest guy you ever saw.. have the chief of security a female, etc ..

I want to see how many more examples of this there are through the show .. I think it is interesting.

 

[Praetor]

Read the TMP novelization. Gene had some rather unconventional ideas about sex and nudity too.

 

[sbk1234]

It was one of the worst executed episodes ever shot on TV, but the episode, Symbiosis comes to mind.
Also, the episode with the androdgonys race that Riker likes. Although, I think that particular one came after Roddenbery finished his heavy involvement with the show. He might have even passed away by then.

 

[Praetor]

Yeah, Roddenberry was passed by the time of 'The Outcast' I believe.

 

[WendellM]

First season's "The Arsenal of Freedom" seems to address the dangers of letting a society's military-industrial complex get out of hand.

 

[Captain Martin]

First season's "The Arsenal of Freedom" seems to address the dangers of letting a society's military-industrial complex get out of hand.

Yea good example ... I always liked that one .. the slimey sales guy was brilliant lol

 

[Captain Martin]

Season one .. Episode called Justice ... where westley is set to be executed. Was this Gene's way of saying the death penalty is too harsh?

Season One ... Haven .. Arranged marriages ... Gene apparently disagrees?

S1 Angel One .. Gene saying that women can/should be in authority?

S1 - Symbiosis ... Gene maybe talking about how the pharmaceutical industry has a tight hold on everybody?

Thats just season one ... any thoughts on these?

 

[WendellM]

Season one .. Episode called Justice ... where westley is set to be executed. Was this Gene's way of saying the death penalty is too harsh?

That ep was confusing to me in terms of morality. Unrestrained sex? OK! (which seems very Roddenberry, BTW ) Crush a flower? Death! Picard extolls the Prime Directive, then beams Wesley up to escape. And then there was the whole God/ship angle. It seemed a muddle to me, but maybe someone else can make full sense out of it.

However, yes, I think that perhaps buried somewhere in that muddle was an attempt to denounce the death penalty, the overly strict enforcement of any law, plus something about the separation of church and state. But it was a mish-mash to me.

Haven .. Arranged marriages ... Gene apparently disagrees?

Sounds like a reasonable interpretation. When I first encountered that concept in college (taking a sociology course on India), I found arranged marriage repugnant. Much later, though, it made a kind of sense given the Hindu view of life (where love is ideally universal, rather than just between individuals).

S1 Angel One .. Gene saying that women can/should be in authority?

I viewed that one as more a denouncement of any kind of sexism, whether male-superior or female-superior.

S1 - Symbiosis ... Gene maybe talking about how the pharmaceutical industry has a tight hold on everybody?

Yes, it seemed an anti-drug ep to be sure, and especially one against (over-)prescribed legal ones where the "demand" is artificially created.

Thats just season one ... any thoughts on these?

I'm not sure how far Gene Roddenberry was involved in the scripts of TNG. He seemed very involved in the first two seasons of TOS, especially with the first, but, from what I've read, he was fairly detached from the third (which had "Let That Be Your Last Battlefield"). However, I think that first season of TNG would be the one to feel his presence the most for that series.

 

[TS-1838-SWATH]

I'm not sure how far Gene Roddenberry was involved in the scripts of TNG. He seemed very involved in the first two seasons of TOS, especially with the first, but, from what I've read, he was fairly detached from the third (which had "Let That Be Your Last Battlefield"). However, I think that first season of TNG would be the one to feel his presence the most for that series.

Gene IIRC was 100% in control T.N.G. Year #1 part of the reason Rick was put there was to keep GR from going overboard, Rick was the suit of the production team at the start. Year #2 Rick started to Reel GR in but it was still GR's SHOW Year #3 Michael Piller became head of the Writing Staff GR's power really started to go down then. GR's Health started to nose-dive in 1989 in so sometime in 1990 he was not much of a force in trek BUT Rick B. and Michael Piller still had to get approval for ST: DS9 from GR.

I would guess that after that GR's was a spent force in trek,
Gene died 19 Oct 1991
The episode Unification Part 1 has at its start For Gene Roddenberry
Unification Part 1 -4 NOV 1991
Unification Part 2 -11 NOV 1991

 

[Captain Martin]

I viewed that one as more a denouncement of any kind of sexism, whether male-superior or female-superior.

Sorry I sort of actually meant to say that ... just worded badly.

 

[Captain Martin]

Gene died 19 Oct 1991

Creepy ... he died on my birthday

 

[FordSVT]

S1 Angel One .. Gene saying that women can/should be in authority?

I think that was just an opportunity to look at our society from another POV, not an advocation of a female dominated society.

If anything that episode shone light on the fact that both males and females should enjoy leadership equally. It was very TOS, in fact, it wouldn't have been out of place as an original episode with the very masculine Kirk (instead of Riker) dealing with a female dominated society.

 

[JustKate]

Angel One was such a terrrrrrrrrible episode - awful to watch, just awful. (Nothing wrong with the idea of a matriarchal society per se, but it didn't have to be so ridiculous and clumsy.) But now that you mention it, and I expect you didn't mean it in this way, Ford, it does capture that slightly cheesy feeling of some of the weaker TOS episodes.

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

I remember Majel Barret saying in an interview that back when TOS was being aired, roddenberry thought racism was silly so he made a silly episode where there was a planet with two races ... one side white one side black and the other was opposite sides ... and they fought each other to extinction.

I've heard this before; crediting GR with a lot of what went into "Let That Be Your Last Battlefield." However, like with many things in TOS, GR wasn't the originator.

The episode was, actually, conceived by Gene Coon under his pseudonym of Lee Cronin. Moreover, it was filmed during the third season when GR bailed out of the daily production of the series, sensing its impending cancellation. Fred Friedberger was in charge that season.

The black on one side and white on one side was the brainchild of the episode's director, Jud Taylor. Originally, the separation was to be at the waist.

See:http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Let_That_Be_Your_Last_Battlefield_(episode)

 

[Sky]

The black on one side and white on one side was the brainchild of the episode's director, Jud Taylor. Originally, the separation was to be at the waist.

Seriously?
How would they have filmed that? A black guy with a white arse vs. a white guy with a black arse?

 

[Ryan Thomas Riddle]

The black on one side and white on one side was the brainchild of the episode's director, Jud Taylor. Originally, the separation was to be at the waist.

Seriously?
How would they have filmed that? A black guy with a white arse vs. a white guy with a black arse?

Probably with costuming. Black pants, white tunic. White pants, black tunic.

 

[The Badger]

Angel One was such a terrrrrrrrrible episode - awful to watch, just awful. (Nothing wrong with the idea of a matriarchal society per se, but it didn't have to be so ridiculous and clumsy.) But now that you mention it, and I expect you didn't mean it in this way, Ford, it does capture that slightly cheesy feeling of some of the weaker TOS episodes.

Have you seen Wil Wheaton's review of this episode for TV Squad? Worth a look, but NSFW.
http://www.tvsquad.com/2008/03/28/star-trek-the-next-generation-angel-one/

 

[FordSVT]

Angel One was such a terrrrrrrrrible episode - awful to watch, just awful. (Nothing wrong with the idea of a matriarchal society per se, but it didn't have to be so ridiculous and clumsy.) But now that you mention it, and I expect you didn't mean it in this way, Ford, it does capture that slightly cheesy feeling of some of the weaker TOS episodes.

Well, sort of actually, yeah.

I actually don't mind Gene beating me over the head with an idea.

 

[TS-1838-SWATH]

Gene died 19 Oct 1991

Creepy ... he died on my birthday

Here's More Creepy:
The day that the T.N.G. cast was told of Gene's death was 10 years to the day that Marina Sirtis Father DIED !

 

[trevanian]

The episode was, actually, conceived by Gene Coon under his pseudonym of Lee Cronin. Moreover, it was filmed during the third season when GR bailed out of the daily production of the series, sensing its impending cancellation. Fred Friedberger was in charge that season.

The black on one side and white on one side was the brainchild of the episode's director, Jud Taylor. Originally, the separation was to be at the waist.

See:http://memory-alpha.org/en/wiki/Let_That_Be_Your_Last_Battlefield_(episode)

didn't see anything at the link, but Coon's take had it as two guys who lookeed like angels and devils, and that version got killed while he was still a producer, 1st or 2nd season. It just got dusted off and sprayed with a new varnish in yr3.

EDIT ADDON: Hard to tell on GR thinking with TNG, since lots of that stuff was other writers with stuff he messed up (like JUSTICE.) He was still causing trouble during season 4, because my pitch session with Piller got bumped over to Jeri Taylor because GR was having a hissy fit about what turned out to be REDEMPTION pt 1 and Piller had to go placate him.