Season 2 is Underappreciated

[Too Much Fun]

I don't think Verad was forgotton so much as he wasn't necessary. After all, Verad was only in the body for a couple of hours. There isn't a lot Jadzia needed to learn about him to better understand herself. Joran was a Dax for several months, wasn't he? And I think "Invasive Procedures" deserves a lot of credit. Since I missed the Circle Trilogy, it was the first season 2 episode I saw, and it immediately got me interested in the show again after season 1 left me wondering if I should bother continuing with it.

 

[MyCylon]

I think S2 is a very strong season and probably often underrated compared to other seasons of Trek. I also think it's easily the strongest of the first three seasons. I think it's far more consistent than seasons 1 or 3.

However, for me, personally, S2 (just like 1 or 3) doesn't hold a candle to seasons 4 - 7. I've always felt and still do that the show really went through the roof come S4 and just kept soaring after that.

Still, I like every season of DS9 very much.

 

[tomalak301]

Necessary Evil (*****) out of 5 stars

If you're an Odo/Kira fan, than this might be the ultimate episode of the series. It's definitely one of the best. I love the whole Noir style (Something I wish would return) and this episode did it beautifully. From the atmosphere of Terok Nor, to the tone and attitude of the show, this episode so far is the best of the season. I just love what this did to the Kira/Odo relationship, (Than reversed itself in Things Past, another favorite underrated gem of mine) but the whole murder mystery thing was well told. What really struck me this time around though was the issue of trust and when Odo said "You're a much better lier than I gave you credit for." You'd think Odo was so perfect and then you get to this episode and the person who he trusts the most is the one that's been keeping the whole case hidden for 5 years. Really really cool storytelling.

 

[ALF]

Sorry to disagree, tomalak301, but having watched much of DS9 S2 recently I have come to the conclusion that it is almost unwatchable.
Sleepers like Sanctuary, Rivals, Shadowplay, Tribunal, Playing God. The Trill and Bajoran political episodes are the worst for me.

Profit and Loss was all right. Whispers and Blood Oath were cool and I like the Jem'Hedar introduction but otherwise those are some DVDs that gather dust.

 

[Seven of Five]

Necessary Evil (*****) out of 5 stars

If you're an Odo/Kira fan...

I suppose that why it's one of my faves. Odo and Kira are two of my favourite ever Trek characters really. Their friendship that would eventually blossom was one of my favourite relationships, especially when it was tested in episodes like this. Odo finding out Kira was the one he was originally looking for back then was a test to their friendship, and I *loved* the ending between them.

billcosby, I agree that season 2 had a few clunkers here and there. 'Melora,' 'Profit and Loss,' 'Shadowplay,' 'Playing God' and 'Rivals' were ones that were a bit average, or at least IMO. I just felt season 2 was a lot more consistent than 1, 3 or even 4. Season 4 is almost as good, perhaps the Klingon-heavy aspect feels a bit wrong in retrospect as it took away from the Bajoran and building Dominion stories. I agree with people that seasons 5-7 are all a good step ahead of the rest.

 

[tomalak301]

Sorry to disagree, tomalak301, but having watched much of DS9 S2 recently I have come to the conclusion that it is almost unwatchable.
Sleepers like Sanctuary, Rivals, Shadowplay, Tribunal, Playing God. The Trill and Bajoran political episodes are the worst for me.

Profit and Loss was all right. Whispers and Blood Oath were cool and I like the Jem'Hedar introduction but otherwise those are some DVDs that gather dust.

That's something I liked about the series though. I found the Bajoran/Cardassian politic stuff to be very interesting and like I said, it fleshed out the universe a whole lot more. As for the episodes you mentioned, I can't agree with you about Tribunal (That episode was great), Shadowplay, or Playing God. Never understood the distaste for Rivals, but I could take it or leave that one. Sanctuary I do agree is the worst of the season.

 

[tomalak301]

I'm going to just forget about the stars. They're an unnecessary hinderence to episodes that aired more than 14 years ago.

Second Sight

Of the two I saw tonight, this one was the better of the two. The Professor was wild, it was nice to have the show set on a ship for once, and I really liked the beginning scene with Sisko reflecting on Jennifer with Jake. As for the rest. I'm not really a fan of the one off romantic episodes (A Perfect Mate from TNG being an exception because it starred Dr. Jean Gray of course ), so this one didn't do much for me. Still, some good moments sputtered in the mediocrity.

Sanctuary

I don't care if this episode mentions the Dominion or not, I consider it the worst episode of the season. In fact, I'd probably put it in my bottom five with episodes like Profit and Lace, Valient, and The Muse. There were some good bits, like Jake and Nog, and Odo always rocks, but none of it had anything to do with the Skreans or whatever you call them. In fact, I consider them one of the most poorly concieved alien races in all of Trek. And thier leader, who came across as a total bitch was annoying as hell. Put her and the chick from Paradise in the same room and see what happens. I'm sure sparks would fly. Thankfully this episode is really the only one I absolutely hate from this season so more Season 2 love will be coming.

 

[Too Much Fun]

Sorry to disagree, tomalak301, but having watched much of DS9 S2 recently I have come to the conclusion that it is almost unwatchable.
Sleepers like Sanctuary, Rivals, Shadowplay, Tribunal, Playing God. The Trill and Bajoran political episodes are the worst for me.

Profit and Loss was all right. Whispers and Blood Oath were cool and I like the Jem'Hedar introduction but otherwise those are some DVDs that gather dust.

That's something I liked about the series though. I found the Bajoran/Cardassian politic stuff to be very interesting and like I said, it fleshed out the universe a whole lot more.

I'm on B.C.'s side with this issue, I do like a lot of Season 2 (particularly Whispers and Blood Oath), but for me the worst parts of it (and some of the worst of the series in general) were those episodes about Bajoran politics and the battle for power between the lady played by Louise Fletcher and the various men who Kira had sex with. I thought her relationships with different Bajorn political figures were all shallow and poorly developed (I really didn't understand why any of them happened, aside from physical attraction, which made Kira look like a slut who would just have sex with anyone in a position of power) and could not be brought to give a damn at all about any of the inner workings of that planet's society.

I really don't understand all the love for DS9's exploration of Bajoran and Cardassian cultures on this board. They were a very minor part of TNG lore and I thought they should have stayed that way. Fleshing them out in DS9 tended to get the show bogged down in a lot of pseudo-political nonsense. I hated it when episodes were trapped in the relentlessly dull machinations of their governments wasting time that should be spent on more interesting stories and character interactions.

 

[tomalak301]

I don't think it was the political stuff that I liked but more just fleshing out the universe. One of the themes in DS9 was stated in an episode coming up later on in this season: "It's easy to be a saint in paradise." We get to see more inner workings on how alien cultures work, something that was lacking in other trek shows but DS9 did it so well. I love that intrigue, such as the whole TNG/DS9 Maquis story arc, or just setting up the dominion, but just expanding the universe to make it feel real and something I want to see was the season's biggest strength.

As for Kira, didn't she only be romantically involved with Beriel and Shakarr? I agree, the one with Shakkar didn't work, but I didn't mind the stuff with Beriel that much.

 

[ALF]

Sometimes there's just too much chatter. You're listening to O'Brien drone one in the second or third act about technobabble or Kira explaining some fundamental prophecy and it just suddenly dawns on you... this is a science fiction show. When's the action/excitement going to start?? The entire episode shouldn't be 85% exposition.

Luckily season three starts off strong and continues throughout. So I don't know... S2 might be good if you enjoy the slower pace. Trek doesn't always have to be breakneck speed.

 

[Too Much Fun]

Sometimes there's just too much chatter. You're listening to O'Brien drone one in the second or third act about technobabble or Kira explaining some fundamental prophecy and it just suddenly dawns on you... this is a science fiction show. When's the action/excitement going to start?? The entire episode shouldn't be 85% exposition.

My point exactly. Well said, Cos.

 

[tomalak301]

Actions have to mean something though. One of my problems with Enterprise and to a lesser extent voyager, is it seemed like there was too much action at the expense of something more meaningful to the story. I like both just fine, just as long as it doesn't feel like a waste. Not saying DS9 did this because of course it didn't, but you can't just have action to serve the stories purpose. It needs build-up.

 

[Robotech Master]

I love season 2!!

This was the season when all the other characters started to really gel (Kira was already kickin' ass in the first season).

And we started to get away from the TNG feel of the first season and really get into the meat of DS9.

I would say that it is actually better than season 3, which seemed to have some really pointless episodes. My breakdown-

BEST EPISODES:

The Homecoming/The Circle/The Siege, Cardassians, Necessary Evil, Whispers, Paradise, Blood Oath, The Maquis I/II, The Wire, Crossover, Tribunal, The Jem'Hadar

DECENT EPISODES:

Invasive Procedures, Second Sight, The Alternate, Shadowplay, Armageddon Game, Sanctuary, Playing God, The Collaborator

WORST EPISODES:

Melora, Rules Of Acquisition, Rivals, Profit And Loss


22/26 is not bad for an average season of modern day Trek.

 

[tomalak301]

Rivals

I don't understand why this episode is so maligned. I kinda liked it, even though I found Martus to be kind of annoying. The whole probability affecting the station plot left a lot to be desired, but the rival competition between him and Quark was a pretty good story. Also liked the subplot with Obrian and Bashier.

This episode kind of reminded me of today though. Martus scamming the couple? Kind of like Bernie Madoff and the poncy scheme. The girl closing down shop? tough economic times. Maybe I'm reaching saying this episode was timely, but it sure feels like it.

 

[TheGodBen]

I've never understood why Rivals is so hated either. It isn't a good episode, but it certainly isn't at the levels of The Muse or Let He Who is With Sin. And I really liked the rivalry between Bashir and O'Brien, especially knowing the love that those two eventually develop for one another.

 

[Robotech Master]

For me, it was just dull.

There wasn't a single moment of interest in the episode.

Utterly pointless. It didn't even have a significant B-plot.

Though I agree that at least it wasn't embarrassing like The Muse, Ferengi Love Songs, or Let He Who Is Without Sin...

But I still skip it when I go through the series.

 

[Robotech Master]

Rules of Acquisition is a difficult episode for me to judge.

It is definitely significant as the first mention of the Dominion and the idea of the Ferengi trying to open trade negotiations with the Dominion could have been fascinating in and of itself.

I just don't care for the stereotypical portrayal of Ferengi women. It isn't funny or enlightening, and it is slightly offensive.

If this had been the only episode to deal with the subject I might look upon it more favorably. But it was just the start of a series of annoying episodes. It was the weakest mini-arc in the series, imo.

 

[tomalak301]

First off, interesting title for the forums this year. Takes some time to understand it and I'm about ready to call it an evening, but at least I noticed.

Anyway:

The Alternate

I like this episode, but I wonder if it suffered from multiple personality disorder. I mean the episode starts out as this great mystery and possibly finding answers to Odo's origins, and we are introduced to Odo's "father", but then it turns into Odo being the monster of doom. Ok, fine, but it left some of this episode with unanswered questions that will never be brought up again, such as what was that Piller. Also, one thing I was thinking about this episode that I didn't consider in the past was why wasn't the Key Odo got in "The Vortex" brought back. Maybe Mora can study it and maybe it was a connection to the piller. We'll never know, and it's probably not important in the first place, but it does lead to some curious observation.

Anyway, like I said, I like this episode. It's great watching Rene and Sloyan (Who is my favorite Star Trek guest actor next to Tony Todd and Andreas Aatsulas) be together and the whole thing with chasing Odo himself was kinda interesting. It's fun in these early episodes where Odo is still a mystery and it makes the twist with the Founders being Odo's people all that more gratifying I think.

 

[tomalak301]

Armageddon Game

I love episodes dealing with Obrien and Bashir's relationship, and this episode probably explored it better than any other episode of the series (It's late so I can't think of the other ones except for The Storyteller). I didn't really like the Kaiko bits or the motives of the two alien worlds (Wouldn't they need to self-destruct thier ship to fully wipe away the memory of the harvesters, leading to an investigation and probably more questions on what was going on? It just seemed to open too many can of worms) but I loved the stuff with Obrien and Bashir. Also, the sequence at the end with the remote controlled runabout was pretty good too. Still, not the best of the season but decent.

 

[tomalak301]

Whispers

This episode always has me worried that every time I watch it, it loses it's quality because it's built on the fact that it works awesome the first time but then it's no longer a surprise when you get to the revelation, kinda like The Sixth Sense or something a little more closer to Trek, TNG's "Clues."

That's not the case with Whispers. Maybe it's the fact that I haven't seen this episode in quite a while, or it's just that well written because this is one of Season 2's best episodes, right up there with the Circle Trilogy, Cardassians and Necessary Evil. I just love that we saw everything from Obrien's point of view. It makes the revelation at the end all that more powerful because we just don't see it coming.

OT: I can't get this damn Gay Fish song out of my head.