Building top of the line ISA computer....need help...

[ZeNd]

Going to build a computer that runs 6.22/3.11 and I want to know what the best possible hardware I can get that has at least 2 ISA slows (one for video card and sound card). So what is the best possible hardware I can get? Here are some of my thoughts, feel free to add your input. Both my sound card and video card need to be compatible and have good driver support for Windows 3.11.

Motherboard: ??? - No idea what the top of the line MB was back then, want to find one that supports at least 64MB
Sound Card: Sound Blaster AWE32
Video Card: Matrox - not sure which model but wasnt this the top of the line company for video cards back then?
Processor - Maybe a PII?

 

[Alpha_Geek]

Well good luck with that... I don't think any current mainstream PC designs have ISA slots.

You *might* be able to find some not quite ancient PICMG hardware on ebay that'll support ISA slots, but don't expect much technology past an Intel 440BX chipset.

PICMG was the last bastion of ISA. It was used extensively in applications that relied on lots of specialized ISA cards, applications like voice mail systems, data aquisition, process control, etc.

PICMG designs have a passive backplane that the power connector hooks to, has ISA slots on one side, PCI slots on the other side, and between them, a special slot that has an ISA slot, and just ahead of it, a PCI slot. The components that usually are on a motherboard were on a CPU card that would go into this slot.

Note that most PICMG CPU cards have embedded video, usually something like ATI Rage or Rage Pro. Those can be turned off.

Backplanes come in many configurations, some of which require a special congig of the standoffs and card Slot backplane openings. There are some full size AT and Baby AT designs though. Make sure your case will accomodate the backplane you select.

Hope this information helps.

 

[USS KG5]

You are best off looking for a PC of that vintage at fairs or on Ebay I'd have thought.

 

[sojourner]

Is this being built for a museum?

 

[USS KG5]

I'm guessing to run some very old hardware that requires ISA for something business critical and the boss wont put his hand in his pocket.

 

[Santaman]

Best thing I can suggest is to find a Pentium II/III machine which has ISA busses plenty, as for a graphics card, get a S3 Virge, there are drivers for 3.11 for the Virge, they can be found online.

Sound card, Creative labs SB 16 drivers for 3.11 are available online.

As for a LAN card, try an older model 3Com card, also the good old Realtek 8019AS LAN cards has 3.11 drivers.

RAM and the like are no problem to find for these machines and they do handle 128 and more MB RAM.

 

[Jadzia]

Motherboard: ??? - No idea what the top of the line MB was back then, want to find one that supports at least 64MB
Sound Card: Sound Blaster AWE32
Video Card: Matrox - not sure which model but wasnt this the top of the line company for video cards back then?
Processor - Maybe a PII?

Never been a fan of 3.11.. In fact I hated it.

You could use modern motherboards, as I'm sure 3.11 works fine with PCI.
It was all about those intel chipsets back then, wasn't it: BX vs TX vs VX vs FX iirc.

But for something of that age... A dual processor Pentium Pro system? Matrox Millennium G400?

My first PC was a 200MHz cyrix system, but I did install 3.11 on it once, and both sound and video (both PCI) worked fine, and incredibly smoothy. It had 2 ISA + 4 PCI slots. 2 ram slots for EDO/FPM + 1 dram slot for a simm. (I can't remember if it was 64 or 256MB top, because I took it upto 64, but I'm sure it wasn't maxed out.) Also with an onboard cpu cache ram expander slot. Graphics was 2MB S3 Verge. Sound a standard SB card. A 3GB seagate hard drive, plus a 16x4 cd writer... But I'm sure I have a spare ISA sound card in my loft... Yes I'm sure I do, an "Audio-Excel".

I don't understand what this system for, but good luck with it

 

[Alpha_Geek]

Jadzia, yeah, but the OP specifically stated that ISA was a requirement. That being the case, the most recent hardware to be built would be PICMG standard hardware, as the embedded PC market was the last to migrate from ISA card slots.

Processors I've seen on PICMG processor cards include Slot 1, Socket 70, and Socket 370, so that includes some members of Pentium, Pentium II, Pentium III, and (de)Celeron.

Get an 8 slot backplane and a processor card and that'll fit most baby AT format cases nicely. Just make sure that the case allows a full length card where the processor card whould be.

I recommend socket 70 or 370, as the PII cards are ungainly due to the big CPU package.

AG

 

[Jadzia]

Jadzia, yeah, but the OP specifically stated that ISA was a requirement.

It doesn't read that way to me

He wants 2x ISA only for the not-yet-owned ISA sound and graphics cards, believing these to be necessary for 3.11 compatibility. I believe OP is more interested in A/V compatibility, not specifically ISA.

But now he has both of our advices, so he can decide for himself what he means.

 

[Alpha_Geek]

Vaild point, Jadzia. 2 slots and he mentions specific uses for them.

Any video, even embedded will probably work fine as most have VESA compliant modes. Automatic detection may be an issue depending on the software, and 3.11 drivers may be interesting. OP, make sure you find a copy of Trumpet Winsock!

A PCI soundcard may be more problematic when it comes to SB emulation. IIRC, many of them didn't do a very good job of emulation or resource management. I think a *real* ISA card is best for legacy stuff here.

OP, mind sharing with us what your application is? More insight may lead us to give different advice than previously posted.

Thanks!

AG

 

[Marc]

Jadzia, yeah, but the OP specifically stated that ISA was a requirement.

It doesn't read that way to me

He wants 2x ISA only for the not-yet-owned ISA sound and graphics cards, believing these to be necessary for 3.11 compatibility. I believe OP is more interested in A/V compatibility, not specifically ISA.

But now he has both of our advices, so he can decide for himself what he means.

Does Windows 3.11 actually support PCI though? Looking at the wiki entry, PCI 2.1 came out in 1995 so around the time Windows 95 came out.

trying to think back around that time I was still selling and supporting systems that were ISA/VLB with PCI really starting to coming along with the advent of the Pentium processors.

 

[Santaman]

3.11 hasn't got any issues with PCI or AGP or PCIE for that matter, the problem is that you won't find a driver for a Nvidia 8800 card so easily... as for ISA graphic cards, if you need VGA then I advice a Trident 8900 card or the like...

 

[Marc]

3.11 hasn't got any issues with PCI or AGP or PCIE for that matter, the problem is that you won't find a driver for a Nvidia 8800 card so easily... as for ISA graphic cards, if you need VGA then I advice a Trident 8900 card or the like...

If there's no PCI issues, I wonder if the OP would be better off going for a PCI video card (say a Matrox) than trying to track down drivers for an ISA card.

That said there are sites on the net where you look for a if lucky download drivers. Driversguide.com is one I've used - you have to register but can download the drivers for free (within limits).

 

[Jadzia]

Well like I said, on my old cyrix system, the PCI graphics card (S3 Verge) worked fine with Win3.11. Now I might just have been lucky there.

And on a 200MHz system, the boot time for 3.11 was literally 5 seconds after the self-test had done. Never had a boot so quick!

 

[Santaman]

Virges, Trio64's and most other older S3 cards run fine with 3.11 even AGP ones, as for VESA cards, S3 and Tridents will work fine, also Cirres Logic cards drivers for those you only need the drivers which will be available online somewhere

If the OP would shed some light on what he really wants and needs and why then we might be able to give better advice..

 

[scotthm]

Jadzia, yeah, but the OP specifically stated that ISA was a requirement.

It doesn't read that way to me

He wants 2x ISA only for the not-yet-owned ISA sound and graphics cards, believing these to be necessary for 3.11 compatibility. I believe OP is more interested in A/V compatibility, not specifically ISA.

If you just want to run a 3.11 machine, and don't care about specific hardware compatibility, a VM (either MS or VMWare) might be a good choice.

---------------

 

[Noname Given]

Going to build a computer that runs 6.22/3.11 and I want to know what the best possible hardware I can get that has at least 2 ISA slows (one for video card and sound card). So what is the best possible hardware I can get? Here are some of my thoughts, feel free to add your input. Both my sound card and video card need to be compatible and have good driver support for Windows 3.11.

Motherboard: ??? - No idea what the top of the line MB was back then, want to find one that supports at least 64MB
Sound Card: Sound Blaster AWE32
Video Card: Matrox - not sure which model but wasnt this the top of the line company for video cards back then?
Processor - Maybe a PII?

IF you can actually find the requisite parts in working order, I'd be HIGHLY surprised.

 

[Brolan]

This isn't to play old games, is it? If it is use a modern computer and run the games in DOSBox.