Evidence of SNW being a possible alternate timeline from TOS

[HotRod]

Exteriorly, no. Jefferies designed it that way intentionally, it had nothing to do with limitations.

Sure. It's still very much a product of the 60s. It's a wooden model with some spinning bits in the engines. Jefferies still had to work within the limitations of the era.

 

[BillJ]

I actually see it the opposite way.

Treating the SNW Enterprise as the TOS Enterprise isn't about conformity, it's about preserving the original creative intent. The TOS Enterprise looked the way it did because of the limitations of 1960s television production. SNW isn't replacing that design with something safer or more conventional, it's using modern tools to visualize the same ship and the same world in greater detail.

And that's coming from someone who absolutely adores the original Enterprise. It's my favourite version of the ship. I love everything about it, but I can love that design while also acknowledging that it's very much a product of the 1960s. The painted backdrops, blinking lights, and plywood sets were never the point. They were the best tools available to convey a futuristic world to the audience of the time.

If anything, insisting that every button, corridor, and visual effect must remain frozen exactly as they appeared in 1966 seems more restrictive. The imagination was always there. We just have better ways to represent it now. To me, SNW isn't replacing the Enterprise I grew up loving. It's simply presenting that same ship through a modern production lens, much as TOS itself would have done had it been produced today.

Just saddens me how easily they throw things away.

 

[TRON JA307020]

I still think the best door for future writers to make Kurtzman Trek and alternate universe is Tomorrow and Tomorrow. It would make SNW, STD and yes SFA part of their own universe. In the future someone can continue it if Year One doesn't happen. As for the Prime time line. I would move it a few decades into the 25th and have an entirely new crew. That could be in a movie or series. But something that just isn't bogged down by previous trek. I also really want to see some deep space exploration. Things that can't be easily solved and explained. Since it's the 25th century we could have a ship much further out than any ship before. It would be fun to see if the writers can come up with some new strange aliens and crazy phenomenon.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Just saddens me how easily they throw things away.

 

[HotRod]

I still think the best door for future writers to make Kurtzman Trek and alternate universe is Tomorrow and Tomorrow.

Why? We've already established that Berman era Trek places the Eugenics Wars in the 21st century. If you want to be pedantic and use the altered dates as proof of an alternate universe, at least be consistent.

Everything that uses 1996 for the Eugenics Wars is one timeline. Everything that places them in the 21st century is another. That puts TOS and The Wrath of Khan in one universe, and pretty much everything else in another.

Or you can just accept that the timeline has been altered dozens of times in multiple different ways, yet the universe still manages to sort itself out.

It would make SNW, STD and yes SFA part of their own universe.

And TNG, DS9, Voyager, Enterprise, Lower Decks, Picard, and Prodigy.

 

[fireproof78]

still think the best door for future writers to make Kurtzman Trek and alternate universe is Tomorrow and Tomorrow.

Timeline has already been altered since TNG.

 

[TRON JA307020]

Timeline has already been altered since TNG.

You mean Tasha?

 

[fireproof78]

You mean Tasha?

I mean World Wars 3/Eugenics Wars becoming an atomic exchange.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Timeline has already been altered since TNG.

TOS couldn't find the date if it was painted on the side of a barn.

 

[F. King Daniel]

It didnt have to be frozen but they could have gotten things like the bridge size and viewscreen correct. Basically a smaller bridge size and stations that correlatee to the cage or tos. Regular viewscreen similar to the cage which actually looked like a more primitive version of the D viewscreen. The winky blinkies where they should be. No more neon style LEDs lighting the bridge everywhere. Somehow kurtzman trek kept those stupid things from the 23rd, 24th, 25th abd 32nd centuries. Give the bridges a proper warm lighting. I couldn't stand those strips.

Why on earth would they want a tiny television-sized viewscreen when we get so many amazing shots with the huge ones we've had since 2009?

The rest is personal preference but I doubt there is a director on the planet who would want a 40" screen on the front of the bridge when we have the technology we do today.

 

[Hellbird]

Im not saying everything has to be perfect. But before kurtzman Trek things made more sense. Technology advancement was more clearly defined. You could clearly see the advancements from STE, TOS to the TOS movies to TNG. In Kurtzman Trek the tech all seems blurred. The characterizations of characters were for the most part consistent pre Kurtzman. In Kurtzman Trek even Picard didn't seem like himself. He no longer had that commanding presence even when he was in charge. Maybe it was age but even his outlook on starfleet had soured. No optimism left in him. Just felt really off. Season 3 was better but it was too late. They really shouldn't have given Patrick what he wanted. I really just wish the would hsve set a series just a few years past the late 24th early 25th centuries and created a whole new crew and ship. Basically like they did for tng.

Maybe one day, finally.

 

[Takeru]

Just saddens me how easily they throw things away.

By changing the look they are actually preserving the spirit of TOS.

The goal of TOS was to show a futuristic, highly advanced ship and they did it through the lens of 60s technology and aesthetics. If a show today is set on the same ship in the same time period the look has to be updated to get the same "futuristic, highly advanced ship" point across, the old look cannot be preserved because it now looks retro and that goes against everything TOS wanted to be.

And for other inconsistencies? I said it before and I'll say it again, TOS didn't even manage to stay consistent with itself, so who cares? It's all made up anyway.

 

[Spike730]

The writers said it's the same timeline so it's the same timeline. No ifs, and or buts.

True, but at least as far as I’m concerned, they failed to make it feel that way. I could enjoy the show more if I weren’t constantly pulled out of it by moments like, “But that doesn’t really fit with TOS.”

Like the whole Gorn thing. Yes, TPTB have offered an explanation for how they think it doesn’t contradict TOS, but in my opinion, it was far from convincing. These shoehorned explanations feel a bit insulting.

It also doesn't help that some episodes feel like remakes of TOS episodes, just with a new twist.

They moved Discovery into the future to get rid of the constraints of canon, and then, in my opinion, they make the same mistake all over again with SNW.

 

[Spike730]

nothing we really saw in Discovery or Strange New Worlds was more advanced than what was seen later on chronological.

I don’t know, but the idea of masquerading as aliens using an injection—or having the transporter somehow generate the correct alien outfits during the beaming process—felt more advanced to me.

 

[Mudd]

Sorry, I consider the SNW bridge to be one of the best in the entire franchise and that's a hill I'm willing to die on. I think it's gorgeous, functional and I really wouldn't change a thing.

Absolutely Right.™

Please stop expecting Trek to go back to the plywood donut. Last time, really, was over twenty years ago. And people bitched about the round railings.

And I've gotten used to the SNW Enterprise exterior as Kirk's Enterprise. No problem at all.

 

[camdudetenger2018]

Books and Comics don’t count. I’ve forgotten most of the plots of the comics and novels. Except that one with Steve the Vulcan.

also known as the off screen verisons

 

[Dar70]

I don't see why the get so hung up on it having to be the Prime timeline. The nice thing with ST09 was a separate timeline allows new fresh stories. By shoehorning yourself into the Prime timeline you're putting yourself into a corner that doesn't allow much if any risk. All the characters from TOS will survive because they are destined to survive. Imagine how much better SNW would be if we didn't know that the future holds for our characters. A Pike that isn't destined as a mute cripple in a chair, a Kirk that isn't destined to be captain of the Enterprise. They teased us with that at the end of Season 1 and that had the potential for so much more interesting storytelling.

Right. But you know they could have made a SNW with ALL different characters retaining Spock, Pike and Number One...but they ended up stretching believability my putting most of the TOS characters in there. We know all their fates. We know Pikes Fate. There are like three characters we have zero clue about. Also Lann didn't have to be Khan's Ancestor.
The show could have been so much better in this regard. But once again they dropped the ball. Not sure if they did it thinking they would get TOS fans on board. But they didn't have to do that. People would have been on board for it with all new and characters form the original pilot. Lieutenant Tyler, Yeoman colt, Dr. Boyce, Transporter Chief Pitcairn but they didn't.

Lost opportunities.

I just hope the next Star Trek is completely seperated from ANYTHING made before. I don't ever want to see any legacy characters ever again. At least Disco had mostly new characters. They screwed up a lot as well but I could appreciate that at least the characters were mostly new. Though Michael didn't have to be Spocks sister. Again we don't need all these connections to TOS that stretch credibility.

I just hope we get a clean slate if they are determined to continue the franchise. If they don't make new Trek before I die I would be happy about that as well.

 

[The Wormhole]

i recall once In A Mirror Darkly came out the complaining stopped or slowed a lot.

Then you have very different memories than I, as I recall after that episode aired there were very vocal complaints about them faithfully recreating the TOS aesthetic and expecting us to believe it was more advanced than what we'd been seeing on Enterprise "when it clearly isn't." We even had a thread in our own Enterprise forum back in the day of people wishing they had created an updated 23rd century look which took real world technological development and what was seen in Enterprise's 22nd century into account and made it look "more properly advanced."

And yes, there were even those who tried saying the fact that In a Mirror Darkly was trying to present 1960s aesthetics as futuristic as being the ultimate proof Enterprise was in an alternate timeline. Rinse and repeat, all this has happened before it will happen again.

 

[Firebird]

Then you have very different memories than I, as I recall after that episode aired there were very vocal complaints about them faithfully recreating the TOS aesthetic and expecting us to believe it was more advanced than what we'd been seeing on Enterprise "when it clearly isn't." We even had a thread in our own Enterprise forum back in the day of people wishing they had created an updated 23rd century look which took real world technological development and what was seen in Enterprise's 22nd century into account and made it look "more properly advanced."

And yes, there were even those who tried saying the fact that In a Mirror Darkly was trying to present 1960s aesthetics as futuristic as being the ultimate proof Enterprise was in an alternate timeline. Rinse and repeat, all this has happened before it will happen again.

Well, that’s not fair bringing facts into the discussion!

 

[The Wormhole]

I know, I know. Just what was I thinking?